Please help me decide a hardware synthesizer

[zerocrossing]

cryophonik and zerocrossing:

Thank you, appreciate your suggestions. I understand that these are not proper/actual analog hardware synths, but I want a hardware synth not for the analog sound, but something I can enjoy playing on its own. I am OK with digital hardware synths. I am hoping it will be bring some fun in music production, which sometimes I tend to lose in the box. I have never had any hardware synth, so I thought let me start with something which is familiar in terms of (software) sounds but gives a tactile control.

Also, most of the analog synths are too expensive for me. I would want to get minilogue XD sooner or later as it has that analog sound at an affordable price, but I am looking for more polyphony and a bigger keybed apart from other things.

I wish I could buy UDO Super 6/8, but it is not affordable and not even available in my country.

Do you have any specific recommendations for synths that I should consider checking out? Please note that my budget is $1500 to $2000.

There are plenty of great analog or hybrid synths to be had in your price range. You could probably get a Prophet or OB-6 module used for that, and even of you have RePro or OB-E, they're still a different enough of a character that you'd get a lot out of one. (I have a Prophet 6 module) You could probably get a Super 6 desktop in your rage. No need to pay for a another keyboard if you already have one.

But I'm not anti-digital. I just don't think the synths you listed are that fun to use, as they involve a lot of menu diving. That doesn't mean I don't think they're good. I just feel like if you're really going to get your money's worth out of a hardware synth, it should be as 1:1 knob/function as possible and hopefully get you a bit of a different vibe.

[LoveEnigma18]

I would strongly recommend considering a used synth in excellent condition rather than buying new.

+1

I would take the hardware for fun experience not really for the sound. So, maybe a good used King Korg (nice VA), Korg minilogue XD or DeepMind 6/12 (with a keyboard) would be lasting fun at a reasonable price

I have the MODX (not M or +) and ended wrapping it and put it aside. It has audio over usb (audio interface, 16bit/48K). The clarity using its audio interface is excellent. So the USB connection is enough for both audio and midi.

... Maybe for some fun, Yes

Thank you for your thoughts. Unfortunately, scond hand synths, let alone the ones I mentioned or am interested in, are not much of an option where I live and I would not want to take the risk.

Exactly, fun is important. Not that sound is not important, in fact, for that I really love Korg's minilogue XD and Wavestate SE more. I may even get one or both of them in the future (if I don't decide on them now).

However, it would be good to have some conventional elements as well, which the Roland Fantom-06 and Yamaha MODX M6 have and hence I am leaning towards them. Also, as you mentioned, these have USB audio interfaces, which I don't need as such, but the ability to record both audio and MIDI over USB in the DAW sounds interesting and useful to me.

[LoveEnigma18]

Which one of those can give them chills sometimes when listening to it, even on YT?

Korg Wavestate!

Yes, I am indeed in favour of Korg Wavestate SE and minilogue XD for their sound part, but as we know, they have their limitations, which may affect what I want to achieve. I should be able to afford minilogue XD a bit later to add as a second synth, which leaves me with the the following options for the first synth:

Roland Fantom-06
Yamaha MODX M6
Korg Wavestate SE - this has the advantage of aftertouch, which along with the sound, are the main reasons to keep it in the contender list. I could think of getting the more afforable Korg Wavestate MK2 later if I don't end up buying now, as the SE a bit more expensive.

[LoveEnigma18]

Thank you for the suggestion. Yes, I am leaning towards Roland Fantom-06 or Yamaha MODX M6.

Would you recommend Korg Nautilus AT over them if I could afford it? I loved the sound demos, but I think there are better features and controls on Roland and Yamaha ones barring aftertouch capability, which would surely be nice but not mandatory.

Any of these would match the sounds you're looking for. You might also want to check out the Yamaha CK61 or CK88 for the hands-on experience, or the Yamaha DGX 670 for its Super Articulation voices, which would be something you can't quite get ITB.

Korg Wavestation SE is also something I am really finding interesting even though it is difficult to program, but it does have aftertouch.

Doesn't match the sounds you're looking for.

Thanks, Uncle E. I initially looked at Yamaha CK61/88 and found it interesting (sounds great), but it didn't make it to my shortlist for various reasons. I will take a look again.

While the sound and ability to tweak Korg Wavestate SE is phenomenal, I am a bit skeptic about it wondering if I will be able to fit it in my mixes/music production.

[LoveEnigma18]

to add a "hardware" sound element in my music production.

Based on the budget (or a stretched one) and various considerations, I have shortlisted the options below, but I am unable to decide which one I should get.

As already mentioned, none of those will give you a "hardware sound". They're digital, some of them even ported as plugins and sound identical.

1.Wavestate is a beautiful and versatile synth but not really what you want - it's a steep learning curve to program.

2. Opsix likewise is more versatile than it initially appears and is easier to program than Wavestate but it has a specific character.

3. JunoX - ridiculously overpriced and again veering towards a specific sound character. It really is NOT good value compared to almost any of the others.

4. Hydrasynth. Quite a bit more versatile than the above but as mentioned - I think you have to specifically like its character to love it.

Which leaves Nautilus, Fantom & ModX. You need to try them to see which you best like.

For sheer playability and ease of use you might want to consider something Nord, though they are horrendously overpriced. I doubt you'd get a decent one in your budget range.

Thank you for the detailed breakdown. Trimmed the post intentionally...

Great points! For the reasons you mentioned, which I also thought further about, I have removed the numbered ones from my consideration. Nord is indeed way too expensive.

Unfortunately, I don't have the advantage of getting to play any of these synths where I live, else I would have definitely done that.

Nautilus AT is great, but I am most likely dropping it from the consideration as it is a bit more expensive and lacks hands-on controls. I do love the fact that it comes in a hard case!

(Based on the good discussion and suggestions so far, I have highlighted the further shortlisted options in bold in my OP.)

[LoveEnigma18]

cryophonik and zerocrossing:

Thank you, appreciate your suggestions. I understand that these are not proper/actual analog hardware synths, but I want a hardware synth not for the analog sound, but something I can enjoy playing on its own. I am OK with digital hardware synths. I am hoping it will be bring some fun in music production, which sometimes I tend to lose in the box. I have never had any hardware synth, so I thought let me start with something which is familiar in terms of (software) sounds but gives a tactile control.

Also, most of the analog synths are too expensive for me. I would want to get minilogue XD sooner or later as it has that analog sound at an affordable price, but I am looking for more polyphony and a bigger keybed apart from other things.

I wish I could buy UDO Super 6/8, but it is not affordable and not even available in my country.

Do you have any specific recommendations for synths that I should consider checking out? Please note that my budget is $1500 to $2000.

There are plenty of great analog or hybrid synths to be had in your price range. You could probably get a Prophet or OB-6 module used for that, and even of you have RePro or OB-E, they're still a different enough of a character that you'd get a lot out of one. (I have a Prophet 6 module) You could probably get a Super 6 desktop in your rage. No need to pay for a another keyboard if you already have one.

But I'm not anti-digital. I just don't think the synths you listed are that fun to use, as they involve a lot of menu diving. That doesn't mean I don't think they're good. I just feel like if you're really going to get your money's worth out of a hardware synth, it should be as 1:1 knob/function as possible and hopefully get you a bit of a different vibe.

I agree with your thoughts in general, especially the bold highlighted. It is becoming a bit difficult to strike a balance, so price and availability will also play a key role in what I decide.

I do have software synths like Diva, Repro and all, which covers good ground in terms of VA/analog sounds.

I will check once more along the lines of the options you mentioned and see if anything else becomes an option I could consider.

[Uncle E]

Do you still use Omnisphere? If so, it might be worth noting that Minilogue XD and Hydrasynths are the only ones from your list that hardware integrate with it.

[bmanic]

Of those I'd say the Yamaha MODX M6 is the best bang for the buck (Korg Nautilus probably the most "capable" of those you listed but it's literally double the price of the M6). It has absolutely tremendous range of sounds available, tons of polyphony for create layering and big multitimbral sessions. Just a few days ago I camped in a music store for almost 4 hours playing it. Almost walked home with one but managed to resist.

You can load your own samples onto the thing but apparently the process is a bit convoluted. Still, even if you just stick with the onboard samples and the AN-X VA synth engine, you'll have more than enough things to explore.

I do NOT recommend the Hydrasynth though. I'd strike that off the list immediately. No samples in that one and the VA synth engine is in my opinion it's weakest point. It just doesn't sound very good, no matter how hard you try to tweak it.

Would you recommend Korg Nautilus AT over them if I could afford it? I loved the sound demos, but I think there are better features and controls on Roland and Yamaha ones barring aftertouch capability, which would surely be nice but not mandatory.

No, I'd go for either the Yamaha or the Roland in this case, simply because they have more direct control (one of the most important features to consider when going with hardware over software).

I just wanted to mention that the Korg Nautilus is "technically the most powerful" and capable as it's basically a slightly cut down Korg Kronos. As far as I know it's only missing the Karma engine (which is a high-end mega arp/step sequencer thing). This means that in terms of synthesis capabilities it definitely runs rings around the competition. However, it's going to be a lot of menu diving to get to all the functions and a steep learning curve if you want the most out of it.

I very much agree with everything Zerocrossing has said in this thread. It's very important to take the "what makes hardware unique" aspect into consideration. You really do not want to end up with a synth that feels like a computer with a keyboard attached to it.

Do you still use Omnisphere? If so, it might be worth noting that Minilogue XD and Hydrasynths are the only ones from your list that hardware integrate with it.

This is a GREAT point too. Controlling Omnisphere from a keyboard with tons of knobs per function is really fun and can end up with great creative results. That is definitely a bonus worth considering if you have Omnisphere.

Though in Omnisphere 3.0 they have greatly expanded the list of supported hardware. Both the Yamaha MODX6 and Roland Fantom 06 is supported in the latest version of Omnisphere.

EDIT: Apparently Hydrasynth isn't all that great for Omnisphere control as it doesn't look like they took advantage of the synth architecture buttons.. so it ends up not having all that much control over Omnisphere.

Yamaha MODX6 and Roland Fantom support is even more lacking.

https://support.spectrasonics.net/manua ... h-overview

https://support.spectrasonics.net/manua ... -fantom-06

https://support.spectrasonics.net/manua ... p-the-modx

[Uncle E]

Funny enough, I just got an actual Korg Karma after years of wanting one. It couldn't be more underwhelming.

[zerocrossing]

cryophonik and zerocrossing:

Thank you, appreciate your suggestions. I understand that these are not proper/actual analog hardware synths, but I want a hardware synth not for the analog sound, but something I can enjoy playing on its own. I am OK with digital hardware synths. I am hoping it will be bring some fun in music production, which sometimes I tend to lose in the box. I have never had any hardware synth, so I thought let me start with something which is familiar in terms of (software) sounds but gives a tactile control.

Also, most of the analog synths are too expensive for me. I would want to get minilogue XD sooner or later as it has that analog sound at an affordable price, but I am looking for more polyphony and a bigger keybed apart from other things.

I wish I could buy UDO Super 6/8, but it is not affordable and not even available in my country.

Do you have any specific recommendations for synths that I should consider checking out? Please note that my budget is $1500 to $2000.

There are plenty of great analog or hybrid synths to be had in your price range. You could probably get a Prophet or OB-6 module used for that, and even of you have RePro or OB-E, they're still a different enough of a character that you'd get a lot out of one. (I have a Prophet 6 module) You could probably get a Super 6 desktop in your rage. No need to pay for a another keyboard if you already have one.

But I'm not anti-digital. I just don't think the synths you listed are that fun to use, as they involve a lot of menu diving. That doesn't mean I don't think they're good. I just feel like if you're really going to get your money's worth out of a hardware synth, it should be as 1:1 knob/function as possible and hopefully get you a bit of a different vibe.

I agree with your thoughts in general, especially the bold highlighted. It is becoming a bit difficult to strike a balance, so price and availability will also play a key role in what I decide.

I do have software synths like Diva, Repro and all, which covers good ground in terms of VA/analog sounds.

I will check once more along the lines of the options you mentioned and see if anything else becomes an option I could consider.

Where are you that synths are unavailable?

[lfm]

Where are you that synths are unavailable?

I wonder that too, I think both eBay and Reverb has return options and ratings on sellers and stuff.

I should not be so alarmed buying second hand. But depending on location shipping cost may be considerable.

Wavestate as said, serious amount of planning to make full use of it. Very much browsing for waveforms and stuff, instead of normal synth with oscillators and a few turning of knobs.

Minilogue is very cool, but I would consider Prologue to get more voices, both 8 and 16 versions exist.

Opsix is very cool too, really made FM usable and more than usable, very fun to tweak.
- but Korg went overboard in pricing with full keyboard, for two handed playing

Very much bang for buck is Behringer Deep Mind as well, lots of storage and good effects and everything. And is said to have Juno as roll model.
- there are even 6 voice versions which goes a long way
- and you can choose if keyboard or desktop versions as well
- serious options for modulations etc

So look if wanting more keys for two handed playing and what options are there.

Roland has gone all in making layering sound the main thing, not 'fun factor' tweaking own stuff that much.

[Shabdahbriah]

cryophonik and zerocrossing:

Thank you, appreciate your suggestions. I understand that these are not proper/actual analog hardware synths, but I want a hardware synth not for the analog sound, but something I can enjoy playing on its own. I am OK with digital hardware synths. I am hoping it will be bring some fun in music production, which sometimes I tend to lose in the box. I have never had any hardware synth, so I thought let me start with something which is familiar in terms of (software) sounds but gives a tactile control.

Also, most of the analog synths are too expensive for me. I would want to get minilogue XD sooner or later as it has that analog sound at an affordable price, but I am looking for more polyphony and a bigger keybed apart from other things.

I wish I could buy UDO Super 6/8, but it is not affordable and not even available in my country.

Do you have any specific recommendations for synths that I should consider checking out? Please note that my budget is $1500 to $2000.

There are plenty of great analog or hybrid synths to be had in your price range. You could probably get a Prophet or OB-6 module used for that, and even of you have RePro or OB-E, they're still a different enough of a character that you'd get a lot out of one. (I have a Prophet 6 module) You could probably get a Super 6 desktop in your rage. No need to pay for a another keyboard if you already have one.

But I'm not anti-digital. I just don't think the synths you listed are that fun to use, as they involve a lot of menu diving. That doesn't mean I don't think they're good. I just feel like if you're really going to get your money's worth out of a hardware synth, it should be as 1:1 knob/function as possible and hopefully get you a bit of a different vibe.

I agree with your thoughts in general, especially the bold highlighted. It is becoming a bit difficult to strike a balance, so price and availability will also play a key role in what I decide.

StudioLogic Sledge II Black

Sledge 2 Black Edition.png

Given the 'styles' of music you express interest in making, these tutorials will give you a taste of this synths potential to meet those demands.

[EnGee]

I would strongly recommend considering a used synth in excellent condition rather than buying new.

+1

I would take the hardware for fun experience not really for the sound. So, maybe a good used King Korg (nice VA), Korg minilogue XD or DeepMind 6/12 (with a keyboard) would be lasting fun at a reasonable price

I have the MODX (not M or +) and ended wrapping it and put it aside. It has audio over usb (audio interface, 16bit/48K). The clarity using its audio interface is excellent. So the USB connection is enough for both audio and midi.

... Maybe for some fun, Yes

Thank you for your thoughts. Unfortunately, scond hand synths, let alone the ones I mentioned or am interested in, are not much of an option where I live and I would not want to take the risk.

Exactly, fun is important. Not that sound is not important, in fact, for that I really love Korg's minilogue XD and Wavestate SE more. I may even get one or both of them in the future (if I don't decide on them now).

However, it would be good to have some conventional elements as well, which the Roland Fantom-06 and Yamaha MODX M6 have and hence I am leaning towards them. Also, as you mentioned, these have USB audio interfaces, which I don't need as such, but the ability to record both audio and MIDI over USB in the DAW sounds interesting and useful to me.

Well, I don't know about the Fantom-06 but it depends on what you really want and what is your priority, because you can't have everything, I mean a great workstation + analogue synth. However, MODX is a great rompler + great FM synth. It has thousands of sounds and they are very usable. You can see the mixer of 8+8 channels (8 channels at once). You can transmit 8 channels simultaneously including the drums. So, if you base your workflow on the MODX, then you can choose channel 1 for drums (for example), ch2 for bass, ch3 for pads, ch4 lead, ...etc. You record in midi to your DAW everyone has its track, then you continue for there in your DAW. MODX also has three Midi outs (1, 2 and 3). So, the knobs and sliders can be used as midi controllers (for soft synths) and also can be configure as transport controller (play, stop ..etc) by choosing the functionality (a button switching between the three states).

The keybed is not great, but is ok. There is no aftertouch as well. But still overall, a great keyboard/synth with great sounds (higher than Triton for example for classic sounds). You can also upload into it some great Libraries of analogue sound and piano sounds (the same in the Montage). So, value for money, it is unbeatable really, so that I won't sell it because maybe one day I will use it if I switch to Linux for example

[LoveEnigma18]

Do you still use Omnisphere? If so, it might be worth noting that Minilogue XD and Hydrasynths are the only ones from your list that hardware integrate with it.

EDIT: Apparently Hydrasynth isn't all that great for Omnisphere control as it doesn't look like they took advantage of the synth architecture buttons.. so it ends up not having all that much control over Omnisphere.

Yamaha MODX6 and Roland Fantom support is even more lacking.

https://support.spectrasonics.net/manua ... h-overview

https://support.spectrasonics.net/manua ... -fantom-06

https://support.spectrasonics.net/manua ... p-the-modx

I do use Omnisphere. Thank you for mentioning, I didn't think about this aspect, but it is not so important for me, especially as I use my NI MIDI keyboard with Omnisphere 3.

Perhaps if/when I get minilogue XD I could use it with Omnisphere, so good to know this.

[LoveEnigma18]

Of those I'd say the Yamaha MODX M6 is the best bang for the buck (Korg Nautilus probably the most "capable" of those you listed but it's literally double the price of the M6). It has absolutely tremendous range of sounds available, tons of polyphony for create layering and big multitimbral sessions. Just a few days ago I camped in a music store for almost 4 hours playing it. Almost walked home with one but managed to resist.

You can load your own samples onto the thing but apparently the process is a bit convoluted. Still, even if you just stick with the onboard samples and the AN-X VA synth engine, you'll have more than enough things to explore.

I do NOT recommend the Hydrasynth though. I'd strike that off the list immediately. No samples in that one and the VA synth engine is in my opinion it's weakest point. It just doesn't sound very good, no matter how hard you try to tweak it.

Would you recommend Korg Nautilus AT over them if I could afford it? I loved the sound demos, but I think there are better features and controls on Roland and Yamaha ones barring aftertouch capability, which would surely be nice but not mandatory.

No, I'd go for either the Yamaha or the Roland in this case, simply because they have more direct control (one of the most important features to consider when going with hardware over software).

I just wanted to mention that the Korg Nautilus is "technically the most powerful" and capable as it's basically a slightly cut down Korg Kronos. As far as I know it's only missing the Karma engine (which is a high-end mega arp/step sequencer thing). This means that in terms of synthesis capabilities it definitely runs rings around the competition. However, it's going to be a lot of menu diving to get to all the functions and a steep learning curve if you want the most out of it.

I very much agree with everything Zerocrossing has said in this thread. It's very important to take the "what makes hardware unique" aspect into consideration. You really do not want to end up with a synth that feels like a computer with a keyboard attached to it.

Appreciate the further thoughts. How did you find the keybed on the MODX M6 by the way?

Yes, Korg Nautilus is great and certainly powerful based on various videos I have seen, but it is a bit on the expensive side and lacks phyiscal controls. I thought I'd rather save the extra money to get minilogue XD or Wavestate MK2.

The good thing about Fantom-06 and MODX M6 has a lot of physical controls and they have a good display too, which I think is an important factor to consider for a hardware synth (of this type at least).