Fender Studio Pro 8 Released

[stoopicus]

I don't know about you guys, but when I think of what uses extra tracks in my projects it's generally very simple needs and always done in pursuit of simplicity. It's not usually about a bajillion instruments.

Examples:
- Drums, often I want to split each out to separate tracks and put them under a drum bus, so you can individually mix and effect the different drums. This usually adds about 8-10 tracks but it's still one logical "instrument". Some drum plugins do this internally for you and then provide separate outs; this is the same thing just hidden a layer deeper. You still effectively have all those tracks but they are hidden inside the plugin and not visible on the DAW timeline.
- Samples. For things like one-shot vocal samples or movie quotes or things like that, I find if much simpler to just have a separate track for them and drop them in the DAW timeline rather than use a sampler instrument, which I save for actual musical sounds. This will usually add ~5-10 tracks.
- Recorded or bounced hardware instruments. This often makes sense to record and/or bounce to separate tracks which you throw under an effects bus. You can often just collapse these to a single track, and again - these are logically one instrument each.
- Pads. Sometimes you find or make a really interesting layered pad sound but the instrument itself runs out of voices. I've doubled up instrument tracks in this case, but it's really the only case, and there's other ways to solve this.

[jens]

But he doesn't really explain the cleverness in that

There's cleverness in that?

[heliacal]

Apples & Oranges.

Did you watch it? It's a template that contains everything he might want to use and only two of the instruments in it are polyphonic. It's mostly sample-based stuff he's made himself in Kontakt and once the Kontakt engine is running, multiple instances won't tax the CPU too much more than the first one did. It will chew up memory pretty quickly, which can be expanded easily enough with paging files, but not so much the CPU.

Of course I watched it, like years ago. Been using that method for years. I do Cinematic/Trailer composition. Cubase is really the only game in town for this way of working. Yes, the idea is to have everything you might want to use out of all of your millions of samples libraries and synth presets, in one template, pre-routed, ready for action. Using things like Metagrid enables you to navigate these huge templates with ease, showing and hiding whatever you want to see and use.

Its NOT mostly samples he created himself, he uses a lot of commercially available mainstream libraries.

To be fair at the time of this recording, he had a computer room with 6 servers running VEPro so everything is available instantly. Ya, sure overkill, but he's a top Hollywood film composer and most of them operate the same way, Zimmer, Morris etc so they must know what they are doing...

For those interested in this method of working, but probably not very KVR:

[heliacal]

But he doesn't really explain the cleverness in that

There's cleverness in that?

Definitely not for the 10 track generic I use 6 DAW hobby masters...

[jens]

But he doesn't really explain the cleverness in that

There's cleverness in that?

Definitely not for the 10 track generic I use 6 DAW hobby masters...

It's absurd period. (And you're making a quite common logical mistake.)


And by the way, since you mentioned Hans Zimmer: that would be the one who said it's a myth that you can't make the soundtrack to a Hollywood blockbuster on an iPad.

[noremorze]

It's always the people with the least amount of knowlegde who are the loudest about anything. Dunning-Kruger effect on full display.

[noremorze]

Most, if not all working film composers split articulations between Legato, Longs, and Shorts and use many libraries from different companies, for colour and/or because every library has it's shortcomings. Alot also use 1 track for each articulation, and for good reason. Big templates are the reason why people who work with strict deadlines get anything done.

Any working composer worth anything will have access to an actual orchestra, surely? Because film directors/producers don't know dick about articulations but it's easy to convince them that hiring a studio and an orchestra will be great for their film. It's all about ego, on both sides.

Apples & Oranges.

Did you watch it? It's a template that contains everything he might want to use and only two of the instruments in it are polyphonic. It's mostly sample-based stuff he's made himself in Kontakt and once the Kontakt engine is running, multiple instances won't tax the CPU too much more than the first one did. It will chew up memory pretty quickly, which can be expanded easily enough with paging files, but not so much the CPU. But he doesn't really explain the cleverness in that and the morons watching it think it means they can run 200 plugins at once. And he sure as hell didn't need 200 instruments to do his best work -

This shows you don’t understand how modern scoring works. 99% of working composers, including big names, do NOT have access to an orchestra for every project. Budgets, schedules, revisions, mockups, and director approvals all depend on large templates and separated articulations. Even when a live orchestra is hired, the mockup still needs to sound finished because that’s what gets approved. Templates has nothing to with ego, they are workflow.

[pekbro]

Still no demo, weak...

[noremorze]

But he doesn't really explain the cleverness in that

There's cleverness in that?

Definitely not for the 10 track generic I use 6 DAW hobby masters...

It's absurd period. (And you're making a quite common logical mistake.)


And by the way, since you mentioned Hans Zimmer: that would be the one who said it's a myth that you can't make the soundtrack to a Hollywood blockbuster on an iPad.

He was talking about sketching, not delivering a full mockup or a final score.

[jens]

He was talking about sketching, not delivering a full mockup or a final score.

U sure? Source?

Either way: which part of say the Social Network or the Fight Club OST would you say could not be done on (say) an iPad?

But all this is of course bollocks anyway - hands up anyone in here who ever did the soundtrack to a successful commercial feature film. (I know Putte does (or at least did) but his setup used to be very modest and I bet that didn't change much in the meantime.)

So I assume most of the recent talk here in this thread is sort of a special kind of dry humping. You'll never get laid, but you're nonetheless highly disciplined in regards to following your training schedule in case you would.

("My pelvis is in perfect shape for when she's ready." - "Oh come on Fred, you're 42 and still living with your mom!" )

[pk-1]

Templates has nothing to with ego, they are workflow.

Indeed - the template is not about the instruments, but their embedding into the arrangement. Buses, routing, effects, send/receive levels, gain staging etc. are all preconfigured in the template. When you need an instrument in a certain situation, you activate it in the template and get everything that's needed in one go.

And here's why I'm saying: In Studio One/FSP, you wouldn't work like that. You can do most of these things with track presets. Instead of activating an instrument in the template, you drag the track preset into the arrangement. Your library of track presets replaces the template. I'm not saying that this technique is fully equivalent, but in many cases, it'll do the job just as well.

[noremorze]

He was talking about sketching, not delivering a full mockup or a final score.

U sure? Source?

Either way: which part of say the Social Network or the Fight Club OST would you say could not be done on (say) an iPad?

But all this is of course bollocks anyway - hands up anyone in here who ever did the soundtrack to a successful commercial feature film. (I know Putte does (or at least did) but his setup used to be very modest and I bet that didn't change much in the meantime.)

So I assume most of the recent talk here in this thread is sort of a special kind of dry humping. You'll never get laid, but you're nonetheless highly disciplined in regards to following your training schedule in case you would.

("My pelvis is in perfect shape for when she's ready." - "Oh come on Fred, you're 42 and still living with your mom!" )

It comes from his Masterclass on scoring trailer, he is literally talking about ideas. "The interesting ideas come from some kid in a garage in the Bronx. You just need to break through the myth that you can't create a great Hollywood blockbuster on an iPad. If you have a story, you can do whatever you want to do." What he is saying here is that ideas are not limited by budget.You could also ask him yourself directly on the Vi-C forums. If you really think that he meant that you'd be able to make a mockup that is suited for film on an iPad then I don't know what else to say.

[noremorze]

Templates has nothing to with ego, they are workflow.

Indeed - the template is not about the instruments, but their embedding into the arrangement. Buses, routing, effects, send/receive levels, gain staging etc. are all preconfigured in the template. When you need an instrument in a certain situation, you activate it in the template and get everything that's needed in one go.

And here's why I'm saying: In Studio One/FSP, you wouldn't work like that. You can do most of these things with track presets. Instead of activating an instrument in the template, you drag the track preset into the arrangement. Your library of track presets replaces the template. I'm not saying that this technique is fully equivalent, but in many cases, it'll do the job just as well.

It is a valid way of working for sure, for alot of people. Still, I don't see many people who work on tight deadlines use that approach, they simply don't have the time to go through track presets. A template with everything available will always be faster. For me personally, I still prefer to use a template with disabled tracks even in FSP.

[BONES]

There's cleverness in that?

Yeah, in leveraging one engine for all your tracks. One instance of Kontakt 8 with Ferrum Free loaded uses 2-3% of my available CPU power. 16 instances goes up to around 10% and 64 instances is just nudging 20%. If I'd loaded different instruments, the CPU would have maxxed out well before I got to 64 tracks.

It's a thing I miss about Orion - if an instrument wasn't actually generating audio, it went to sleep and used no CPU. It would be the perfect thing for a huge template like JXL's. Studio One got "plugin nap" in v6 but it only applies to effects.

Yes, the idea is to have everything you might want to use out of all of your millions of samples libraries and synth presets, in one template, pre-routed, ready for action.

You get a lot of last minute jobs, do you? Because what I see there is something that means nothing will ever be quick and easy, even the simplest thing becomes a massive, unwieldy process. It might work for a real, working composer like JXL, who made his millions decades ago and doesn't need to take every little job he's offered, but I don't see much value in it for anyone who has time to post on music forums.

Using things like Metagrid enables you to navigate these huge templates with ease, showing and hiding whatever you want to see and use.

Off the top of my head I can think of much better, more flexible ways to be organised. The most obvious is to organise your plugins and presets so that you can find and load things more quickly. I can't recall if Cubase has it or not, but Studio One allows you to sort in several different ways that would facilitate this without the burden of having to load a ginormous template every time.

To be fair at the time of this recording, he had a computer room with 6 servers running VEPro so everything is available instantly. Ya, sure overkill, but he's a top Hollywood film composer and most of them operate the same way, Zimmer, Morris etc so they must know what they are doing...

Yeah but you don't have a server room so why the f**k would you attempt to work the same way? You also need to realise that having the big impressive studio and server room will get you work just because it impresses clueless idiots with money who don't necessarily have the first clue about any of it. You wouldn't believe how many Flames we sold at Discreet Logic purely because having a $250,000 Flame in your post production facility would attract customers (yes, like moths to a Flame), even though 9 times out of 10 they could have got the job done on a $5,000 PC workstation for literally one-tenth of the price. That's kind of how the industry works - impressing idiots who have money to burn with your big, fancy set-up.

This shows you don’t understand how modern scoring works. 99% of working composers, including big names, do NOT have access to an orchestra for every project. Budgets, schedules, revisions, mockups, and director approvals all depend on large templates and separated articulations. Even when a live orchestra is hired, the mockup still needs to sound finished because that’s what gets approved. Templates has nothing to with ego, they are workflow.

And this shows that you have no f**king idea which rung of the ladder you're standing on and what woudl work a whole lot better for someone in that position.

[Vocalpoint Studios]

Still no demo, weak...

Won’t see that until v8.1

Apparently coming very soon

VP