Logic Pro 11.2(.2)

[Sascha Franck]

I would hope that a retired ex-engineer doesn't actually have that much say in a live product range he used to be involved in. But stranger things have happened I suppose

I don't think he's an "ex-engineer". I think he's still *the* mastermind behind Logic.

[andypryce]

Maybe today is the day.

A new Reverb or mixing asistant, New Session Player, Some packs, Something Apple wants related to AI and one actual useful improvement for veteran users

[touchedbymusic]

it's pretty apparent that in general Logic becomes more and more of a lost cause.

It's sad to see on what has Logic came down to.
Apple doesn't give a crap about anything other than pure profit, and they are capable destroying perfectly good product if it isn't profitable enough (remember Aperture professional photo editor) or downgrade it to amateur "play-tool" level for "influencers".

I guess a tell-tale sign is that Logic is hardly even discoverable anymore on Apple's homepage. There was a time when Apple was proudly presenting their Pro Apps (and they kind of deserved that designation).

Now, you'd actually have to go apple.com and select "Mac", then in a tiny menu to right select "Apps by Apple" under "More from Mac". On that page you'll then need to scroll past things like "Apple Games" and "Apple Invites" to "Creativity" and then in that list scroll to the penultimate entry on the right, which finally is our dear Logic Pro. The last entry is Mainstage, the first one is Image Playground.

IMHO that tells you everything you need to know and I agree it's kinda sad.

Greetings, a fellow ex-Logic user who went back to his "first love" Cubase.

[CinningBao]

I would hope that a retired ex-engineer doesn't actually have that much say in a live product range he used to be involved in. But stranger things have happened I suppose

I don't think he's an "ex-engineer". I think he's still *the* mastermind behind Logic.

Wow, my bad! That's some commitment. Maybe there is some hope.

[qtheerearranger]

everybody has forgotten apple hired Ricky Tinez a few months ago for the pro audio team - as a result i would imagine they are listening to his input (hes a brilliantly talented musician) and probably working on things they didn't want to work on before because ricky is probably well.. more integrated into listening to feedback then most apple employees coming from elektron. January or June is my bet. If its june i think yall are in for some excitement.

[touchedbymusic]

everybody has forgotten apple hired Ricky Tinez a few months ago for the pro audio team

As marketing product manager from what I understand. I wouldn’t put too much expectation into that. Logic doesn’t need more marketing, it needs more development.

[oobesan]

Ricky Tinez is going to save Logic Pro?

[andypryce]

Ricky Tinez is going to save Logic Pro?

Being a DAWless musician, he might convince Apple to discontinue Logic Pro

[Johnnyjohn]

So next week with the new OS updates then?

[Sascha Franck]

Wow, my bad! That's some commitment. Maybe there is some hope.

Why would it trigger any hope that the guy that (admittedly after a great start) essentially ruining Logic is still responsible for it?

[CinningBao]

Wow, my bad! That's some commitment. Maybe there is some hope.

Why would it trigger any hope that the guy that (admittedly after a great start) essentially ruining Logic is still responsible for it?

I was under the impression you were implying that him being there is probably a good thing?
But it doesn't sound like it..

[Sascha Franck]

I was under the impression you were implying that him being there is probably a good thing?
But it doesn't sound like it..

Tbh, I actually don't know. I met the guy 3 times, had an option to talk to him a bit one time and also read some stuff from him several times (for reasons...). He always seemed like a cool guy. And very obviously, he at least had some ideas how to create a kickass product.

But then, he pretty clearly has always been a Mac nut, so he might've accepted the Apple offer somewhat too quickly. Back when the takeover happened, Logic for Windows was actually running better than on Macs, not only because of the vastly faster processing power available (that was when G5s were the latest and greatest, which were then easily outperformed by, say, Athlon Thunderbirds), but also because it was actually running more stable. I know some Logic users first hand who where switching from Macs to Windows machines because of that.

And lets face it, the first Apple only incarnation, namely Logic 6, has almost been a fiasco, simply because it wasn't running much better and as if that wasn't enough, they removed VST support pretty much out of the blue. Which, at least IMO, has been completely idiotic.
To make matters worse, they were constantly touting the superiority of the AU format - a wannabe superiority which, to this day, has never been shown.

I'm actually still surprised that all of this at least kinda worked out for them for so many years. Possibly (or even pretty likely) had something to do with Intel Macs coming to the rescue as well - because all of a sudden, Logic became the most efficient DAW there possibly ever was until then. It was when I decided to risk switching, too (I was a 100% Windows guy before, considered switching back to Cubase when Apple took over). Got one of those cheesy plastic Macbooks - and well, in terms of performance it simply almost mopped the floor with even some highly tuned specialist DAW machines.

That efficiency was a pretty relevant thing for plenty of users I think (for me it defenitely was).
Interestingly enough, when Apple's M machines were a bit established, both Reaper and Cubase were beating Logic in terms of efficiency.

Next in Apple's series of stunts has been to make Logic literally a one time payment affair with free updates for life. That, combined with Garageband compatibility and the super low asking price certainly attracted many users.
And it's also what's often used against criticism. "Listen, you get all this for free, how dare you complain about it?" I've seen that more than once - and obviously, it's utter BS. Most avid Logic users I know would more than happily pay regular update fees in case the damn thing would be developed properly.

And finally, add to all this their secrecy. Which just completely sucks.
What are the developers you admire the most? Right, it's those running some kind of "active" support, taking part in forums, reacting to their users and what not. Simply doesn't exist in Apple's walled garden. The only support you get is via their official support hotline - and more often than not, the guys there are just plain clueless once it gets into any kinda detailed stuff. They will then ask you to file a report via the "official" Logic feedback form - where it will be ignored for another number of years.

Now, as this was about Mr. Lengeling, I obviously have absolutely no idea about how much of this is in line with what he really wants (or wanted), but I'm afraid he might be quite happy behind these garden walls. After all, nobody's forcing you to deliver results anymore because your product turned into some kinda "convenience" thing, only existing to attract new users.

[andypryce]

Now, as this was about Mr. Lengeling, I obviously have absolutely no idea about how much of this is in line with what he really wants (or wanted), b

I want to believe that Apple Pro Audio Management is responsible for the all ChatGPT, Mastering Assistant, Session Players and artist packs crap and Logic team is just following orders.

[Super Piano Hater 64]

I want to believe that Apple Pro Audio Management is responsible for the all ChatGPT, Mastering Assistant, Session Players and artist packs crap and Logic team is just following orders.

Every report I've heard of the power dynamics inside the company is consistent with this theory. There is an unwritten rule that no failure can ever be blamed on management. Anyone who disagrees is silenced, because questioning the rule is the same as breaking the rule.

This is how it works at many companies. Rank is taken as evidence of domain expertise. "If you understood your job better than I do, YOU would be MY boss." Apple's culture of secrecy just helps it fester.

[Sascha Franck]

I want to believe that Apple Pro Audio Management is responsible for the all ChatGPT, Mastering Assistant, Session Players and artist packs crap and Logic team is just following orders.

Well, regardless of whom it is being responsible, apparently the Logic team needs to follow suit and waste their time for such BS instead of implementing some great things (in case they're still able to cram something into that decade old code - which might as well be a serious issue).