Software vs Hardware

[HAL76]

It's really stupid that people will still be arguing about their words in 2025.

I didn't read everything, but it was apparently also about layering... and that was initially a production technique that was also taken up in the later upcoming discipline of sound design.

And the protagonists are by no means talking about the same thing when they rave about it.

[BONES]

Awesome but if all you have is the stings vibrating it won't sound like a piano will it? For it to sound like a piano you need to percussive sound of the hammers. That is the sound that makes it recognized to most humans as a piano. That's the sound you get when you press a key

But that comes before the rest of it, so it's not layered, it is sequenced, as I explained yesterday. The hammer hits and then the rest of it happens.

If you take a piano sample and slice off the attack where the hammers are percussively hitting the strings and just have the sound of the stings and loop that at a zero crossing without clicks it will not be recognized at a piano sound to most people it will sound like a pad

See, if it was layered you wouldn't be able to separate the two bits, would you?

For it to sound like a piano and be recognized as a piano you need the layer of the percussive hammer hits and the sound of the strings

But if you layer one over the other, it won't sound like a piano either. For it to sound like a piano, you need to sequence them, one after the other. You could put them on a single audio track and they'd sound just like a piano, no layering necessary.

It's like saying living the dream and pooping in a bucket on your boat like you have to do is the same as having actual indoor plumbing under a roof

I have indoor plumbing and it's under a deck, more like the ground floor of a two-storey building. My toilet even flushes, just like a real one, except it uses seawater and I have to pump it by hand. (Electric flushing toilets are for girls.)

I didn't read everything, but it was apparently also about layering... and that was initially a production technique that was also taken up in the later upcoming discipline of sound design.

I recently watched Rick Beato's interview with Hans Zimmer and I noticed something very interesting - he never uses the term "sound design", he always calls it what it is - synth programming. Sound Design is a completely different discipline that requires a much higher level of skill. Programming synths is something anyone can do if they can be bothered, like taking out the bins. Hans actually thinks it's the thing he is best at (programming synths, not taking out the bins) but he doesn't try to tart it up with some fancy name.

[mixyguy2]

FYI this is what I got from your post, as again arrogance + stupidity = not worth wasting my time on. buh bye

[IvyBirds]

FYI this is what I got from your post, as again arrogance + stupidity = not worth wasting my time on. buh bye

And yet you took the time to respond and it's hilarious

There is nothing funnier on web forums than people who obviously pay attention to a post, feel the need to respond to that post, and even quote that post and then say they are not wasting their time on the post they took the time to

Thanks always great to have fans who care enough to respond, it means so much

[seafire]

I recently watched Rick Beato's interview with Hans Zimmer and I noticed something very interesting - he never uses the term "sound design", he always calls it what it is - synth programming. Sound Design is a completely different discipline that requires a much higher level of skill. Programming synths is something anyone can do if they can be bothered, like taking out the bins. Hans actually thinks it's the thing he is best at (programming synths, not taking out the bins) but he doesn't try to tart it up with some fancy name.

He used a different term. He didn't say anything about there being a difference or that one word had a diff meaning to another.
You are putting words into his mouth.

I just call it 'making presets' because that's what I do. I make a sound, and save it as a preset.

[IvyBirds]

It's really stupid that people will still be arguing about their words in 2025.

I didn't read everything, but it was apparently also about layering... and that was initially a production technique that was also taken up in the later upcoming discipline of sound design.

And the protagonists are by no means talking about the same thing when they rave about it.

It's always been used as a sound design tool, it's just technology makes it easier now than back in the day when hardware synths could only play one timbre and didn't have MIDI, or when we didn't have DAWs that could layer instruments

It's amazing that people are arguing that layering two sounds together to make a new sound is anything but sound design

[Jac459]

...
It's amazing that people are arguing that layering two sounds together to make a new sound is anything but sound design

There is even advanced layering sound design with "vector" synths which are mixing various sound sources and changing the volumes of each. The Moog Animoog Z is a notable example, we could also talk about a few Rob Papen ones.

[sin night]

Layering wasn’t difficult in the past, most of the times it was just a matter of having 2-3 synths and some midi cables to chain them

By the way, some synths even had a layer function built in, for example the Jupiter-8… although it also drops the maximum number of voices to 4 (and that synth wasn’t something within reach for most musicians, anyway).
Looking at something “for the masses”, even the classic microKorg featured a layering mode (which reduces the voice count to just 2……….). There are many other examples, by the way.


Honestly, I don’t give a f**k (to put it a gentle and educated way) if it’s sound design, production or arrangement (or anything else). I only care for the actual result.

I see no benefit in “intellectual exercises” like this… what matters using a technique when it’s appropriate to get the results, anything else is a waste of time and a distraction from making music, imho.

[whassup]

Honestly, I don’t give a f**k (to put it a gentle and educated way) if it’s sound design, production or arrangement (or anything else). I only care for the actual result.

I see no benefit in “intellectual exercises” like this… what matters using a technique when it’s appropriate to get the results, anything else is a waste of time and a distraction from making music, imho.

This.

[IvyBirds]

Layering wasn’t difficult in the past, most of the times it was just a matter of having 2-3 synths and some midi cables to chain them

You must have missed when I said

It's always been used as a sound design tool, it's just technology makes it easier now than back in the day when hardware synths could only play one timbre and didn't have MIDI, or when we didn't have DAWs that could layer instruments

Weird you are saying people were chaining Synths with MIDI cables when they didn't have MIDI.

MIDI was first demonstrated at NAMM in 1983 between a Sequential Circuits Prophet-600 and a Roland Jupiter-6

Not sure why you think in the 1970s they were using MIDI cables

I see no benefit in “intellectual exercises” like this when you are not being accurate… seems like a waste of time and a distraction from making music, imho.

[elxsound]

i disagree with all of you, let's argue!

Where’s the layered argument in that?

[vurt]

you're wrong!

[sin night]

Layering wasn’t difficult in the past, most of the times it was just a matter of having 2-3 synths and some midi cables to chain them

You must have missed when I said

It's always been used as a sound design tool, it's just technology makes it easier now than back in the day when hardware synths could only play one timbre and didn't have MIDI, or when we didn't have DAWs that could layer instruments

Weird you are saying people were chaining Synths with MIDI cables when they didn't have MIDI.

MIDI was first demonstrated at NAMM in 1983 between a Sequential Circuits Prophet-600 and a Roland Jupiter-6

Not sure why you think in the 1970s they were using MIDI cables

I see no benefit in “intellectual exercises” like this when you are not being accurate… seems like a waste of time and a distraction from making music, imho.

I went through the last few post quickly, so I likely missed the 1970 part.

Of course, before MIDI it was harder to add layers, the only way was using CV (when available... with hopefully both instruments following the same standard) and it isn't very practical once you have more than 1-2 voices... It was probably easier to play two parts by hand with very tight timing...

Anyway, MIDI has been around for more than 40 years now...

[Old Norse]

you're wrong!

No, you're not!

[felis]

Dont forget tactile enjoyment and not having to fire up a PC, load the synth and worry about OS updates breaking shit.

Just turn it on and play

Acoustic instruments. No need to turn on, no need for electricity, just play.