KVR Audio

D-Fusion · Post by **D-Fusion** » Wed May 06, 2026 11:09 am

The reason why they are seen as one of the big players is because it was less to choose from back then and not because they where the best.

I feel the same when it comes to the Vintage Synth market now that we have newer HW Synths and Vst's that are just as good and in some cases better than what we had in the past.

The Tools we had back then was good at that time because we had very little to compare it with and we had to use what we had.

DrGonzo · Post by **DrGonzo** » Wed May 06, 2026 11:14 am

zvenx wrote: Wed May 06, 2026 11:00 am Yamaha owns Steinberg and has for many years (since 2004), what has Waves done to survive that NI hasn't?

I don't think Waves have ever axed any of their software plugins. Hate their wrapper/wup as much as people do - but their stuff is like a time machine. If NI would have been Waves, Kore would still be usable, Spectral Delay as well as all the other Kontakt variations (Kompakt, Impact etc).

zvenx · Post by **zvenx** » Wed May 06, 2026 11:17 am

You may be right. But I never get the sense that there is a lot of good will for Waves amongnus practioners.
Also SB has also a large history of abandoning hardwar and software.
rsp

Sascha Franck · Post by **Sascha Franck** » Wed May 06, 2026 11:18 am

DrGonzo wrote: Wed May 06, 2026 5:30 am I don't agree with you the downturn started around 2024. Most people I talk to see the downturn began much earlier. Perhaps the first major point was Kore when things started to go south.

I think it's been a combination of things. The creative master minds leaving (obviously Stephan Schmitt comes to mind first but also Wolfgang Schneider, responsible for Kontakt and Battery), products being abandoned left and right, development going downhill (obviously Kore but also, say, Battery, yuck...) and then their "relationships" with private equity.
FAFO all over the place.

DrGonzo · Post by **DrGonzo** » Wed May 06, 2026 11:22 am

Sascha Franck wrote: Wed May 06, 2026 11:18 am
DrGonzo wrote: Wed May 06, 2026 5:30 am I don't agree with you the downturn started around 2024. Most people I talk to see the downturn began much earlier. Perhaps the first major point was Kore when things started to go south.
I think it's been a combination of things. The creative master minds leaving (obviously Stephan Schmitt comes to mind first but also Wolfgang Schneider, responsible for Kontakt and Battery), products being abandoned left and right, development going downhill (obviously Kore but also, say, Battery, yuck...) and then their "relationships" with private equity.
FAFO all over the place.

Yes. 2024 was not The point of their downturn. It's been many before that.

Anyway - it's cool that they will attend Superbooth this year though.

zvenx · Post by **zvenx** » Wed May 06, 2026 11:24 am

Some are very attached to their Kore, but I would be shocked if that played a significant part in it.

rsp

zvenx · Post by **zvenx** » Wed May 06, 2026 11:26 am

For sure there is way more competition now.
Lots of independent developers making great products.
NI is the only one afaik diverse enough to do products for both Djs and musicians.
Did that play a part? That is, they were spread to thin?
rsp

Sascha Franck · Post by **Sascha Franck** » Wed May 06, 2026 11:28 am

zvenx wrote: Wed May 06, 2026 11:24 am Some are very attached to their Kore, but I would be shocked if that played a significant part in it.

It likely wasn't. But it perfectly demonstrated their attitude.

zvenx · Post by **zvenx** » Wed May 06, 2026 11:29 am

Sascha Franck wrote: Wed May 06, 2026 11:28 am
zvenx wrote: Wed May 06, 2026 11:24 am Some are very attached to their Kore, but I would be shocked if that played a significant part in it.
It likely wasn't. But it perfectly demonstrated their attitude.

Fair enough.
rsp

D-Fusion · Post by **D-Fusion** » Wed May 06, 2026 12:20 pm

zvenx wrote: Wed May 06, 2026 11:26 am For sure there is way more competition now.
Lots of independent developers making great products.
NI is the only one afaik diverse enough to do products for both Djs and musicians.
Did that play a part? That is, they were spread to thin?
rsp

The issue i have seen over and over again with NI is that they quickly kills a product to make you buy the latest one so buying into their Hardware Eco system Is something i try to stay away from.
I do own a Maschine MK3 that i haven't used in years because of their slow updates and lack of good support and improvements.

Kore is a good example of that and their older Kontrol Series Keyboards.
https://discuss.cakewalk.com/topic/6746 ... 1-is-dead/

Echoes in the Attic · Post by **Echoes in the Attic** » Wed May 06, 2026 1:45 pm

I remember before the Komplete Keyboards came out, someone from Ni was on a panel at some synth convention, maybe superbooth or something, taking about how the software/hardware integration could be a lot better, and they were working that. Since Maschine and Kore were already out at the time, I was really excited as I thought that meant they were working on a maschine-like software/hardware synth system with full hardware control. But what did they do? They took the basic kore idea of 8 macro knobs and put it in a keyboard, but removed all the god stuff like morphing and layering and the 8 buttons per page and massively simplified the format so it was just controlling the plugin directly, which is actually insanely annoying because the macros aren't separate automatable controls, meaning you can't map them out consistently (e.g. bitwig hardware controls or ableton device configuration) and have them work between different plugins in KK.

zvenx · Post by **zvenx** » Wed May 06, 2026 1:59 pm

For the Kore lovers, why do you think they abandoned Kore? (I don't know the actual answer, I am just curious. I can't imagine they would abandon it and not replace it with a like hardware (like Maschine 1, to Maschine 2 to Maschine 3) if it was doing well for them.
rsp

DrGonzo · Post by **DrGonzo** » Wed May 06, 2026 2:12 pm

zvenx wrote: Wed May 06, 2026 1:59 pm For the Kore lovers, why do you think they abandoned Kore? (I don't know the actual answer, I am just curious. I can't imagine they would abandon it and not replace it with a like hardware (like Maschine 1, to Maschine 2 to Maschine 3) if it was doing well for them.
rsp

My only guess is that didn't sell well enough and was a big drain on resources. If it was easy to maintain and create content for, I am sure they would have kept it even if it was a slow burner.

zvenx · Post by **zvenx** » Wed May 06, 2026 2:45 pm

DrGonzo wrote: Wed May 06, 2026 2:12 pm
zvenx wrote: Wed May 06, 2026 1:59 pm For the Kore lovers, why do you think they abandoned Kore? (I don't know the actual answer, I am just curious. I can't imagine they would abandon it and not replace it with a like hardware (like Maschine 1, to Maschine 2 to Maschine 3) if it was doing well for them.
rsp
My only guess is that didn't sell well enough and was a big drain on resources. If it was easy to maintain and create content for, I am sure they would have kept it even if it was a slow burner.

That qould be my guess too.
rsp

mumpcake · Post by **mumpcake** » Wed May 06, 2026 3:03 pm

DrGonzo wrote: Wed May 06, 2026 2:12 pm
zvenx wrote: Wed May 06, 2026 1:59 pm For the Kore lovers, why do you think they abandoned Kore? (I don't know the actual answer, I am just curious. I can't imagine they would abandon it and not replace it with a like hardware (like Maschine 1, to Maschine 2 to Maschine 3) if it was doing well for them.
rsp
My only guess is that didn't sell well enough and was a big drain on resources. If it was easy to maintain and create content for, I am sure they would have kept it even if it was a slow burner.

From the standpoint of a software developer from outside the company, it looked like the type of product that would have been a nightmare to maintain.

Native Instruments Komplete 26 released