Future of Windows in pro audio

[Grizzellda]

I do understand that this is a Windows thread.

Linux really looks like an ongoing "work in progress" to me, and quite frankly, this thread alone...all the ideas you guys are throwing out, this is part of the evolution of Linux!

In real time, on the fly!

The future of Windows is AI driven tyranny and doom.
It's unfortunate or something, but that's where reality is at.

Awe, come on, tell us whatcha really think!

[bjm4tt]

With every single aspect, audio, latency, video, codecs, desktop environments I just wanted to have the basic defaults to work, but had to learn about the whole history of KDE, GNOME, the Nvidia feud, Plasma, Wayland, X11, Flatpak, Yabrige, Wine 9.21, EDID, kernel parameters, xrandr, kscreen doctor, power-profiles-daemon, cpupowergui.

And at the end, something was always broken.

I don't like the direction Microsoft is heading, but for now I'd rather try to live with it, than dealing with a primadonna OS. That't the bitter conclusion for me.

I don't want to dismiss what you're saying as crazy, but I have to admit, it sounds insane.
Why were you messing with all those things?
And btw, not a fan of Ubuntu.

I was messing with those things, because without doing so,

• I had audio dropouts under load (power-profiles-daemon, cpupowergui, kernel params)
• I had stuttery/lagging UI, even when just resizing or moving a window (nvidia vs amd, Plasma, Wayland, X11, KDE, GNOME)
• I could not switch between different display setups without plugging cables, using KVM, or manually reconfiguring settings, logging in/out (EDID, xrandr, wlr-randr, kscreen doctor)
• I could not use at least a fraction of my plugins (Flatpak, Yabrige, Wine 9.21, bottles)

The last two points were much less important then the first two, but there was not a single setup from the many where all of these worked. I was ready to make many compromises, like:

• replacing my perfectly working nvidia 1050 card, because I learned, that nvidia does/did not play nice with linux, closed source drivers, etc
• replacing another perfectly working new nvidia 5060 card, after I've read a lot of feedbacks, that nvidia drivers are now better with newer cards
• losing the ability of plugging my 2 desktop monitors in my displaylink capable usb-c hub, which "just works" in windows, while with the linux drivers it's much slower and causes laggy UI rendering
• downsizing my plugin collection by 90% because of the lack of linux support

I understand that a combination of certain configurations and user expectations exists, when it works, but I got tired of finding that one. The OS is for me and not the other way around.

I also do think, that when I'm reading about working setups, those are cases of survivorship bias.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Survivorship_bias

Sorry for the off topic and I don't have any ill feelings about desktop linux and appreciate all the hard work that goes into open source, and things like yabridge, but for me it was a deeply disappointing experience after reading that "linux in 2026 is not the same as 10 or 20 years ago". For me it's pretty much the same.

[dellboy]

but for me it was a deeply disappointing experience after reading that "linux in 2026 is not the same as 10 or 20 years ago". For me it's pretty much the same.

I am surprised that you find it the same as 10 or 20 years ago. I think it has improved a lot since then.

[dellboy]

I recently bought an M4 Mac Mini and finding it great for Music work, but for everything else I go back to my win 11 machine. For instance, Mac OS has no "right click delete"? Whats that about? It makes doing any serious work with external SSD's very tiring, dragging each file to a bin on the taskbar.

[Tiles]

but for me it was a deeply disappointing experience after reading that "linux in 2026 is not the same as 10 or 20 years ago". For me it's pretty much the same.

I am surprised that you find it the same as 10 or 20 years ago. I think it has improved a lot since then.

Not in the areas where it really matters, at least in my experience.
For example, I installed LM Studio on Windows and Linux. On Windows you run the installer, download the models, and you’re good to go. On Linux, the AppImage didn’t work due to sandbox issues, and I had to search for a workaround first. The application does not retain the model paths, so I have to re-enter them with every use, and it does not update automatically. Each new version requires repeating the setup and workaround. That kind of friction is still fairly common on Linux and often interrupts actual work, sometimes briefly, sometimes far more than expected, and sometimes you simply have to give up.

In some respects it has even become worse. And I think you’re overlooking that Windows and macOS have also continued to improve over the same period. In direct comparison, the gap has actually grown.

[dellboy]

I am writing this from a 2018 lenovo laptop running Linux Mint. The reason I am using this machine is because I had a strange file in Win 11 that stubbornly refused to delete. I Logged into Linux Mint, "right clicked delete", and the file is gone! This is where Linux shines. One of the main tools I have used in Linux over the years is "Gparted" partition manager, its free, and brilliant for disk management.

[macmoffatt]

Mac OS has no "right click delete"? Whats that about? It makes doing any serious work with external SSD's very tiring, dragging each file to a bin on the taskbar. Right click with an Apple mouse

[dellboy]

but for me it was a deeply disappointing experience after reading that "linux in 2026 is not the same as 10 or 20 years ago". For me it's pretty much the same.

I am surprised that you find it the same as 10 or 20 years ago. I think it has improved a lot since then.

Not in the areas where it really matters, at least in my experience.
For example, I installed LM Studio on Windows and Linux. On Windows you run the installer, download the models, and you’re good to go. On Linux, the AppImage didn’t work due to sandbox issues, and I had to search for a workaround first. The application does not retain the model paths, so I have to re-enter them with every use, and it does not update automatically. Each new version requires repeating the setup and workaround. That kind of friction is still fairly common on Linux and often interrupts actual work, sometimes briefly, sometimes far more than expected, and sometimes you simply have to give up.

In some respects it has even become worse. And I think you’re overlooking that Windows and macOS have also continued to improve over the same period. In direct comparison, the gap has actually grown.

My main machine for music making is a Mac Min M4. Mac OS is the main OS I would recommend for music work because it "just works". For everyday use I have a 2022 Ryzen 7 laptop running win 11, and it can also do music very competently. I also have this laptop I am typing from running Linux Mint, and if push came to shove I could use this for making music.

[dellboy]

Mac OS has no "right click delete"? Whats that about? It makes doing any serious work with external SSD's very tiring, dragging each file to a bin on the taskbar. Right click with an Apple mouse

I am new to Mac OS, but as far as I can see "Move to Bin" only works for internal files, I am trying to do work on an external 4TB nvme formatted as exFAT.

[macmoffatt]

with MS DOS and ExFAT on an external drive it is exactly the same

[dellboy]

with MS DOS and ExFAT on an external drive it is exactly the same

That explains it. I have just checked, and the external drive is formatted "ntfs" (windows) which I guess is why no "right click Move to Bin" is possible. Before I can use it with my Mac Mini I need to clear it of years of files and re-format it, and I find working in either Win11 or Linux easier (at present) to accomplish that task.

[BertKoor]

I need to clear it of years of files and re-format it, and I find working in either Win11 or Linux far easier to accomplish that task.

I don't know how people can live without a reincarnation of the Norton Commander

Code: Select all

brew install double-commander

[F3] - view
[F6] - move
[F8] - delete

[dellboy]

I need to clear it of years of files and re-format it, and I find working in either Win11 or Linux far easier to accomplish that task.

I don't know how people can live without a reincarnation of the Norton Commander

Code: Select all

brew install double-commander

[F3] - view
[F6] - move
[F8] - delete

Thanks for that, I will give it a try later.

[bjm4tt]

but for me it was a deeply disappointing experience after reading that "linux in 2026 is not the same as 10 or 20 years ago". For me it's pretty much the same.

I am surprised that you find it the same as 10 or 20 years ago. I think it has improved a lot since then.

Same in that sense, that I'm still fighting with it, instead of forgetting about it and using it as a tool. Solve one problem, and get 2 more as a reward. That's what I mean.

It's really a shame, Bitwig, Reaper and the U-He portfolio covers pretty much all I need for audio prod. Resolve and Kdenlive for video, and web dev stuff was always the strong suit of linux.

[macmoffatt]

yes to read and write a new format is necessary, ntfs format as far as I can remember is read only for MacOS. If the drive is full and important, 4 TB is a lot to move somewhere else.