Hi,
I am using A4000 and would like to buy a soft sampler in the near future. I am also using Winxp with AMD 2500+ and 1G RAM.
Kontact, MACH Five and Emulator-x are on my list. Most of the users said that go for K2 but according to Mach-Five 2.0's new feature, it is a not bad product. But heard that Mach-five eats alot of ...memory. What do you choose if you were me ? Humm.. One more important thing : I need a sampler which can do the drum loop chopping !
I recenlty bought Maudio's FW1814 sound card. By now, I think I don't have chance to buy E-X. I don't know why Emu release a pure soft sampler rather than force the buyer to buy their sound card + sampling software !#$@#$
Cowby
A hard sampler user wants to GO soft !
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- KVRAF
- 7316 posts since 7 Mar, 2003
My Youtube Channel - Wires Dream Disasters
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atomic_(no)afro atomic_(no)afro https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=5043
- KVRian
- 622 posts since 18 Dec, 2002
Wait til kontakt goes on clearance in anticipation for 2.0, then buy it and get the free or reduced upgrade to 2.0 and save a bundle. Kontakt is great, it has a few minor issues regarding its mono/portamento style but I'm sure that's going to be cleared up in 2.0. MachFive is a solid choice too, as is VSampler. The main reason I would say go for Kontakt (when it goes on clearance, which should be fairly soon so keep checking musiciansfriend, sweetwater, audiomidi, etc.), is that you're going to save yourself some money when you buy it when it's at its lowest price point, which is right before til right after a major update and music stores are liquidating their stock in order to make room for the new version.
ATA
ATA
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- KVRian
- 1327 posts since 8 Nov, 2003 from DC
I'm an A4000 user too. I love that box. Once you've endured the hellish load times, I think its greatest strengths are its ability to easily set up layered patches mangled or sweetend with filters and effects, and resampling with effects. That and the brilliant sound quality, of course.
In terms of the former, I like SampleTank 2. It has the best in ease of use terms set up for putting together layers routed through effects individually and with an excellent set of synth parameters at the instrument level. Like the Yamaha piece it has an excelent (but not as large) selection of effects with multiple effects per patch. With 5 efffect slots per instrument, it's actually closer to the A5000's 6. It also resembles the A4000 by having a huge all around included library that might not be as good as dedicated libraries but is almost comprehensively diverse and of very good production useable quality. The down side of ST2 from a purely sampling POV if you're used to building your own sounds is the import facilities are somewhat crude and limited. The addition of zone range controls in 2.1 will improve this however. But as a sample playing synth, ST2 plays the traditional role of the A4000 in my system very well indeed.
In terms of resampling, well they all do it via your host sequencer. However I should mention that I like VSampler for being a VST host itself, so it has to be given props as leading the pack in built in effects by default, even though its own bundled effects aren't as good as SampleTank's. Also, I find that although ST2 and Wusikstation get more work than NNXT at the moment as my main synths, Reason remains my number one loop construction tool. The sequencer is straightforward and it's very easy to set up loop or whole song export to a stereo wav file. This usage as my #1 resampler will be even more so with the Combinator module in 3.0, and I think that the PITA factor of ReWire notwithstanding, Reason will be seeing a renaisance in my actual productions. By the way, NNXT is the best in my experience, hard or soft at instrument building. Keymapping, velocity switching and layering are an absolute snap.
Only Emulator X among soft samplers to my knowledge has the ability to record itself, that is a strength of its coupling with the Emu soundcards. I have an 1820m, and love it. I don't have EX because my computer is below its minmum spec. That will change soon after I upgrade. Editing at the sample level is available to my knowledge in Emulator X, VSampler and Kontakt. However, you should have a good editor program anyway, so I don't see that as a priority, though it is a legitimate plus for those apps. I'm afraid I really don't know Mach 5.
In any case, good hunting. Getting any or any combination of these instruments as well as the ones you mention is a winner for you.
In terms of the former, I like SampleTank 2. It has the best in ease of use terms set up for putting together layers routed through effects individually and with an excellent set of synth parameters at the instrument level. Like the Yamaha piece it has an excelent (but not as large) selection of effects with multiple effects per patch. With 5 efffect slots per instrument, it's actually closer to the A5000's 6. It also resembles the A4000 by having a huge all around included library that might not be as good as dedicated libraries but is almost comprehensively diverse and of very good production useable quality. The down side of ST2 from a purely sampling POV if you're used to building your own sounds is the import facilities are somewhat crude and limited. The addition of zone range controls in 2.1 will improve this however. But as a sample playing synth, ST2 plays the traditional role of the A4000 in my system very well indeed.
In terms of resampling, well they all do it via your host sequencer. However I should mention that I like VSampler for being a VST host itself, so it has to be given props as leading the pack in built in effects by default, even though its own bundled effects aren't as good as SampleTank's. Also, I find that although ST2 and Wusikstation get more work than NNXT at the moment as my main synths, Reason remains my number one loop construction tool. The sequencer is straightforward and it's very easy to set up loop or whole song export to a stereo wav file. This usage as my #1 resampler will be even more so with the Combinator module in 3.0, and I think that the PITA factor of ReWire notwithstanding, Reason will be seeing a renaisance in my actual productions. By the way, NNXT is the best in my experience, hard or soft at instrument building. Keymapping, velocity switching and layering are an absolute snap.
Only Emulator X among soft samplers to my knowledge has the ability to record itself, that is a strength of its coupling with the Emu soundcards. I have an 1820m, and love it. I don't have EX because my computer is below its minmum spec. That will change soon after I upgrade. Editing at the sample level is available to my knowledge in Emulator X, VSampler and Kontakt. However, you should have a good editor program anyway, so I don't see that as a priority, though it is a legitimate plus for those apps. I'm afraid I really don't know Mach 5.
In any case, good hunting. Getting any or any combination of these instruments as well as the ones you mention is a winner for you.
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- KVRian
- Topic Starter
- 1151 posts since 2 Feb, 2005
Thanks you for all your prompt reply!
Bassballjg,
I don't think any soft samplers got as many effect types as A4000 ! But the point is there is only one software editor (bzone) which helps me tweak the sample. I am not very much like turning knobs in the front panel with a very small screen with sub-sub-menus. Also, the loop divide is not as smart as NI's Intact or Dicer ?! Everybody needs loop chopping to create a fresh drum loop, right ?
Sample Tank ... Seen their online demo. Well nice sounding but I don't treat it as a "True" sampler (To me it just like a hardware XV-5080 or Motif Rack) but the lib. it provides are pretty useful.
Anyone knows if Halion 3 do the chopping and auto map to the keys ?
Regards!
Cowby
Bassballjg,
I don't think any soft samplers got as many effect types as A4000 ! But the point is there is only one software editor (bzone) which helps me tweak the sample. I am not very much like turning knobs in the front panel with a very small screen with sub-sub-menus. Also, the loop divide is not as smart as NI's Intact or Dicer ?! Everybody needs loop chopping to create a fresh drum loop, right ?
Sample Tank ... Seen their online demo. Well nice sounding but I don't treat it as a "True" sampler (To me it just like a hardware XV-5080 or Motif Rack) but the lib. it provides are pretty useful.
Anyone knows if Halion 3 do the chopping and auto map to the keys ?
Regards!
Cowby
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- KVRAF
- 4738 posts since 20 Feb, 2004 from Gothenburg, Sweden
Also, if you're into mangling and manipulation of sounds, check out shortcircuit. Download the free (but polyphony and instance limited) version at http://www.vemberaudio.com
Stefan H Singer
https://dropshotaudio.com/
https://dropshotaudio.com/
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- KVRist
- 113 posts since 19 Feb, 2003
Well, it depends on the things you'd like to do, but probably I'd say Kontakt and Halion 3...
I had an a3000 too....
but some libraries today are really gorgeous, not really comparable to the ones we had on our samplers... think of Scarbee' stuff, or also PMI (Post Musica Instruments) 's pianos, etc.... you'll have fun!
I had an a3000 too....
but some libraries today are really gorgeous, not really comparable to the ones we had on our samplers... think of Scarbee' stuff, or also PMI (Post Musica Instruments) 's pianos, etc.... you'll have fun!
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- KVRist
- 99 posts since 13 Jan, 2005
HI
Yes I too had a fully loaded A5000, I still cant think of anything that does pitch shifting as good as that did - great on vocals as well.
I would go for Kontakt V2 it will be out soon and could be the only software you would need.
I had Halion V3 - nice mapping but it didn't do it for me.
Porpoise.
Yes I too had a fully loaded A5000, I still cant think of anything that does pitch shifting as good as that did - great on vocals as well.
I would go for Kontakt V2 it will be out soon and could be the only software you would need.
I had Halion V3 - nice mapping but it didn't do it for me.
Porpoise.
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- KVRian
- 940 posts since 11 Mar, 2001 from nyc
im looking for details on the sampler but dont see it...
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- KVRAF
- 13444 posts since 14 Nov, 2000 from Hannover / Germany
VSampler3 has a fully functional 30-days demo.
Worth checking (even if I find the GUI rather irritating).
Shortcircuit has a fully functional free version, limited to 2 note polyphony.
EnergyXT has a save-disabled, otherwise fully functional demo.
I'd recommend checking them all out first.
Personally, I like Kontakt a lot, but IMO it all depends on what features you need.
Kontakt 2 is supposed to be the most "complete" sampler, following the ads on NIs website.
Plus, it's supposed to be shipped with a rather large library - whether you need this or not is another question.
Can't say anything about Mach 5, and I heard people complaining about HALion quite a bit (hanging notes etc).
Worth checking (even if I find the GUI rather irritating).
Shortcircuit has a fully functional free version, limited to 2 note polyphony.
EnergyXT has a save-disabled, otherwise fully functional demo.
I'd recommend checking them all out first.
Personally, I like Kontakt a lot, but IMO it all depends on what features you need.
Kontakt 2 is supposed to be the most "complete" sampler, following the ads on NIs website.
Plus, it's supposed to be shipped with a rather large library - whether you need this or not is another question.
Can't say anything about Mach 5, and I heard people complaining about HALion quite a bit (hanging notes etc).
There are 3 kinds of people:
Those who can do maths and those who can't.
Those who can do maths and those who can't.
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- KVRist
- 288 posts since 3 Mar, 2004 from Denmark
The emulator X is a great sampler, if you have a 8Ghz pc. It eats cpu cycles like nothing else i have ever used, about 34 voices on my amd 3ghz, and thats with no filters on the voices. I wasn't impressed at all.
Ergarding what was said about the emu-x recording it's own output, it does, but not in a host (as vst) only in stand alone mode, which bummed me cos' i went from an A4000 myself.
I got rid of the emu-x and got myself Short circuit, an awsome peice of software. It is so simple and powerful, has excellent quality, filters and effects. Very good for mangling sounds and layering too. The closest thing in software to my beloved A4000. In fact, i think it makes a better E6400 replacement than the emu-x.
Pete.
Ergarding what was said about the emu-x recording it's own output, it does, but not in a host (as vst) only in stand alone mode, which bummed me cos' i went from an A4000 myself.
I got rid of the emu-x and got myself Short circuit, an awsome peice of software. It is so simple and powerful, has excellent quality, filters and effects. Very good for mangling sounds and layering too. The closest thing in software to my beloved A4000. In fact, i think it makes a better E6400 replacement than the emu-x.
Pete.
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- KVRian
- 1327 posts since 8 Nov, 2003 from DC
I am coming from a perspective of how do I do things now that I did in hardware, and the A4000's first duty in my studio was instrument playing and synthesis, hence the ST2 anolgy in that context. My principle resampling machine was an ASRX Pro, and Reason is very good at carrying on with that job. Of course my main host is Sonar, and that's what does midi for me, but I digress.
ST2 has only about a third of Yamaha's effects algorithms, but they do sound very good. And the PSTS and STRETCH engines (when STRETCH works, though refinement is promised for 2.1) cannot be disregarded as useful tool along with loop sync. These take it a little beyond an XV, but it is primarily an instrument player, yes.
As for loop chopping, I use ReCycle, but there are many instruments out there that do that, such as NI's Intakt. Version 3.5 of VSampler is supposed to have a beat slicer which I have not yet used.
What it comes down to is what it is you need to do, Cowby. I also have a newly inherited E6400 as well as the A4000. A hardware revival may be in the offing around here, especially since I can import wav files into the Yamaha. My evolved approach has been to use my samplers as players and for their synthesis facilities while doing sound design in my editor. Yes, getting into the deeper sample-level stuff especially looping is difficult on the A4000 or in hardware in general. Of course as these things go, the A series had one of the better displays and UI's of its day. But rereading your posts, I think I get the idea that you want and need everything to happen all inside the sampler itself and prefer a comprehensive solution. Fair enough. In that case, I would look at Kontakt and VSampler, which are the most comprehensive to my knowledge. I know less than I ought to about Halion, almost nothing at all about Mach5 and less than I'd like about Kontakt.
Kontakt has probably the best reputation as a sound-design/warping/mangling tool. I want to like it, but I found the demo counterintuitive and dense, I just didn't take to it so I haven't put in the time to know it. But you can't go wrong with it. I have much more experience with VSampler, and it has depths I have yet to explore. I love the sound and it's fairly easy to use as an instrument player and synth. I don't use the sample editing facilities, but it's good that they're there. Emulator X is very fully speced, but I can't speak to the performance issues which have been raised. This new Short Cicuit instrument does look promising, I will demo it when I get the chance. It is certainly worthwhile having it on one's list of prospects.
What I have learned is that it's best not to have everything all in one place, since nothing is perfect. It's better to put together a team of apps that work well for you at the things you need them to do. Kontakt and VSampler seem to have the most potential as comprehensive solutions, and Shortcicuit is gaining a good reputation as a "true" sampler for DIYers and the manipulation-minded, whereas ST2 is a popular and high-quality solution for instrument playing. VSampler is cheaper than the others except Shortcicuit, which i recall reading hasn't implimented beatslicing yet. If loop manipulation is important to you, Intakt is an option as is Dicer and some others, including ReCycle, which is not an instrument of course, but can output its slices as a soundfont and a corresponding midi file. Some combination of these might be the way to go. Again, good hunting to you.
ST2 has only about a third of Yamaha's effects algorithms, but they do sound very good. And the PSTS and STRETCH engines (when STRETCH works, though refinement is promised for 2.1) cannot be disregarded as useful tool along with loop sync. These take it a little beyond an XV, but it is primarily an instrument player, yes.
As for loop chopping, I use ReCycle, but there are many instruments out there that do that, such as NI's Intakt. Version 3.5 of VSampler is supposed to have a beat slicer which I have not yet used.
What it comes down to is what it is you need to do, Cowby. I also have a newly inherited E6400 as well as the A4000. A hardware revival may be in the offing around here, especially since I can import wav files into the Yamaha. My evolved approach has been to use my samplers as players and for their synthesis facilities while doing sound design in my editor. Yes, getting into the deeper sample-level stuff especially looping is difficult on the A4000 or in hardware in general. Of course as these things go, the A series had one of the better displays and UI's of its day. But rereading your posts, I think I get the idea that you want and need everything to happen all inside the sampler itself and prefer a comprehensive solution. Fair enough. In that case, I would look at Kontakt and VSampler, which are the most comprehensive to my knowledge. I know less than I ought to about Halion, almost nothing at all about Mach5 and less than I'd like about Kontakt.
Kontakt has probably the best reputation as a sound-design/warping/mangling tool. I want to like it, but I found the demo counterintuitive and dense, I just didn't take to it so I haven't put in the time to know it. But you can't go wrong with it. I have much more experience with VSampler, and it has depths I have yet to explore. I love the sound and it's fairly easy to use as an instrument player and synth. I don't use the sample editing facilities, but it's good that they're there. Emulator X is very fully speced, but I can't speak to the performance issues which have been raised. This new Short Cicuit instrument does look promising, I will demo it when I get the chance. It is certainly worthwhile having it on one's list of prospects.
What I have learned is that it's best not to have everything all in one place, since nothing is perfect. It's better to put together a team of apps that work well for you at the things you need them to do. Kontakt and VSampler seem to have the most potential as comprehensive solutions, and Shortcicuit is gaining a good reputation as a "true" sampler for DIYers and the manipulation-minded, whereas ST2 is a popular and high-quality solution for instrument playing. VSampler is cheaper than the others except Shortcicuit, which i recall reading hasn't implimented beatslicing yet. If loop manipulation is important to you, Intakt is an option as is Dicer and some others, including ReCycle, which is not an instrument of course, but can output its slices as a soundfont and a corresponding midi file. Some combination of these might be the way to go. Again, good hunting to you.
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- KVRian
- 756 posts since 18 Oct, 2002 from HelgeG
I second this recommendation. I have Kontakt, but I find myself going to shortcircuit first when I want to mangle sounds. I am still only on the demo, but as soon as I can get the cash together, I will get the full version. I would check it out if I were you.stefancrs wrote:Also, if you're into mangling and manipulation of sounds, check out shortcircuit. Download the free (but polyphony and instance limited) version at http://www.vemberaudio.com
helge
HELP! MY TYPEWRITER IS BROKEN!
E E CUMMINGS
HELP! MY TYPEWRITER IS BROKEN!
E E CUMMINGS
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- KVRian
- 1325 posts since 1 Sep, 2004
At least I would look, whether the soft sampler can import my existing sound patches and libraries. And probably gives me the right kick for my personal work flow.cowby wrote:Hi,
I am using A4000 and would like to buy a soft sampler in the near future. I am also using Winxp with AMD 2500+ and 1G RAM.
Kontact, MACH Five and Emulator-x are on my list. Most of the users said that go for K2 but according to Mach-Five 2.0's new feature, it is a not bad product. But heard that Mach-five eats alot of ...memory. What do you choose if you were me ? Humm.. One more important thing : I need a sampler which can do the drum loop chopping !
I recenlty bought Maudio's FW1814 sound card. By now, I think I don't have chance to buy E-X. I don't know why Emu release a pure soft sampler rather than force the buyer to buy their sound card + sampling software !#$@#$
Cowby
My vote goes for Kontakt therefore.
But I suggest to try out all candidates as demo versions, before you sell your hardware finally. Probably your hardware will act as "working horse" for all butter and bred things in the future.
Because you will be probably surprised, how many processor power some soft samplers eat up!
You would not be the first person I know, who somehow regreted, that they selled their hard sampler for "an apple and an egg". Not because they regreted the entire step (going soft), but they regreted that they now have to use a software instance for any little shit sample inside an arrangement, which summs up processor load ...
So don't do that mistake. Keep your hardware when going soft!
Last edited by useruseruser on Wed Feb 02, 2005 9:40 pm, edited 2 times in total.