Drum mixing

[ghostwhistler]

What should I be doing? I use a variety of drum machine samples trhough TAL sampler. This way i can play the parts rather than paint in simple patterns directly into the DAW.

I eq individual drum sounds as I see fit and then route them through a drum bus which has compression.

TBH, I play it by ear. I don't really know what I'm doing. I've watched a few youtube clips, but they are largely all intended for techno. I don't make techno. They all talk about layering drums. Is this necessary? I don't imagein the sorts of musicians I like did this, but maybe it's a good idea.

I struggle with the 808, which I use from time to time, because the kick seems really feeble on its own. I have two kick sounds, a short and a long one. Again these are all samples. I've no idea what a real 808 is like nor do I intend to ever buy one.

What did people do back in the day? How did they mix these sounds? Did they record multiple layers with their drum machines?

[BertKoor]

What should I be doing?

That depends on what you want

I eq individual drum sounds as I see fit and then route them through a drum bus which has compression.

Some drum sounds need a bit of distortion/overdrive/saturation to fatten it up, and some reverb added (on the snare & toms only) to make it lush. Also you might want different compression on the base and on the snare instead of only a drums bus compressor.

I struggle with the 808, which I use from time to time, because the kick seems really feeble on its own. I have two kick sounds, a short and a long one. Again these are all samples. I've no idea what a real 808 is like nor do I intend to ever buy one.

On youtube you'll find plenty demos of what a plain Roland TR-808 sounds like. If that is not the sound you're after, then don't use samples of that machine! I mean, "Blue Monday" by New Order would have sounded very flimsy indeed if they used a TR-808 (without tons of processing) instead of the Oberheim DMX.

What did people do back in the day? How did they mix these sounds? Did they record multiple layers with their drum machines?

How many years 'back' do you mean?
They used the tools they had, which (compared to today) was often not that much.

But no, highly unlikely. I'd say layering samples only became common practice in the last 20 years.

[ghostwhistler]

I want the drums to have presence and power, not necessarily booming or heavy handed. It's relative to the mood of the track. I use the 808 on more mellow or atmospheric pieces usually. But the kick is not harsh and quite soft imo.

[Ah_Dziz]

If you're using the 808 as a sub to reinforce the "up front kick then you have lots of options. Or if you're using the 808 as a "bass line" (it's basically a sine wave generated by a self oscillating filter) then you'll probably want to add some higher harmonics to the sound via waveshaping or whatever kind of distortion floats your boat. The issue will throwing 808 kicks around will nilly is that they'll eat up lots of headroom. I use them sometimes for just a bit of an "accent" that nobody that isn't listening with a subwoofer will ever really hear.
Post some music if you want specific tips. Nobody necessarily knows what you're trying to accomplish.

JJ

[Uncle E]

Would help if you post examples of the kinds of sounds you're trying to get.

[seafire]

Would help if you post examples of the kinds of sounds you're trying to get.

Exactly.

The OP us way to vague to get any help that may be relevant

[Caine123]

yes you need to give more examples and genre infos.
for me i use not more than 3 drum samples if i wanna layer them, i mostly eq them first and if you wanna be sure to layer them correct, do sidechain them! then to a drum bus and thats it. works mostly so far.

[andivax]

What should I be doing? I use a variety of drum machine samples trhough TAL sampler. This way i can play the parts rather than paint in simple patterns directly into the DAW.

I eq individual drum sounds as I see fit and then route them through a drum bus which has compression.

TBH, I play it by ear. I don't really know what I'm doing. I've watched a few youtube clips, but they are largely all intended for techno. I don't make techno. They all talk about layering drums. Is this necessary? I don't imagein the sorts of musicians I like did this, but maybe it's a good idea.

I struggle with the 808, which I use from time to time, because the kick seems really feeble on its own. I have two kick sounds, a short and a long one. Again these are all samples. I've no idea what a real 808 is like nor do I intend to ever buy one.

What did people do back in the day? How did they mix these sounds? Did they record multiple layers with their drum machines?

the secret of that machines like 808 and 909 is the sounds perfectly fit in the mix.
The kits was made for this. In purpose.
I make my kits with the same idea in mind.
Now I am prepearing Mix Ready Linn Kit with some rare samples.
Here is an example of the 808 kit:

[lwj]

TBH, I play it by ear. I don't really know what I'm doing. I've watched a few youtube clips, but they are largely all intended for techno. I don't make techno. They all talk about layering drums. Is this necessary? I don't imagein the sorts of musicians I like did this, but maybe it's a good idea.

Watching techno tutorials if you’re not making techno is probably not a good idea. Personally I never get anything to sound good with layering, more trouble than it’s worth. I hardly ever use layering or aggressive sidechaining which seems to be everyone’s go to solution.

I struggle with the 808, which I use from time to time, because the kick seems really feeble on its own. I have two kick sounds, a short and a long one. Again these are all samples. I've no idea what a real 808 is like nor do I intend to ever buy one.

Define 808. There’s the Roland TR-808, which is an ancient drum machine that ‘shaped the sound of an era’ but is also a bitch to work with, sounds crappy and thin by default.

“808” is also used as a name for a certain type of tuned bass/kick sound that’s derived from the 808, but heavily treated, sampled, distorted and whatnot. Getting the basic building blocks for this is easy. It’s basically a sine wave rapidly pitched up and down again by an envelope or LFO.

You can do this with a sample of a sine wave. I prefer to use a synth for these kinds of sounds because that gives a lot more control and flexibility to shape it. But it’ll work with a sample just as well.

What did people do back in the day? How did they mix these sounds? Did they record multiple layers with their drum machines?

Well, they did a lot of drugs and smoked in the studio. Besides that, yeah.. layering stuff. But also recording it into mixing desks that weren’t necessarily great and colored the sound when you pushed them. Recording and re-recording onto tape. Every step of the way you’re adding subtle layers of saturation.

A lot of people didn’t use the drum machine but rather samples of it. Most samplers back then didn’t have great audio quality (low bit and samplerates) or converters that do funny things to a sound.

I fully realize these tips are actually more about sound design than mixing, but mixing (especially proper good mixing) is really overrated, especially if you want to have some kind of vintage sound to it.

[Spin Boyz]

It’s probably easier to find samples that have the presence and power you want. Trying to add that to poorly made samples is often a lot of work. The samples I use from NI and Akai need very little or no eq and compression.

[andivax]

ahhh. and I would recommend to use short "chest kick" as basically kick. and 808 as "bass".
so you can sidechain the bass part of 808 from your chest. no clashing then.

[swilow11]

Throwing some light reverb, saturatjon, and compression over your drum bus is a good way to glue them all together and make it sound less like multiple disparate samples getting triggered and more like a cohesive drum kit. You don't need to go too far with this at all.

I normally apply light saturation first- you'll get some interaction between hits which provides the sense of cohesiveness as, say, the hats get a bit more squashed and crunchy when they play onto of a kick. Don't go too far with this because you can start getting sharp gain discontinuities. Then a light convolution reverb- I usually push it until I can just hear it and then back off a touch to the extent that it's almost inaudible but you can still hear a change when bypassing the reverb. Then a multiband compressor/expander to bring up tails and push down peaks. Lastly into a glue compressor to again create interplay between drum hits. Last stage would be a Clipper but only a small 1db or so of clipping and maybe fed into a limiter (Arturia Bus Peak is great for this last part).