The Dire State of Guitar Amp Sims

[paramita123]

Why have we started moving to ITB production and mixing 20 years ago yet most guitar amp sims still live in the hardware setup past?
From skeuomorphic designs placing more emphasis on graphics trying to look like the real thing, with polished 3D cables and realistic-looking amps and cabs images that do nothing to the sound, to an utter lack of modern controls for the digital age.

So today I am trying to use my modulation pedal , a MIDI pedal, to control some of my amp sims to modulate the sound from a verse to a chorus. And yet that is incredibly difficult. Many amp sims DO NOT HAVE MIDI LEARN.
How can you have ANY PLUGIN in 2025 without MIDI learn ?! Everyone has controllers with knobs and faders. Everything should easily be assignable.
Take TONEX FX for example, lauded for its sounds, yet zero MIDI implementation.
So we can move multiple virtual mics in imaginary space to fuss endlessly over tiny tone changes but we cannot link a good old foot pedal to control gain??

Now some do have MIDI learn, BUT.
- Ampbox has a terrible UX, once assigned, cannot modify the range, only delete and redo. Seems to assign only one controller at once.
- BIAS FX2 has an easy MIDI Learn setup, but it is impossible to control the range or revert it ! Come on, from verse to chorus, for example distortion going up from 5 to 11 and delay going from 6 to 0. One controller pedal to rule them all. This is MIDI, it is old technology and should be really easy to implement !
- this type of controller information can be compressed, modulated, etc.. there is no reason not to make those simple yet powerful functions built-in, a flanger has an LFO, why not have overall LFOs to control distortion for example. Amp followers to modulate chorus depth, whatever you imagine, sound can be shaped with modulators in software in conjunction with hardware controllers.
- even if skeuomorphic design has its appeal, it is not contradictory with using modern visualisers, eg a compressor pedal can show Gain Reduction, an EQ could open a curve, every part of the software could have an advanced/modern mode to offer further controls

Then obviously you have to fight through the DAW and controller, not all plugins and DAWs make it equally easy to link things together, particularly when going through a keyboard's control jack modulation input.
I am on Cubase 14 Pro and the Remote Control / Quick Control UX is not the most intuitive to say the least.

Overall there is :
1- a real lack of thorough implementation of modern digital features on many current amp sims (I have not tried them all, I think Neural DSP is showing some more modern design)

2- a market gap for affordable modern MIDI / USB foot controllers that are dedicated for studio DAW controls. Not talking about the classic floor controllers with switches. But controllers that could let guitar players have hands off to control play record states, have pedals to control VSTis or FX, perhaps even next generation controllers like the Touche but for the feet. A wah pedal is only 1D. I am surprised I haven't yet seen 2D or 3D pedals opening more possibilities for the studio or live. Switches are great but surely there must be other players who'd enjoy some multidimensional footplay

I've seen steps towards this, but I think in this crowded market it's really time for software and hardware manufacturers to show some real thought going beyond the classic hardware stack type.
I'm only a very passionate amateur, I might have missed things, or if I got things wrong I'll be happy to hear your thoughts.

[zerocrossing]

Well, the truth is, most guitarists are about a day or two getting used to standing upright and find things like "the wheel" confusing and mysterious.

At this point I use Amplitube 5 Max the most, Native Instruments Guitar Rig and Helix Native on occasion, and all of those sound fantastic, have everything you're looking for, though Amplitube does use a skeuomorphic design style and while I do like the look at it, the fact that I have to look at a screen full of Vox inspired grill cloth graphic is plain and simply stupid. If I were king, I'd rework the UI so that you'd have your pedal board on top in a strip, amp next, then cab controls, and then post amp effects. Basically a more skeuomorphic version of Guitar Rig would be perfect for me. Call me old fashioned, but I do like having a somewhat photo realistic representation of something, because I've grown up with all the gear that's modeled so when I see it I know what to expect at a glance.

[zerocrossing]

A wah pedal is only 1D. I am surprised I haven't yet seen 2D or 3D pedals opening more possibilities for the studio or live. Switches are great but surely there must be other players who'd enjoy some multidimensional footplay

I've got one of these.

https://dbinstrumentamp.com/products/4e ... ion-pedal/

It's good, but to be honest, I don't use it all that much, as I'm split between synth playing and guitar. PM me if you're interested. I could save you some time waiting and money.

[paramita123]

Well, the truth is, most guitarists are about a day or two getting used to standing upright and find things like "the wheel" confusing and mysterious.

At this point I use Amplitube 5 Max the most, Native Instruments Guitar Rig and Helix Native on occasion, and all of those sound fantastic, have everything you're looking for, though Amplitube does use a skeuomorphic design style and while I do like the look at it, the fact that I have to look at a screen full of Vox inspired grill cloth graphic is plain and simply stupid. If I were king, I'd rework the UI so that you'd have your pedal board on top in a strip, amp next, then cab controls, and then post amp effects. Basically a more skeuomorphic version of Guitar Rig would be perfect for me. Call me old fashioned, but I do like having a somewhat photo realistic representation of something, because I've grown up with all the gear that's modeled so when I see it I know what to expect at a glance.

I wish you were king
Aside from the skeuomorphic issue, I wish there was better MIDI and further modulation controls. I don't believe all guitar players are only satisfied with hardware-mindset tone-tweaking.

[sandandpaint]

https://www.bluecataudio.com/Products/Product_ReGuitar/
and
https://www.bluecataudio.com/Products/Product_Axiom/
have all the functionality and MIDI but also the hideous skeumorphic design. You might be able to fix that tho as blue cat have an interface design package built in as well

also https://klevgrand.com/products/stark which has the advantage of Klevgrand's visual style but parameters are only exposed to the DAW automation, no midi learn (I only tested this on reamp)

[zerocrossing]

Well, the truth is, most guitarists are about a day or two getting used to standing upright and find things like "the wheel" confusing and mysterious.

At this point I use Amplitube 5 Max the most, Native Instruments Guitar Rig and Helix Native on occasion, and all of those sound fantastic, have everything you're looking for, though Amplitube does use a skeuomorphic design style and while I do like the look at it, the fact that I have to look at a screen full of Vox inspired grill cloth graphic is plain and simply stupid. If I were king, I'd rework the UI so that you'd have your pedal board on top in a strip, amp next, then cab controls, and then post amp effects. Basically a more skeuomorphic version of Guitar Rig would be perfect for me. Call me old fashioned, but I do like having a somewhat photo realistic representation of something, because I've grown up with all the gear that's modeled so when I see it I know what to expect at a glance.

I wish you were king
Aside from the skeuomorphic issue, I wish there was better MIDI and further modulation controls. I don't believe all guitar players are only satisfied with hardware-mindset tone-tweaking.

Have you tried Guitar Rig 7? The older models are not great, but the newer ECM (some proprietary machine learning amp capture modeling technology) models are good. There's a bunch of modulation modules, crossovers, full MIDI learn, etc. It's definitely not my go-to for traditional amp sounds, but for experimental stuff, it's the best thing out there. The interface is really good too. Very clear and easy to use.

[zerocrossing]

https://www.bluecataudio.com/Products/Product_ReGuitar/
and
https://www.bluecataudio.com/Products/Product_Axiom/
have all the functionality and MIDI but also the hideous skeumorphic design. You might be able to fix that tho as blue cat have an interface design package built in as well

I found Axiom to be the one of the worst amp sim/effects plugin of all time. I'm fine with lots to tweak. I used a Kemper Amp Profiler and an AxeFX 3 for years, but Axiom seemed to never provide a good sound no matter what. Shame, as it's right up my ally. You can add Melda's guitar amp modeler to that too, though someone said they added the NAM to it and maybe it's better now.

[sandandpaint]

https://www.bluecataudio.com/Products/Product_ReGuitar/
and
https://www.bluecataudio.com/Products/Product_Axiom/
have all the functionality and MIDI but also the hideous skeumorphic design. You might be able to fix that tho as blue cat have an interface design package built in as well

I found Axiom to be the one of the worst amp sim/effects plugin of all time. I'm fine with lots to tweak. I used a Kemper Amp Profiler and an AxeFX 3 for years, but Axiom seemed to never provide a good sound no matter what. Shame, as it's right up my ally. You can add Melda's guitar amp modeler to that too, though someone said they added the NAM to it and maybe it's better now.

I'm never wanting to reproduce an actual guitar amp so I tend to use nothing other than fx as I would with any other input. In other words I am the wrong person to talk about accurate amp sims. I do use their re-guitar sometimes. Axiom can hold any vstfx as well - like a lot of the blue cat plugins. So you could just have guitar going into Axiom and use any IR then something from zynaptiq etc

[jamcat]

I clicked on this thinking I was going to get tips on the Money For Nothing tone.

[imrae]

How can you have ANY PLUGIN in 2025 without MIDI learn ?!

This should be the DAW's job? If you can't map MIDI to automation then the problem is somewhere between the DAW and the user.

On REAPER or Bitwig I find it more convenient to use the DAW mapping than to learn every plugin's own MIDI control system.

[paramita123]

I haven't tried BlueCat sims but they look awful to me, I cannot imagine using them.

And I already have five or six amp sims, some paid some free, I don't want more, I want them to have full functionality :
Midi learn and parameter automation, high tweakability, combination of skeuomorphic and modern digital features.

The DAW should be able to help assign easily, but in Cubase it feels really convoluted to me. The Remote Control and QC UX is unintuitive and window sensitive, a real pain.

The final part of my post is to suggest new hardware development for dedicated studio foot controllers. There's been much progress for keys but not much for guitars.

[paramita123]

In pictures for those who don't like to read too much.

Neural DSP Rabea :
For the GUI part, WAY too large graphic and small fonts for the important controls.
Devs, we don't just use one plugin, please don't take all our screen for your images.
OR give us 2 UIs, one pretty, one focused.

a1.jpg

For MIDI :
Easy to assign. Can be changed once assigned.
No range control, no revert.

a2.jpg

>
>
AMPLITUBE :
Very nice sounds. Terrible waste of UI space. Terrible skeuomorphic implementation.
Big stuff should be small, small stuff should be big. Too much clicking in an out of sections.
Easy to assign a MIDI controller.
No range control, no revert.

a3.jpg

>
>
NI GUITAR RIG 7
Slightly more modern UI. Less skeuosilly. Has amp follower and other great tools.
Big stuff should be small, small stuff should be big. Too much clicking in an out of sections.
Easy to assign a MIDI controller.
No range control, no revert.

a4.jpg

>
>
BIAS FX2
Great sounds, nice UI.
Still too skeuomorphic, fake cables etc.. no modern visualisers nor LFOs, amp envelopes etc..
Easy to assign a MIDI controller.
No range control, no revert.

a5.jpg

>
>
MERCURIALL AMPBOX
Still too large an UI. Great sounds.
The best MIDI implementation of all as it has a range, yay !
But once assigned, cannot modify .. have to delete and start again. And no revert. No multiple parameters with one CC. Duh .... Good but bad !

a6.jpg

>
>
I hope it is clearer now that there is a lot of work to improve the amp sims GUIs, but more effective in terms of sound control with our controller keyboards/pedals.
I would encourage product devs to provide 2 UIs, the hardware looking one, and a more modern/advanced one. Collect data or ask users which they prefer.
We get so much awesome progress for keys and synths, some of it can ripple down to guitars.

[DoktorTenma]

To control any of your existing amp sims via midi you can load them into Blue Cat's PatchWork. You can then create macro controls to control one or more parameters and have Min/Max values for each parameter. These macro controls can be controlled by midi.

[paramita123]

To control any of your existing amp sims via midi you can load them into Blue Cat's PatchWork. You can then create macro controls to control one or more parameters and have Min/Max values for each parameter. These macro controls can be controlled by midi.

BRILLIANT ! You sorted me out !

BUT BUT BUT EVERYONE NOTICE, NO NEED TO BUY the above software.

First do try the free Waves StudioRack / StudioVerse plugin, I already used it for lots of custom plugin chains as it can turn any vst3 plugin into multiband and parallel, which is already super powerful.
But thanks to your tip and the $99 price tag I was like no way, then thought to check out StudioRack, and the Macros can do this perfectly !!
Check this out, the Rockrack which did not have MIDI Learn can now do it!
AND on top of that it can control multiple parameters with ONE macro, AND with range and reverse !! Means I can use my pedal to morph progressively between my verse and chorus sounds.
SO happy !

a7.jpg

Thanks Waves for that awesome FREE plugin !!

[Funkybot's Evil Twin]

Wait until you find out your DAW probably has a native learn feature that will assign MIDI controllers to automation parameters!