Does anyone NOT like Diva?

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sellyoursoul wrote: Thu Jan 15, 2026 6:39 pm I guess my impression of the sound of Diva was always that it is on the side of dark/dull/bland, like it is leaning in the direction of analog but too inhibited to get there. It's a quality that I don't hear in Repro, which is why I said before that a Diva 2 that is on the level of Repro would be interesting.
There are definitely some aspects of Diva's capabilities that sound a bit dull. The Filter FM definitely doesn't sound as nice and crisp as Repro, but Repro came a lot later, and does not do as many voices as Diva does. The worst thing you can say about it is that you get some aliasing if you're in filter self oscillation and you're playing way up the keyboard, which is a pretty annoying sound even on an actual analog.

But take a look at a preset like HS Cork Cutter. Nothing dull about that. Maybe in a world of hyped up Serums, Diva can sound a bit on the warm side, but I don't hold that against it. I really like Diva, despite my criticisms of some aspects of it. I actually sold it at some point when I started buying hardware analogs, and then bought it back because I missed it. I'd love a Diva 2, but I don't think I'd change much. Maybe add a few more modules from classic analogs, maybe even something from the ancient digital world, like a OSCar oscillator and filter. Add an Ultra Devine mode and redesign the Modifications system, so modulation is more like Hive. I think you could have it as a permanent section on the bottom of the UI, so one could easily see all the modulation settings at a glance.

Or, you could nest the modifiers on the list, so when you click on a label, you get a drop down with just the mod sources, and then a nested selection of the modifiers. You then label the knob as something like "Pr+LFO1," instead of "ADD." You could then put a small secondary knob to the upper right of the knob to adjust amount.
Zerocrossing Media

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wagtunes wrote: Tue Jan 13, 2026 10:23 pm
Isn't integrating a hardware synth with something like Cubase a pain in the ass? Don't you need certain things to make them work together? And then where are you gonna put the darn thing when you already have a keyboard controller like a Keylab 49?

Cubase actually makes it much easier than the majority of the other daws. Cubase has very strong support for external hardware, both synths and effect units. I have all of my synths and aeffect units routed to Cubase and I've actually written patch programs for every single one of them.

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I think my biggest issue with the sound of Diva is my own ignorance of it. I do think that Repro does do a more convincing job of sounding analog, but the ratio of my ignorance of Diva to the analogness of Diva vs. Repro is very likely slanting hard in the direction of ignorance. I probably should have picked up during the last sale and spent some quality time with it.

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husker37 wrote: Fri Jan 16, 2026 3:19 am
wagtunes wrote: Tue Jan 13, 2026 10:23 pm
Isn't integrating a hardware synth with something like Cubase a pain in the ass? Don't you need certain things to make them work together? And then where are you gonna put the darn thing when you already have a keyboard controller like a Keylab 49?

Cubase actually makes it much easier than the majority of the other daws. Cubase has very strong support for external hardware, both synths and effect units. I have all of my synths and aeffect units routed to Cubase and I've actually written patch programs for every single one of them.
I wish other programs were like Cubase with hardware. I have a few effects processors on their own dedicated send/returns from my Arturia Audiofuse Rig16 that route within Cubase with MIDI and MIDI patch scripts, and I literally can recall patches and call up the effects processor like it's a VSTfx plugin. It's amazing. Synthesizers are just as easy. So no, it's not a pain at all.

Devon
Simple music philosophy - Those who can, make music. Those who can't, make excuses.
Read my VST reviews at Traxmusic!

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Fun fact : when Parawave Rapid was released, they made a blind test, Rapid VS Diva, to demystify this "analog" sound talk. Nobody was able to tell which one was which for sure.
viewtopic.php?p=6621157#p6621157
Rapid does sampling, resampling, custom wavetables, and granular.

Diva is one instrument among others to me. If you like it, choose it, but if you don't, you're not in any kind of trouble, there are tons of excellent other possibilities. As far as I'm concerned I see strictly no reason to stick to Diva.

Avenger, Falcon, Rapid, Spire, Serum, Pigments, Phaseplant, Massive X, MPowersynth or Icarus are only examples of excellent instruments that offer huge sound design possibilities today with insanely good sound quality.

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Let us not forget. :?
Urs once stated that Diva's highest Quality - setting is equivalent to Repro's lowest.
Still a lovely and very musical sounding synthesizer, no matter what.
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So, Repro needs more oversampling and all because the Prophet designs have way crazier modulation depths. The FilterFM of a Minimoog is something like +/- 2 octaves at most, whereas our Pro~Ones do +/- 10 octaves. Similar with the Osc FM/PWM, and the Osc PWM has negative audio rate modulation, which took us months to nail. Furthermore, with some patching tricks, the Pro~One filter opens up to about 70 kHz. Which is, you know, a lot more than any vintage Roland or Korg or Oberheim or Moog ever did :)

None of these challenges are present in the reference gear we used for Diva, hence no "ultra divine" quality is needed, and thus also none of these sonic options are present. I guess that's the main difference people hear - less range in filter frequencies, less audio rate modulation depth and fewer options thereof. And of course a set of built-in effects that are tailored for the respective base sound.

So, hehehe, when people compare Diva and Repro, they are simply also comparing the capabilities of the original hardware units. For raw, brutal analogue sound, a Pro~One beats a Minimoog all over the place. But for buttery warmth it's the other way round. Diva has many sweet spots, Repro has edgy territories to explore.

When we talk about authenticity, there are a few structural differences between Diva's take on the Minimoog and the real Minimoog, because we use Osc 1 as modulation source, and we rely on the LFO as a noise mod source. So here are some patches that are not exactly comparable. However, it is my personal opinion that the accuracy in Minimoog emulations has declined so much in recent years, I'm confident that Diva still captures the real one better than some pretty popular competition (arguably, some of the newer ones sound truly gorgeous, but they simply don't sound like a vintage Minimoog).

Anyhow, our statistics show that, with maybe one or two exceptions, each year since Diva's release we have sold more licenses than any previous year. With some of our reseller she outsells every other single soft synth product while not on special. There's no way we're going to change anything substantial, like bend her into Repro-ish sonic territory. Because apparently, and unlike the vibe I get from some of the posts here, she's still an extremely popular choice. Never change a winning team.

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Urs wrote: Fri Jan 16, 2026 10:47 am There's no way we're going to change anything substantial, like bend her into Repro-ish sonic territory.
The main thing I would update is the modulation system. Zebra3's isn't great in relation to other modern offerings, but at least it's usable. I get that Diva is supposed to be a throwback, but I don't think MSEGs and a drag-drop system would lessen its tribute to vintage synths, it would just open more possibilities.

More FX and a true randomization of the Voice section would be welcome as well. Manually twiddling 32 knobs is no fun.
Last edited by billinder33 on Fri Jan 16, 2026 2:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Puduku wrote: Fri Jan 16, 2026 5:12 am Fun fact : when Parawave Rapid was released, they made a blind test, Rapid VS Diva, to demystify this "analog" sound talk. Nobody was able to tell which one was which for sure.
viewtopic.php?p=6621157#p6621157
Rapid does sampling, resampling, custom wavetables, and granular.

...
Hmmm on that page, I saw three guesses.. the first one incorrect, the second one correct, and the third one (mine) correct.
rsp
sound sculptist

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I would just like the ms-20 filters to be more aggressive (like other ms-20 emulations). An authentic Juno chorus would be cool, don’t much like the chorus in diva, but it’s easy to add a Juno chorus outside diva.

I’m one of the weirdos who has found it slightly dull compared to others especially Roland emulations but I’ll admit the sound comparisons tend to be hard to tell different apart in blind tests.

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billinder33 wrote: Fri Jan 16, 2026 12:41 pm
Urs wrote: Fri Jan 16, 2026 10:47 am There's no way we're going to change anything substantial, like bend her into Repro-ish sonic territory.
The main thing I would update is the modulation system. Zebra3's isn't great in relation to other modern offerings, but at least it's usable. I get that Diva is supposed to be a throwback, but I don't think MSEGs and a drag-drop system would lessen it's tribute to vintage synths, it would just open more possibilities.

More FX and a true randomization of the Voice section would be welcome as well. Manually twiddling 32 knobs is no fun.
We have made great advances in Zebra's modulation system in the weeks since the first beta release... we've greatly improved visual indication as to what's going on. A new beta was supposed to hit today, but we have last minute bugs that hopefully get fixed early next week.

We have some great plans for Diva, but those take years of development. I mentioned it before, we'll probably do an intermediate feature update (which, if you follow Z3 development closely, will be an absolutely obvious choice), hopefully this year, and then we'll focus on the big shifts, including Diva's modulation system.

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Urs wrote: Fri Jan 16, 2026 1:04 pm
billinder33 wrote: Fri Jan 16, 2026 12:41 pm
Urs wrote: Fri Jan 16, 2026 10:47 am There's no way we're going to change anything substantial, like bend her into Repro-ish sonic territory.
The main thing I would update is the modulation system. Zebra3's isn't great in relation to other modern offerings, but at least it's usable. I get that Diva is supposed to be a throwback, but I don't think MSEGs and a drag-drop system would lessen it's tribute to vintage synths, it would just open more possibilities.

More FX and a true randomization of the Voice section would be welcome as well. Manually twiddling 32 knobs is no fun.
We have made great advances in Zebra's modulation system in the weeks since the first beta release... we've greatly improved visual indication as to what's going on. A new beta was supposed to hit today, but we have last minute bugs that hopefully get fixed early next week.

We have some great plans for Diva, but those take years of development. I mentioned it before, we'll probably do an intermediate feature update (which, if you follow Z3 development closely, will be an absolutely obvious choice), hopefully this year, and then we'll focus on the big shifts, including Diva's modulation system.
Thanks for the update, I'll definitely check out the next Zebra beta when it drops.

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I like stereo outputs, stereo spread, and generally more spatial controls.

32 or 64 voices would be nice too.

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Urs wrote: Fri Jan 16, 2026 10:47 am So, Repro needs more oversampling and all because the Prophet designs have way crazier modulation depths. The FilterFM of a Minimoog is something like +/- 2 octaves at most, whereas our Pro~Ones do +/- 10 octaves. Similar with the Osc FM/PWM, and the Osc PWM has negative audio rate modulation, which took us months to nail. Furthermore, with some patching tricks, the Pro~One filter opens up to about 70 kHz. Which is, you know, a lot more than any vintage Roland or Korg or Oberheim or Moog ever did :)

None of these challenges are present in the reference gear we used for Diva, hence no "ultra divine" quality is needed, and thus also none of these sonic options are present. I guess that's the main difference people hear - less range in filter frequencies, less audio rate modulation depth and fewer options thereof. And of course a set of built-in effects that are tailored for the respective base sound.

So, hehehe, when people compare Diva and Repro, they are simply also comparing the capabilities of the original hardware units. For raw, brutal analogue sound, a Pro~One beats a Minimoog all over the place. But for buttery warmth it's the other way round. Diva has many sweet spots, Repro has edgy territories to explore.

When we talk about authenticity, there are a few structural differences between Diva's take on the Minimoog and the real Minimoog, because we use Osc 1 as modulation source, and we rely on the LFO as a noise mod source. So here are some patches that are not exactly comparable. However, it is my personal opinion that the accuracy in Minimoog emulations has declined so much in recent years, I'm confident that Diva still captures the real one better than some pretty popular competition (arguably, some of the newer ones sound truly gorgeous, but they simply don't sound like a vintage Minimoog).

Anyhow, our statistics show that, with maybe one or two exceptions, each year since Diva's release we have sold more licenses than any previous year. With some of our reseller she outsells every other single soft synth product while not on special. There's no way we're going to change anything substantial, like bend her into Repro-ish sonic territory. Because apparently, and unlike the vibe I get from some of the posts here, she's still an extremely popular choice. Never change a winning team.
This very intresting Urs, in light of what you said here, where would ace and aces filters fit in the scheme of things, I know that ace is modular in nature but the some of aces components still creates a rich analog synth with excellent bass sounds. Somewhere i read that ace was remotely inspired by the Arp synths but in terms of filters and fm modulations where does this sit in comparison? Ace is one the most cpu efficient synths for what its sound output is.. similarly Tyrell too

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Well, ACE is a totally different concept... in our product matrix, we have pairs of synths that are distinguished on two ends of an axis each:

Modulars: ACE (classic subtractive) vs. Bazille (digital)

Analogue Emulations: Diva (analogue warmth) vs. Repro (analogue grit)

Digitals: Hive (easy) vs. Zebra (complex)

ACE pre-dates Diva, otherwise we would have given it a more analogue sound. I hope that one day we can revisit it for a special treatment so it can have Hive-style engines with some state of the art analogue sounding options.

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