Software vs Hardware

[BONES]

When you have 40k+ presets in Nexus, Ominsphere, Arturia V collection, will you really sit down and start designing a preset from scratch for hours? Is it not easier to find a preset you like designed by a professional, tweak it or layer it with another sound if you have to?

No, it is often much easier and faster to make it yourself from scratch. It's easy to spend half-a-day trying to find one preset amongst thousands. I remember sitting down with Hive 2, going through the presets and tagging any I thought might be useful. After two evenings I'd only got about half-way through the factory bank, and I was bored out of my skull, so I gave up.

[sin night]

Going through tons of presets doesn't work for me. Other people may enjoy it and get their results by working in a different way from what I would do... there's no right or wrong.

In my opinion, presets can be useful as a starting point, maybe to get an idea of what a tool can do / get a different perspective compared to what I'd usually do... I may like a few presets and tag them as favourites, but then I often make my own from scratch or heavily tweak a preset (so much it ends up being a starting point to get something else, something quite different). My synths are often relatively simple, so it's not that difficult to make a sound in a relatively short amount of time... and then I sound just like myself (it's not always a positive thing, depending on your goals).

It's not something I use much, but your mileage may definitely vary.


Speaking of layering, it's a useful technique / way of thinking. I'm not a fan of layering presets (I'm not a fan of presets in general), but different layers can be used for different purposes or to combine different kind of tones, for example the attack vs the sustain portion, or to divide a sound into mono and stereo components.
I don't use it enough...

[mambo888]

I don't have or want any of those synths. Your assertion has holes in it on so many levels.
1. Layering is for those that can't program synths properly. No need for it whatsoever - maybe the fact you use presets so much is why your sounds are so thin?
2. Yes I might sit for hours designing a preset. For me that's fun, though obvs not for you - see how everyone has completely different aims and modus operandi?
3.Touchscreen is utterly unsuitable for me.
4. Mouse is utterly unsuitable for me.

The idea is to move on from tweaking synths and start actually making music, record it and replay it any time you want. That is better handled in the DAW + midi controller. At some point you have to stop fussing about sound quality, authenticity, warmth, emotional connection and make a commitment to start actually making music with what you have. If your music sucks accept that it is you, not the gear and learn to like your own music style. Stop being hard on yourself and enjoy your hobby, learn to have fun.

No the idea is not necessarily to move on and make music. For me the actual process of diddling around with sound might be the aim. My fun is more often in the actual process than the end result. You assume your aims are the same for everyone - no, they're not. I used to argue endlessly with Bones, but don't nowadays. I understand what his aims/methods are and hopefully he understands mine - we'll never have the same aims/methods and no point whatsoever trying to prove either is right. His are not right for me, mine are not right for him. Actually Bones knows that. Many of you completely miss his humour - I suspect Bones has his tongue in his cheek most of the time, just that his delivery doesn't necessarily give that impression. He's just told us he's an idiot, so let's accept that. We're all idiots spending time on this, aren't we?

Then you are a sound designer in your heart. Which is ok, we are not all the same and want the same thing.

I didn't assert anything I made a comment on the forum offering my opinion. My sounds are not thin or thick, they are the right sounds for the mix.

I was maybe thinking out loud, but I realized through this conversation that my passion leans towards playing music rather than creating new presets from scratch, over the last two years I have found the synths and the sounds I'm looking for and I'm no longer in the need to adjust the punch on the kick or snare endlessly. I'm actually very happy with this realization.

One thing I really wanted is a keybed with polyphonic aftertouch but apart from that I'm not missing anything controller-wise. But that's just me I agree I'm not a sound designer and don't want to be when there are so many talented people out there creating presets. When I get hold of a preset pack it feels like I am collaborating with the person who created the preset by putting it in the context of a musical idea.

[IvyBirds]

I don't have or want any of those synths. Your assertion has holes in it on so many levels.
1. Layering is for those that can't program synths properly. No need for it whatsoever - maybe the fact you use presets so much is why your sounds are so thin?
2. Yes I might sit for hours designing a preset. For me that's fun, though obvs not for you - see how everyone has completely different aims and modus operandi?

If you sit for hours programming Synths and don't understand the power of layers of sound in a single patch just wow

Even many acoustic instruments like a piano are actually layered sounds making up a single timbre

[El°HYM]

Paint.

[El°HYM]

Man, I have been pouring vegan ketchup on me cauliflower steak for Ages.

My point was that we all have because it's made from tomatoes which, last time I looked, were not meat. It's like vegan lettuce or vegan potatoes.

I have extra Stickers to put on those not being labeled as Vegan.

[whyterabbyt]

My point was that we all have because it's made from tomatoes which, last time I looked, were not meat.

Are you claiming that 'made from tomatoes' means 'only made from tomatoes' then?

Because 'its got some fruit or veg in it' isnt actually a synonym for 'vegan'.

Believe it or not, tomato ketchup has more than one ingredient in it. Yup, it is also made from stuff that isnt tomatoes. Like sugar.

And sugar isnt necessarily vegan, because the refining methods for sugar can include the use of animal bones.

That's why some makes of tomato ketchup are vegan and others arent.

You're welcome.

[Uncle E]

Plus, if it has natural food coloring, that's probably Cochineals.

[zerocrossing]

Man, I have been pouring vegan ketchup on me cauliflower steak for Ages.

My point was that we all have because it's made from tomatoes which, last time I looked, were not meat. It's like vegan lettuce or vegan potatoes.

I have extra Stickers to put on those not being labeled as Vegan.

As usual, BONES has no idea what he's talking about. Lot's of products like ketchup use animal products, like honey, that vegans don't eat. I wish people weren't so ignorant to the world around them.

[El°HYM]

If it says UV-treated powder in the Ingredients, thats not Vegan then.

[syntonica]

Plus, if it has natural food coloring, that's probably Cochineals.

Red Dye #OMG! It's bugs!

Yum.

[swilow11]

Wtf is this thread even about anymore?

[kritikon]

It's about random shit to divert it away from the usual trolls, as usual.
I mean, some numbnut thinks playing a piano chord is layering

[IvyBirds]

It's about random shit to divert it away from the usual trolls, as usual.
I mean, some numbnut thinks playing a piano chord is layering

I see you are embarrassing yourself again. What I said is that a piano is a layered sound. I feel bad for you that you lack the cognitive abilities to grasp that so I will break it down for you

When you press a key the hammer hits a key, that makes a distinct sound that is percussive in nature. You can hear this in isolation if you lift the lid and place your hand on the strings to prevent them from vibrating. That percussive sound only lasts a brief period of time as that sound fades away you will hear the sound of the strings vibrating through the bridges which in turn causes the soundboard and cabinet to vibrate

So you have a layered sound. If you are going to use a synthesizer to make a similar sound you would use a layered approach where one layer uses Synthesis techniques to emulate the percussive sound of the hammers hitting the strings, really authentic Synthesis tools would also include synthesizing the mechanical sounds of the hammer mechanism.

That would be two layers

Then finally you would use synthesis to synthesize the sound of the strings vibrating the bridges which vibrates the soundboard and the cabinet

If you are using physical modeling you would have multiple layers of multiple models

If you are using Sample and Synthesis you would use multiple layers of samples for each part to build up the sound, one for the mechanical sounds, another for the hammers, etc. That is what Yamaha does with AWM2 for example in the new Montage for example

Again I am sorry you lack basic reading skills and the cognitive abilities to grasp this reality and think I was talking about chords

But then again you probably think sending a sawtooth wave through a resonating filter is advanced sound design

See that's something you know now

[BONES]

Are you claiming that 'made from tomatoes' means 'only made from tomatoes' then?

Well I don't think anyone's putting tallow in there. Tomato, salt, sugar and that's all you need.

Because 'its got some fruit or veg in it' isnt actually a synonym for 'vegan'.

Don't be stupid.

And sugar isnt necessarily vegan, because the refining methods for sugar can include the use of animal bones.

That's what the fuckwits who market their tomato sauce as "vegan" would have you believe. Well done you for being gullible enough to swallow that shit. You don't really think that they put table sugar into products like sauce, though, do you? They'll use the cheapest, shittiest krap they can get their hands on. In the US, where bone char is used to enhance the colour and clarity of table sugar, they likely use high fructose corn syrup anyway, not actual sugar.