Picking a DAW is hard…

[machinesworking]

I popped in once here on this, but I use Digital Performer, and in some ways I fully get that "picking a DAW is hard", it's really easy for me to get to know a DAW pretty well, and find all the little annoying things about it that drive me nuts. In the end it's the one that least does this that you stick with for sure.

I wish Live or Bitwig 100% worked for me, I own both, have used Live since 2003 but never wanted to make it my main DAW, and always used it alongside DP or Logic. The reasons are simple, I like kitchen sink DAWs, I want SysEx saving in the DAW, extensive MIDI editing capabilities, movie hosting, multiple window support, some orchestral features like Articulation mapping and score layouts, extensive customizable keyboard shortcut lists and presets for things like quantization settings etc.

I love the modern workflow of Bitwig and Live, but I hate the extensive mousing for MIDI quantizing, constantly mousing for locator position, track arming that doesn't "stick", and general reliance on the mouse to navigate the interface.

The best way to describe it is with Live Suite, great product, but buying Push 3 you're confronted with Ableton's glacial thinking in terms of what a standalone version can do, it's basically a loop player in standalone, doesn't have any ability to change time signatures beyond looping partial measures of 4/4, has no tempo control for Scenes, and can't string a simple arrangement of Scenes into a song on it's own. It took them around 16 years to implement a simple key command to explode the edit window full screen. Over a decade and an half for something any other DAW could do. Same with recording clip automation...

I've got Logic and Reaper on this machine, and to a degree the same applies with them, Reaper doesn't do Clips and Scenes, and Logic only recently got the ability to differentiate MIDI hardware by port...

So I stick with my dinosaur DAW and all of it's oddities because it covers most of the things I like in Logic, Reaper, Live, Bitwig.

I'm also a fan of the MPCs, they're going the way of dumb for MPC3.0 with no time signatures, but enough of us squealed that if it was something they were going to add in later, it's happening soon. Just waiting on the software version of 3 to drop it into DP as a VSTi and it's the best of both worlds IMO.

[jthekidd427]

I’ve tried MPC and Logic Pro X… I like logic pro more… its cleaner to me… MPC I would have problems where I would have to click in the perfect spot to bring something up or nothing would happen.

[talby]

I published before in this thread that I am a happy Tracktion Waveform user and recommending to consider it when testing for DAWs. It runs on Win, Mac and Linux, has decent editors for MIDI based composition, and regarding recording and working with audio clips, and regarding its plugin handling and routing options, at least for me, overcomes cumbersome workflows inherited from the analog consoles by a modern design grown from a digital perspective.
I wonder why it is not frequently mentioned in the top ten of mentioned DAWs. Is it simply not well known, or is something wrong with it which I didn't run into by now?

[Benedict]

I wonder why it is not frequently mentioned in the top ten of mentioned DAWs. Is it simply not well known, or is something wrong with it which I didn't run into by now?

We use what we use and like and that is good. So in no way is my answering this Q an attack on you or anyone.

I was very interested in and even got Tracktion early on. At that time it was innovative and particularly Tracktion handled ReWire (now a dead protocol) better than any other program. However it was for me clunky and I hated the MIDI being forced inline, making it really hard to work on anything more than a 303 bassline. (or audio which I never use)

Later I tried and even recommended Waveform free for clients starting out BUT it was so poorly implemented that things were very inelegant and even not operating properly. people couldn't use it, incl me. I never recommended it again.

Sad as there are some nice things in there, but even free things need to compete. Saying oh it's free so why bitch, maybe if you genuinely can't/won't spend. BUT generally, the usability (not lists of features few need) is just not there and that is the reason that these programs failed the bigtime.

Disclosure: I am a Reason man. I have only used Reason for decades because for me it is so easy to use. Partly from time-spent, partly from the design which is about usability/workflow over lots of boxes ticked - that no one really needs because it can all be done with a tiny bit of effort.

[penbox_eu]

Among the free DAWs, which is the best and the easiest to work with midi?

[enroe]

... free DAWs ... best and the easiest to work with midi?

I think that is LMMS: Linux Multi-Media Sequencer.
You can import midi-files, work with midi-files and use VST-instruments
and VST-effects.

LMMS is part of a family of softwares known as digital audio workstations, or DAWs. It is a sound generation system, synthesizer, beat/bassline editor and MIDI control system that can power an entire home music studio. With LMMS, sounds and tones can be generated, played, and artfully arranged to create entire tracks with ease.

The tools needed to arrange sounds and rhythms to create tracks, layer tracks to create songs, and save songs to an output format are all there, ready for you to use.

With a MIDI keyboard, you can also play your music live while composing or performing.

[eLawnMust]

I wonder why it is not frequently mentioned in the top ten of mentioned DAWs. Is it simply not well known, or is something wrong with it which I didn't run into by now?

We use what we use and like and that is good. So in no way is my answering this Q an attack on you or anyone.

I was very interested in and even got Tracktion early on. At that time it was innovative and particularly Tracktion handled ReWire (now a dead protocol) better than any other program. However it was for me clunky and I hated the MIDI being forced inline, making it really hard to work on anything more than a 303 bassline. (or audio which I never use)

Later I tried and even recommended Waveform free for clients starting out BUT it was so poorly implemented that things were very inelegant and even not operating properly. people couldn't use it, incl me. I never recommended it again.

Sad as there are some nice things in there, but even free things need to compete. Saying oh it's free so why bitch, maybe if you genuinely can't/won't spend. BUT generally, the usability (not lists of features few need) is just not there and that is the reason that these programs failed the bigtime.

Disclosure: I am a Reason man. I have only used Reason for decades because for me it is so easy to use. Partly from time-spent, partly from the design which is about usability/workflow over lots of boxes ticked - that no one really needs because it can all be done with a tiny bit of effort.

Finally there is one 'Intelligenter' than the rest... Yes... OLD Tracktion was engineered way better except as you stated 'inline editing'... Which was the drawback of the 'All-On-One-Page' GUI concept which eventually got canned anyways to something worse... and Reason is great, especially old Reason & there is nothing that can match that efficiency (talking 2.5 or 3.0)...

[kardeman]

I learned studio one 2, took a long break because life.. .now coming back and it's at version 7! it's crazy. I thought it was resource hungry, so i devled into reaper beacuse of the many reviews on how stable it is.. I didnt use it much, went back to studio one. i think i'm just getting old lol... i want to learn reaper but i dont know if it's worth taking the time to learn vs the stablility we get in return. turns out a plugin i was using in studio one was hoggin resources.... but still seem interested to check out reaper.

[vitocorleone123]

I wonder why it is not frequently mentioned in the top ten of mentioned DAWs. Is it simply not well known, or is something wrong with it which I didn't run into by now?

We use what we use and like and that is good. So in no way is my answering this Q an attack on you or anyone.

I was very interested in and even got Tracktion early on. At that time it was innovative and particularly Tracktion handled ReWire (now a dead protocol) better than any other program. However it was for me clunky and I hated the MIDI being forced inline, making it really hard to work on anything more than a 303 bassline. (or audio which I never use)

Later I tried and even recommended Waveform free for clients starting out BUT it was so poorly implemented that things were very inelegant and even not operating properly. people couldn't use it, incl me. I never recommended it again.

Sad as there are some nice things in there, but even free things need to compete. Saying oh it's free so why bitch, maybe if you genuinely can't/won't spend. BUT generally, the usability (not lists of features few need) is just not there and that is the reason that these programs failed the bigtime.

Disclosure: I am a Reason man. I have only used Reason for decades because for me it is so easy to use. Partly from time-spent, partly from the design which is about usability/workflow over lots of boxes ticked - that no one really needs because it can all be done with a tiny bit of effort.

Finally there is one 'Intelligenter' than the rest... Yes... OLD Tracktion was engineered way better except as you stated 'inline editing'... Which was the drawback of the 'All-On-One-Page' GUI concept which eventually got canned anyways to something worse... and Reason is great, especially old Reason & there is nothing that can match that efficiency (talking 2.5 or 3.0)...

Waveform now is way better than Tracktion was. I admit, I've only been using it since v2 or v3, though. Never used v1 of Tracktion.

It's also one of the most efficient in terms of CPU use, with Reaper just ahead of it. That's because the audio engine was remade a few years ago.

Waveform lacks a few specific things I need, though, when it comes to using hardware with software, so, unless and until it gets those, I'll stick with S1, even though Fender is pretty much grinding it to a halt - it'll probably suffer the usual of being bought, milked, and then sold off or ended.

I maintain that picking a DAW is pretty easy: educate yourself on them, pick a couple that seem best to you, choose one to use one month, and then use the other couple after that, one per month of making music. Buy the one you like the best. Learn it and use it and keep using it unless and until you require a different workflow.

[telecharge]

Recently posted/updated on the LANDR Blog - https://blog.landr.com/best-daw-for-beginners

This video is a year old...
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[dalipeng]

cakewalk sonar is free now, you can try it. and I suggest you stick to proficiently using a DAW recommended by most people, regardless of its advantages or disadvantages. After you truly master it, consider other DAWs

[Papuzzo]

cakewalk sonar is free now, you can try it. and I suggest you stick to proficiently using a DAW recommended by most people, regardless of its advantages or disadvantages. After you truly master it, consider other DAWs

That would be my advice too. I think all the DAWs are pretty much the same when we consider that most people never use most of the capabilities and just need typical audio and MIDI editing capabilities. After many years with a certain DAW one might find they need the differences that distinguish the DAWs. Might as well start out with a free DAW and spend a few years concentrating on making music.

[_leras]

cakewalk sonar is free now, you can try it. and I suggest you stick to proficiently using a DAW recommended by most people, regardless of its advantages or disadvantages. After you truly master it, consider other DAWs

That would be my advice too. I think all the DAWs are pretty much the same when we consider that most people never use most of the capabilities and just need typical audio and MIDI editing capabilities. After many years with a certain DAW one might find they need the differences that distinguish the DAWs. Might as well start out with a free DAW and spend a few years concentrating on making music.

Not sure I completely agree with this. Sure many people may not use all features, but there is a real difference in work flows between DAWs.

i.e. Cubase can do almost everything, it's a superb DAW feature wise, but compared to Bitwig it feels very clunky.

Bitwig, for me has superb workflow for creating music from scratch and mixing, but isn't the best for e.g. recording a band or many multiple inputs.

There are of course advantages to having good tutorials and resources around, which would be a plus for Ableton, but this is also pretty clunky compared to Bitwig.

I think the hard part of choosing a DAW is that you need to know the basics fairly well before you can assess any differences. And once you've learnt the basics you've also learned that DAWs processes - which makes moving DAW quite a pain.

However once you do know the difference you can make assessments fairly quickly. For me I would want to set up some drum parts, some synths parts with groupings and FX sends, import some loops or audio to edit, setup a midi link to a synth and record some audio.

I'd like think I'd know pretty quickly which processes I prefer, but I'm not sure that's completely true as first time doing a new process isn't necessarily the same as repeatedly doing it when more familiar.

Anyway, Id say just start with Bitwig for it's work flow. And if someone really thought that was too niche, take Ableton which is less smooth in workflow but has more resources.

[stoopicus]

Not sure I completely agree with this. Sure many people may not use all features, but there is a real difference in work flows between DAWs.

Agree completely and I would go even farther - the DAWs are not even remotely the same.

You can group some of them broadly into similar-ish workflows but even that is problematic.

If I were to do that it would be something like:

Pro Tools
Reaper

Studio One
Cubase
Logic Pro
Digital Performer (maybe)

Ableton
Bitwig

Fruityloops

Reason

But even these groups feel weird - there is both overlap and also standout strengths for each.

In the end, all DAWs are capable, high quality music production tools and we are damned lucky to have them all. But at the same time, they are far from the same.

[talby]

As pointed out several times already, the modern DAW has many faces nowadays.
The majority serve very well as all-rounder tools. Pick one of them and you are good for most of what is likely to come up.
Isn't then on the one side of the extreme only Pro Tools and Mixbus appearing underdeveloped for MIDI editing by so strongly sticking in its user interface design to mainly reproduce analog equipment?
And on the other side of the extreme are only Reason, LMMS and maybe Ableton, Bitwig or FL Studio not providing full-fledged comfortable audio recording and mixing console features?

I would therefore, as an aid to the newcomer finding this thread, group the DAWs differently, naming the all-rounders first and the subject specialists last.


All-rounder:

Pro Tools
Studio One
Cakewalk
Cubase
Reaper
Waveform
Digital Performer
Ardour
Logic Pro


stronger focus on EDM style creation:

Ableton
Bitwig
FL Studio
Reason


stronger focus on Console style recording and mixing:
Pro Tools
Mixbus