was music discovered or invented?

[cron]

One thing of note is that, though intervals around the world are completely different, they all have the octave in common.

[ericj23]

nuffink - the greeks discovered a number of modes derived from mathemtical models - one of which became the western major scale

they also "discovered" the ones that are present in both indian and chinese music

but i beleive both of those forms have rather different approaches to harmony (in the sense of what notes are appropriate to follow each other and not just within the scale) to western music. These approaches have nothing to do with the greeks and are what makes them sound so "alien" to us hamburger heads

[nuffink]

nuffink - the greeks discovered a number of modes derived from mathemtical models - one of which became the western major scale

they also "discovered" the ones that are present in both indian and chinese music

but i beleive both of those forms have rather different approaches to harmony (in the sense of what notes are appropriate to follow each other and not just within the scale) to western music. These approaches have nothing to do with the greeks and are what makes them sound so "alien" to us hamburger heads

eric,

There's a vast history of music from around the world that doesn't rely on harmony whatsoever.

[Sepheritoh]

If the big bang in the beginning had any music possibilities vurt would have sampled it.

[pheeleep]

I think that an appreciation of the sounds nature provides inspired people to make music themselves and create instruments.. to make melodies... imitate what nature was producing ( birds singing for example )

As far as rythm is concerned, I don't know.. someone started banging on something and thought it sounded cool?

...

[amoebe]

But it did, didn't it?

[ericj23]

There's a vast history of music from around the world that doesn't rely on harmony whatsoever.

hmm so there are no different notes - thats as they say complete cobblers - sure there is plenty of rhythmic stuff but it all contains different notes -

what you mean is that there is loads of stuff with no formal reliance on a rigid ideal regarding harmony - by harmony i mean why a certain sound should sound different to the next

my reply was to point out that the greeks did not just "discover" western music but a number of harmonic modes that can be found in cultures around the world - and worryingly they are all derived from maths

but personally people have been grunting and bashing things from the times before they could speak and i suspect the early history was remembered entirely as songs - so music has existed from before our history and actually helped our history to exist

[nuffink]

There's a vast history of music from around the world that doesn't rely on harmony whatsoever.

hmm so there are no different notes - thats as they say complete cobblers - sure there is plenty of rhythmic stuff but it all contains different notes -

what you mean is that there is loads of stuff with no formal reliance on a rigid ideal regarding harmony - by harmony i mean why a certain sound should sound different to the next

my reply was to point out that the greeks did not just "discover" western music but a number of harmonic modes that can be found in cultures around the world - and worryingly they are all derived from maths

but personally people have been grunting and bashing things from the times before they could speak and i suspect the early history was remembered entirely as songs - so music has existed from before our history and actually helped our history to exist

I'm sorry I've read that through a few times and it still makes no sense. There are great traditions of purely melodic music around the world. You seem to be confusing harmony with "different notes".

[Sepheritoh]

History of man was told through song even before they could write

"Learn now the lore of living creatures
first name the four, the free people..."

[tony tony chopper]

basically is it natural or man made?

don't birds do music?


anyway, music is too mathematical to be man-centred

[vurt]

music is a "lifeform" of its own,it breeds itself through others is all,we happen to be good breeding ground for music,as are many other plants and animals on our planet.
sod of with everything follows this scale no it doesnt

[tony tony chopper]

as are many other plants

only when you smoke them

[vurt]

as are many other plants

only when you smoke them

nope some plants in fact most do resonate at frequencys beyond our hearing
music is everywhere,just depends how you define it

altho the smokey plants help you appreciate the other bits

[ericj23]

harmony is entirely about different notes

or rather why when a sound changes, which it enevitably does becuase otherwise it's boring, it should change to another particular sound - i.e. the realtionship between sounds.

All i said was that music exists where the sense of harmony used is not rigid or necessarily even pre-meditated, but that is it's own form of harmony

the rest of the post regarding the greek "discovery" of scales used throughout the world is so obvious and is such a clear rebuttal of your earlier statement regarding the fundaments of western music that i will just assume that you didn't comment on that in order to make yourself feel better

[VitaminD]

basic sound, rhythm, and melody were discovered imo

I think putting these things together to form music is an invention



for animals, I think its more of a hitting frequency they enjoy than a specific set of tones or a rhythm.. though I could be wrong.. its just a guess kind of like a dog whistle..