was music discovered or invented?

[vurt]

as my last sentence said,depends on how you define music

I'd define music as sound which is designed to be heard aesthetically.

but by whom?
are you the only judge in the world of aesthetics?
am i?are humans?
im not having a go,i just offer my beleifs of the origins of "music"
if were looking for the origins of man made music then its different obviously as our history is much shorter than that of sound.but before us there were aesthetic sounds surely?
as already stated a bird sings for procreation therefore a deliberate attempt at aesthetics wouldnt you say?
but as i said if were looking at man made music only then of course it was 196something when the beatles released sergeant peppers

[nuffink]

It was discoverered, a long time ago, that the human mind likes some combinations of tones better than other. It is claimed Pythagoras did that discovery. It is discovered, about a year ago, that the human mind very much dislikes specific cords and note or tone progressions.
It is invented how to build music from those 'soothing' and sometimes not so 'soothing' cords and tone pogressions.

Again, you're confusing western music with music.

this is your point that i am disagreeing with - phythagorus is the greek i am referring too - the greek scales/modes are not the root of just western music

I'm well aware of the pythagorean modes. Are you seriously suggesting that Indian and Chinese music (who's musical traditions predate Homer never mind Pythagorus) are rooted in ancient Greek maths?
Are you also suggesting that pre-hellenic cultures had no music?
And how about native American and Australasian music? Also Greek based?

[funkynuts]

if were looking for the origins of man made music then its different obviously as our history is much shorter than that of sound.but before us there were aesthetic sounds surely?

Ah but if a tree falls in the woods and no-one is there to hear it,how do we know it won,t sound like a moog

[opiadream]

music was invented by a humble cave-man named 'mongo' who discovered that by pulling on the piece of tendon stuck in his teeth with one hand,and plucking it with his other hand,different notes could be heard.
for the longest time this invention was simply known as 'grunt,grunt,uuh uh uh' while pointing at ones teeth.

[cron]

as my last sentence said,depends on how you define music

I'd define music as sound which is designed to be heard aesthetically.

but by whom?
are you the only judge in the world of aesthetics?
am i?are humans?
im not having a go,i just offer my beleifs of the origins of "music"
if were looking for the origins of man made music then its different obviously as our history is much shorter than that of sound.but before us there were aesthetic sounds surely?
as already stated a bird sings for procreation therefore a deliberate attempt at aesthetics wouldnt you say?
but as i said if were looking at man made music only then of course it was 196something when the beatles released sergeant peppers

Hrrm, maybe I should have said sound which is heard aesthetically, rather than sound which is designed to be heard aesthetically.

I certainly wasn't saying that I'm the only judge of aesthetics, quite the opposite. Rather that if the creator calls their work music, it's music. Kind stepped on my own toes with that one, cos I make a lot of sound that's designed to be heard aesthetically, but isn't music. More sound art than anything else, especially the interactive stuff.

As for birds, well, maybe all that 'singing' IS the equivalent of putting Barry White on the stereo to them. And hey, if you hear it with your aesthetic ears on, you're listening to music.

[tony tony chopper]

As man was more primitive, he just banged on shit; then the concepts of melody came to man as he developed

birds where there before man - you can bet that man was imitating birds singing. In fact, don't underestimate the animal reign, so many things of what man did or learnt was by looking at animals.

[nuisance sonore]

Ah but if a tree falls in the woods and noone is there to hear it,how do we know it won,t sound like a moog

Now who's doing quantum physic?

[cptgone]

Topic: was music discovered or invented?

It was stolen from me! Damn mortals.

[vurt]

if were looking for the origins of man made music then its different obviously as our history is much shorter than that of sound.but before us there were aesthetic sounds surely?

Ah but if a tree falls in the woods and no-one is there to hear it,how do we know it won,t sound like a moog

but the point is that forest is full of beetles who do appreciate the sound of a tree falling i just need to know whether were doin recent or full history of music and yes im wasted

[funkynuts]

Ah but if a tree falls in the woods and noone is there to hear it,how do we know it won,t sound like a moog

Now who's doing quantum physic?

Nah man Zen Luddism

[The Chase]

As man was more primitive, he just banged on shit; then the concepts of melody came to man as he developed

birds where there before man - you can bet that man was imitating birds singing.

Are you saying that you have had a particular bird's chirp stuck in your head? Do you see an owl and then say "Ooo, Ooo" for the rest of the day?

In fact, don't underestimate the animal reign, so many things of what man did or learnt was by looking at animals.

Duh. I'd say the majority by a far region of our "inventions" were derived frm nature.

[thisdude]

What an interesting question... The phenomenon of sound has always been there, but our disection and understanding of it (discovery) lead to the inventions of scale and harmony (organization). Our ears are trained to like what we hear, in the same way the atonal grunts of a Papua New Guinea tribesman is considered music to him. Who's right? We are... we got bigger guns.

I read somewhere that music was thought to have played an important part of our own evolution. Cavemom would call out to the pasture a# g d a#-g "cave-boy, come ho-ome" and indeed, many Asian languages have words in which the inflection and tone of a syllable drastically changes the meaning of the word. Tonal preferences in what was heard became localized the same way that spoken accents were. So really, what you consider music depends on what you were raised into liking... an invention of the organization of a discovery.

[putte]

.. music just happens, and ever did ..

[tony tony chopper]

Are you saying that you have had a particular bird's chirp stuck in your head? Do you see an owl and then say "Ooo, Ooo" for the rest of the day?

here around birds make real melodies. Yes, things you could play with a keyboard. Very short & repetitive, though.
Let's say that birds make loops then.

[SaviorNeeded]

I swear, one could replace the word "music" throughout this thread with the word "morals" and end up with the same never-ending discussions we all go through in college. Because of those discussions, some became convinced there are no morals.

There is no music, then--if you believe that sort of arguement. Of course, if there ever were, Britney Spears killed it.

The whole Greek thing reminds me of "Donald in Mathamagic Land." Anyone see that? One of Disney's best animtions.

The real answer is, music is a fundamental part of the universe; it lives within and without us. We just put the toy blocks together like babies.

Tom