What makes music great - Plugins and Techniques

[fisherKing]

Judging by most popular hits over the years, lyrics seem to matter very little. It's more the melody and the quality of the singer/auto-tune imo. Most lyrics are, I'll just say weak. There are very few great lyricists.

Better?

ah, the old 'why can't things be like they were when i was young?" every generation seems to think it's music & culture was the one that mattered. maybe lyrics mattered more once, and now feeling matters more. or not. it makes no difference; for every generation, their moment is their moment. as it's supposed to be...

[Cuauhtli]

I made no reference to old vs new music. (my mention of Waters, Dylan, Chapin was meant as examples of good/great lyricists). I think it has always been the case where the majority of hit songs from all eras have weak lyrics.

My point was that good lyrics are not necessary for a song to be a hit. I was wrong saying they seem matter very little because that clearly depends on the song in question. Bob Dylan is a prime example of lyrics being vital to the success of the song. They're a minority though.

[jamcat]

ah, the old 'why can't things be like they were when i was young?" every generation seems to think it's music & culture was the one that mattered.

I think music 'mattered' throughout the radio era. This was multiplied by television, first with variety shows in the '60s and '70s and then blowing up exponentially with MTV in the '80s and '90s. All of this pretty much ended by the early naughts because of fragmentation, the internet, and MTV ditching music for trash reality shows. And subsequently, music stopped mattering nearly as much as it used to, because we lost the cohesive, shared cultural experience that made it possible.

[Najimad]

ah, the old 'why can't things be like they were when i was young?" every generation seems to think it's music & culture was the one that mattered.

I think music 'mattered' throughout the radio era. This was multiplied by television, first with variety shows in the '60s and '70s and then blowing up exponentially with MTV in the '80s and '90s. All of this pretty much ended by the early naughts because of fragmentation, the internet, and MTV ditching music for trash reality shows. And subsequently, music stopped mattering nearly as much as it used to, because we lost the cohesive, shared cultural experience that made it possible.

Very good summary.
I think the release of Pro Tools in 1990ies also changed music production drastically - everyone was able to produce music in his bedroom.

[fisherKing]

ah, the old 'why can't things be like they were when i was young?" every generation seems to think it's music & culture was the one that mattered.

I think music 'mattered' throughout the radio era. This was multiplied by television, first with variety shows in the '60s and '70s and then blowing up exponentially with MTV in the '80s and '90s. All of this pretty much ended by the early naughts because of fragmentation, the internet, and MTV ditching music for trash reality shows. And subsequently, music stopped mattering nearly as much as it used to, because we lost the cohesive, shared cultural experience that made it possible.

that's your observation, nothing more. ask any teen if music 'matters' the way right now the way it mattered to you in your teen years.

there is always a youth culture, always ppl who live in the pop culture moment. and the moment one lives in (as, say a teen) is as essential and as valuable as it was for their parents, their parents parents... and so on.

[jamcat]

But unlike the Boomers and Gen X, the current youth culture doesn’t place music very highly in importance or defining personal identity. Video games and furry conventions and TikTok videos are what matters to this generation.

[Uncle E]

But unlike the Boomers and Gen X, the current youth culture doesn’t place music very highly in importance or defining personal identity. Video games and furry conventions and TikTok videos are what matters to this generation.

Purrfect

[jamcat]

And to complete the circle, the very reason why the youth of today don’t give music much currency is because they’re not going to define themselves by what previous generations did 40, 50, 60 years ago. And the current musical landscape is a cultural wasteland that is nothing to get excited about.

Though, to the extent that there are any musical trends that are currently happening, they are all decidedly retro.

[fisherKing]

But unlike the Boomers and Gen X, the current youth culture doesn’t place music very highly in importance or defining personal identity. Video games and furry conventions and TikTok videos are what matters to this generation.

what's your source for these statements? as a lot of 'current' music has insane stream counts on spotify (for example). hmmm. who's listening?

[CrystalWizard]

And to complete the circle, the very reason why the youth of today don’t give music much currency is because they’re not going to define themselves by what previous generations did 40, 50, 60 years ago. And the current
POP
musical landscape is a cultural wasteland that is nothing to get excited about.

Though, to the extent that there are any musical trends that are currently happening, they are all decidedly retro.

With my addition of one word, i would mostly agree. There IS tons of good, new music out there but it's swamped by crap.

I think music 'mattered' throughout the radio era...

that's your observation, nothing more. ask any teen if music 'matters' the way right now the way it mattered to you in your teen years.
...

I have asked quite a few teens, as have my friends and other people that i know, who are teachers or parents of teens. So far, in my very limited experience (a few hundred teens in 7 states in the US), aside from events, music seems to matter significantly less than what i experienced as a teenager, and what i was told and i've observed, in the late 50s, 60s, 70s, 80, early 90s. I can think of one teenager that cares very much about music (than spans from classical to [unknown] current day music.)
Of the few hundred teens i have met recently that do identify strongly with music, it is usually late 60s-early 90s. Funk, punk, improv rock, goth/new wave, heavy metal, early EDM. Occasionally Motown, grunge. The current bands that play those forms of music interest a good bit of them. These are almost exclusively kids i meet at events which feature these sorts of music, at concerts, festivals, and theaters. So, yes, retro.

Very good summary.
I think the release of Pro Tools in 1990ies also changed music production drastically - everyone was able to produce music in his bedroom.

That's true, everyone can produce music in her/his bedroom now (maybe not quite at the advent of pro tool$$$). It certainly has made less medium famous musicians/music for kids to identify with.


It seems to me that most teenagers do not care much about sex, drugs, and rock and roll, nor driving cars. It's almost all about the tiny little screens in their hands.

TL:DR just my opinion

[Cuauhtli]

^reminds me of a comedian saying babies were going to be born with their hand by their ear when mobile phones first came out. Now they'll be born squinting at the palm of their hand.

[liqih]

But unlike the Boomers and Gen X, the current youth culture doesn’t place music very highly in importance or defining personal identity. Video games and furry conventions and TikTok videos are what matters to this generation.

what's your source for these statements? as a lot of 'current' music has insane stream counts on spotify (for example). hmmm. who's listening?

For what I see it's more consumption than listening. Playlist for running, playlist for driving, playlist for relaxing

[fisherKing]

But unlike the Boomers and Gen X, the current youth culture doesn’t place music very highly in importance or defining personal identity. Video games and furry conventions and TikTok videos are what matters to this generation.

what's your source for these statements? as a lot of 'current' music has insane stream counts on spotify (for example). hmmm. who's listening?

For what I see it's more consumption than listening. Playlist for running, playlist for driving, playlist for relaxing

from what you see? so, no data, just your opinion. and nothing wrong with an opinion, but please don't try to speak for a whole generation

[fisherKing]

With my addition of one word, i would mostly agree. There IS tons of good, new music out there but it's swamped by crap.

really, tho, how is that different from any other era? i'd suggest that the scale has changed, ie from thousands of songs a year to millions, but the percentage of 'great music' (and, to be fair, that plays differently for all of us) is still similarly tiny...

[CrystalWizard]

With my addition of one word, i would mostly agree. There IS tons of good, new music out there but it's swamped by crap.

really, tho, how is that different from any other era? i'd suggest that the scale has changed, ie from thousands of songs a year to millions, but the percentage of 'great music' (and, to be fair, that plays differently for all of us) is still similarly tiny...

That is exactly my point when i say swamped. As you say, the scale has changed , exponentially i would add. When i was younger and went to shows in the City every night, listened to WFMU, WKCR, WNEW, WBGO, the amount of music i really liked was a fairly high percentage of what i was exposed to. And i was extremely fortunate to have that large of an exposure. How does some kid (of any age) find the stuff that moves them to the level of a jimi hendrix or syd barett era PF? It's like the proverbial needle in a haystack. I have a network of friends and they tell me about stuff i'd like. I hear a lot of cool stuff here in the music cafe, on that other VI forum, then follow up on similar musics, a large network of fellow noisemaker friends from years of networking, tape trading, playing live, and bandcamp and soundcloud accounts.
My 18 yr old friend doesn't. He has told me that most of his friends don't really care that much to dig up music, they "listen" to the pop pablum on YT, Spotify, etc. They don't really listen according to him- which checks perfectly with my interactions and observations and second hand accounts of most teenagers. It's mostly just background noise. Kids don't have access to shelves of LP owned by their young stepfather, crates of LPs from a older brother who went off to Uni, and more LPs and later CDs, owned by their jazz drummer new bandmates. They can't even read the liner notes on a physical cardboard LP and follow up on musicians listed (which is how i discovered Brian Eno, which then led to hundreds of other artists.

more TL:DR old guy noise