The Linnstrument's surface notches against slow bends/slides

[Dirk Diggler]

I have to add in 3 years the OP has yet to create any video showing this issue as requested by Roger.

Sad you took our attempts at help as direct attacks.

Hopefully you found a solution and are playing too much to bother with us folks.

I play fretless basses as well and even have a fretless guitar.

And one last FYI, I will proudly say Linnstrument IS my bending machine.

p.s. after I wrote this reply I realized there may be a couple options to try.
You could try using portamento/slide/glide directly on the sound source either hardware or software. That will smooth out any stepping 100%.

Another option would be there may be midi smoothing options in your DAW.
For instance I use Gig Performer and it offers many ways to alter midi data.
Seems like there might be some built in tools in Reaper, like ReaControlMidi that might help too.

[BrotherThomas]

Weird thread. It starts off with pages of denial and gaslighting, and then at the end we get a solution! I am looking forward to trying the strips. Those vertical ditches are the only thing I don't love about playing the LS. Twelve discontinuities to navigate per octave.

[BrotherThomas]

I have to add in 3 years the OP has yet to create any video showing this issue as requested by Roger.

I don't think a video would be too enlightening. The problem is more of an ear and feel challenge, and less something you can observe with your eyes. Perhaps many players have not developed their sensitivity to intonation to the point of the slots becoming a problem for them?

But if you look at the image OP posted of midi data, you can see the discontinuity introduced by the slots. It is tiny, but I can hear it, and I can feel in in my fingers.

Most of the problem can be mitigated with technique, but not all. For example, a slow portamento with minimal pressure will sometimes cause an unwanted gate when you cross a slot. You have to keep a certain amount of pressure to avoid this, which is limiting.

For me the biggest problem is the mental distraction the slots cause me when I have to fight to keep the glide smooth by remembering to press a little harder than I would have to were I not gliding over slots, and then hearing and feeling the tiny discontinuities.

One thing that got me triggered earlier in the thread was the implication that long slow portamentos are special effects and not musical. This represents the boundaries of an individual's personal esthetic, not an objective statement. There are musical styles where extreme portamentos are integral, such as blues slide guitar, or dhrupad. Portamento is 95% of the melody in a dhrupad alap--long, short, fast, slow, in every combination.

For some ear candy, check out this Italian dhrupad singer collaborating with an electronic musician in a fusion context. She is singing Raag Megh, associated with monsoons. In Western terms, the raga scale is equivalent to the second mode of the major pentatonic.

This raga's melodic signature features portamentos between the second and the fourth, between the seventh and the root, and between the fifth and the ninth. The swooping portamentos are thought to emulate the sound of wind and rain.

[Tj Shredder]

I always thought, that it should be easy to replace the surface with a completely flat silicone. It only needs to be cut to the correct size. Kind of the opposite to the bumpy surface… One could still draw colored lines for easier orientation…
I wonder what would be the ideal thickness of that…?

[Roger_Linn]

Hi TJ,

McMaster.com has some stock silicon sheets, though they are a different hardness, thickness, translucency and have no non stick coating. The dimensions
and hole locations of the LinnStrument playing surface are available on the LinnStrument Support page under “Engineering Files”.

[TigerBalm]

A few weeks ago I ordered a speedbump surface mold for the full sized LinnStrument 200. I added a design change that will hopefully allow for smooth glissandi while retaining some tactility.

On the 128 bumpy surface, there are grooves centered over each note. The grooves are 8.5mm long and span nearly the full Y dimension of the bump. I call them "hot dogs." I agree that that they do cause some Z ripple as you slide over them, but of course there is a huge amount of musical space to explore where that effect is fine.

On the upcoming 200 surface, I shrunk the groove down to 3.5mm "soy beans." I found that at this width, even if I slide right over the top of the groove my finger doesn't fully drop into it, so the groove feels less noticeable. It also allows me to roll my finger up in Y to go around the groove entirely. This was tested on non functional 3d prints, hopefully it works well on the real thing.

So if you're interested in this topic you might enjoy the upcoming 200 speedbump surface. Should be ready in 3-6 months.

Untitled 4.jpg

[Dirk Diggler]

Hey TigerBalm,
that's great news on the 200's, I think I like the idea of the Soybeans style.
Seems that would be less drag on slides for sure, or less chance of sticking.
It might even focus the lights since it's less area to illuminate.

[TigerBalm]

One note to add: I have a tiny hunch that the chainlink fence effect is a bit more pronounced on the speedbump surface, because the grooves are positioned in the center of each sensor column. You hit the groove right where the sensor is sensitive.

On the original surface, the grooves sit in the gaps between sensor columns. Maybe the gaps mask the effect of bumping into the grooves?

I'm not sure if this is true. I should look into how the firmware interpolates the gaps, and do some careful play comparisons.

[UncleWayback]

I wonder if braille dots wouldn't be the way to go? Perhaps a small raised dot would be easier to feel and also less disruptive than a divot/groove?

[UncleWayback]

BTW @TigerBalm - really cool that the 200 surface is on the way, I plan to get me a clear version (as I often use the leds for other things & want them as visible as possible). I use the tritone layout so the braille dots on the original surface don't do much for me - I'd have preferred them in every cell (with only rows having spacers (so, pretty close to what you offer!)).

[TigerBalm]

I wonder if braille dots wouldn't be the way to go? Perhaps a small raised dot would be easier to feel and also less disruptive than a divot/groove?

In earlier iterations I had protruding features at the centerpoint of each note, inspired by the frets on a guitar. I found that they were a little unpleasant because they always bumped the finger away from the center of the note. So I was trying to play a game where the frets had a gap in the middle to pass the finger while also being present just enough to feel.

Untitled 2.jpg

Then I saw a post from ebinary on page 5 of this thread:

viewtopic.php?t=550429&hilit=play+by+feel&start=60#top

They had the idea to do recessed features, so I tried that and thought it felt a lot better. I also realized that once I had a feature on the center of the note that putting a groove on the note boundaries was redudant and confusing for my fingers, so I got rid of them.

But yes the design goals of tactility and smoothness will always be pulling in opposite directions. At the moment it's probably best to find a compromise.

[UncleWayback]

I reckon you've hit on a great solution, can't wait to get my digits on yer soybeans.