History of the KVR Developer Challenge-Very Old Thread

[Sicklecell666]

What to f**k some of you guys think developers are?

Brainless success junkies? Bored millionaries with tonns of spare time? KVR "marketing" orgasm freaks? ...

Guess that leaves you out..

[McLilith]

How 'bout people just donate straight to the developers instead?

Wow, what a novel idea.

If only more people would donate to the developers, then this idea of a contest would probably never have been thought of. The contest is a way to encourage people to donate, who might not otherwise donate. I agree that it would be very good for anyone with some money to donate (or at least offer) to the freeware developers who's software they are using. If a contest can get off the ground that encourages sending money to freeware/shareware authors, then I'm all for it. Anything that helps people realize the amount of effort that goes into writing a piece of software, and to better realize the value software, is a good thing. I don't know yet how this would work with major commercial plugins, but I think it would work fine for freeware and maybe some low-cost shareware plugins.


take care,
McLilith

[McLilith]

What to f**k some of you guys think developers are?

Once again, you've decided to ruin another thread with your foul mouth and arrogance. I bet you pull the wings off butterflies in your spare time, don't you?

Brainless success junkies? Bored millionaries with tonns of spare time? KVR "marketing" orgasm freaks? ...



Wish you much luck with that "idea".

(And I wish I had that time you obviously have.)

Well, you obviously do have the time, because here you are posting to this thread with the rest of us. Now please go away, and leave these decent people alone.


Sweet dreams,
McLilith

[useruseruser]

Thanks for the advice. I'll do so.

(Obviously all where McLilith is printed on also McLilith is inside (which means it is a guaranty for nonsense content.)

[McLilith]

Thanks for the advice. I'll do so.

(Obviously all where McLilith is printed on also McLilith is inside (which means it is a guaranty for nonsense content.)

Oh thanks, for that one last insult, before you left this thread behind you. That was very kind of you.

Let me return the favor by helping you pack your bags. I wouldn't want you to undergo the ordeal of posting to a thread that you yourself stated you didn't have the time to post to.

(I know that English isn't your primary language, so in case you don't realize it, I'm being entirely sarcastic.)


Have a nice trip,
McLilith

[Sicklecell666]

edit

[Markleford]

If only more people would donate to the developers, then this idea of a contest would probably never have been thought of. The contest is a way to encourage people to donate, who might not otherwise donate.

Again, the sentiment is fantastic, but the plan is flawed.

If the goal is to encourage people to donate, then there are surely better ways. Turning it into a contest only cheapens the efforts of developers who aren't the best or most popular. And if they feel that they have no chance, then they're either wasting their time or will eventually decide not to participate, which will further shrink your contestant pool.

So I must agree with jackle&hyde (though with significantly less insulting verbage ): most devs aren't in the game to win popularity contests, and they don't have much time to pursue someone else's idea of a cool synth or effect when they probably already have their own to-do list a mile long. In fact, many devs won't work on something that's been done well enough, and instead try to fill the "holes" in the market... so why would they want to take time out to duplicate the effort of everyone else?

I don't think that (essentially) "tricking" someone into donating is going to work. If they haven't donated already, it's highly doubtful that they'll bother chipping into the prize pot. And if you want to donate money to begin with, I'm sure you want to give it to the dev that *you* think deserves it, rather than by some concensus of voting rabble.

The only real way to get money flowing is not through some sort of feel-good humanitarian effort that only benefits a few, but rather a campaign of outright mockery of the freeloading class that doesn't contribute to the cycle. If you know a leech, then confront them about it. If they can't acknowledge a personal appeal from a friend or peer, then they're never going to contribute to a contest prize, period.

To that end, we also have to get devs interviewed and portrayed as real human beings, not some sort of software-spewing automaton with no day job. And maybe a "donation badge" program that recognizes donators and in turn makes them a billboard for the Model Share/Freeware Citizen.

- m

[ianweb123]

Spookilly enough I had been thinking myself about the idea of doing a 'just-for-fun' 'Build-off'..

I'd previously had the idea for a (SynthEdit) 4x4 competition (the plugins were to have a maximum of 4 knobs and 4 sliders) but with a few notable exceptions that fell flat on its arse..

One of the problems would be how would these things be judged.. You've only got to look at the divergence shown in the 'Best of ' threads with everything from A synth to Z3ta in the replies, and sometimes the synths chosen appear totally out of sync with the best-of catagory.. People tend to play favorites notwithstanding any platform issues..

I think the idea would work as a just for fun thing.. I know that I have enjoyed working to somebody else brief..(Gargoyle, vurtbox, Karnage), but perhaps it wouldn't suit everybody..

[Kriminal]

Sounds like fun, i vote the first month is a 303 emu comp

[cptgone]

Also, some devs are specialised in something, like mastering tools.

[Borogove]

Sounds like fun, i vote the first month is a 303 emu comp

[Stupid American Pig]

maybe a 303 virus then?

[xoxos]

ugh.. the mention of money and no paragraph breaks.. pictoral or hand gesture version?? :p

jsut to say.. hooked up speakers and finally listened to your last track, tuz.. humourous mood..

[liqih]

yeah it sounds like fun,

[McLilith]

Again, the sentiment is fantastic, but the plan is flawed.

You could be right on both counts, but we might think of something during this thread that would work better than the original suggestion. It's certainly worth talking about.

If the goal is to encourage people to donate, then there are surely better ways. Turning it into a contest only cheapens the efforts of developers who aren't the best or most popular. And if they feel that they have no chance, then they're either wasting their time or will eventually decide not to participate, which will further shrink your contestant pool.

Yes, I suppose that could happen to people who were not chosen. As for getting "contestants", it wouldn't have to rely on submissions. If we decided that this was more of an annual "public awards event" for freeware authors, we could simply give some money to the best freeware of the past year, as a public show of appreciation. I don't think too many people would give up programming, simply from not getting an award.

I think if the VST using community saw monetary awards being given to freeware, it would help elevate their sense of value in freeware, and software in general. I think it would help improve the image of the developer, and help the general community be more aware of the value of a developer's time and skills. This is a concept that you yourself have said should be promoted.

It's debatable if either an awards program or an actual contest would be the best mechanism for such a promotion of the software developer's image, but I've yet to hear a better detailed suggestion for promoting the welfare of smaller software developers, (and indirectly, the larger ones as well.)

So I must agree with jackle&hyde (though with significantly less insulting verbage ): most devs aren't in the game to win popularity contests, and they don't have much time to pursue someone else's idea of a cool synth or effect when they probably already have their own to-do list a mile long.

Yes, I'm starting to lean more towards an annual award that doesn't require entry by the developer. If handled that way, it would have to be a freeware-centric event. No one is going to contribute to a coffer to be handed over to Cakewalk, NI, or Steinberg, simply for producing a good plugin that year, because the public perception is that these players are probably making plenty of money from their plugins and don't need the award money. Freeware developers are a different story. We could probably gather some award money for the freeware developers.

I don't think that (essentially) "tricking" someone into donating is going to work.

It would have worked, if you hadn't just told everyone that we were trying to trick them. There goes my plans for world-domination of all things VST-related.

If they haven't donated already, it's highly doubtful that they'll bother chipping into the prize pot.

It all depends on how you market and promote the concept.

And if you want to donate money to begin with, I'm sure you want to give it to the dev that *you* think deserves it, rather than by some concensus of voting rabble.

See, that's a good way to not attract people. "Come and give away your money, by joining our 'voting rabble' event."

It takes a little more finesse than that.

If you know a leech, then confront them about it. If they can't acknowledge a personal appeal from a friend or peer, then they're never going to contribute to a contest prize, period.

Confronting a leech usually doesn't do any good. The contest or award program wouldn't be relying on "leeches" anyway. It would be relying on the good natured people out there who truly appreciate the small developers and want to help promote their survival and continued growth. I know those people are out there. Let's not simply give up because there happen to be some "leeches", as you put it, in this world.

To that end, we also have to get devs interviewed and portrayed as real human beings, not some sort of software-spewing automaton with no day job. And maybe a "donation badge" program that recognizes donators and in turn makes them a billboard for the Model Share/Freeware Citizen.

Those sound like two interesting ideas. Do you have sny suggestions for making that come closer to a reality?

I think the main thrust of this thread was really how to promote and encourage small developers. I'd like to hear any helpful suggestions for achieving that goal. The "contest" idea was a way to add an element of fun to the process, for all involved. I think we are all interested in alternative positive ideas.

take care,
McLilith