User Friendly Kevorkian Bomb

[Amberience]

Well, IMO if you're thinking about serious collaboration, but insisting on lossy compression, then you really need to rethink the term 'stupid'.

Nice twisting of words here Rabbit.

Anyway, your supposed "inconvenience" argument isn't that well formed. Its only that way because people like you refuse to acknowledge that it is superior - It is NOT subjective. OGG retains more of the original sound source at lower encoding levels than mp3 and the file sizes are smaller.

Its only inconvenient for you and a few others because you're being stubborn and relying on your own ego's rather than your ears.

Thanks for jumping in Sascha, at least there are some people who realise OGG is better than MP3. Its not even debatable, the information is out there for anyone who wants to know the truth.

Mulder! Scully!

[CypherOne]

well I'll chip in. When I'm reviewing a track put on KVR from someone looking for feedback, I want something that's of reasonable quality and convenient for ME.

When I make a CD or collaborate I use wav files.

That's all.

[whyterabbyt]

Acolmiztli quoth
Nice twisting of words here Rabbit.

You're the expert.

Anyway, your supposed "inconvenience" argument isn't that well formed. Its only that way because people like you refuse to acknowledge that it is superior - It is NOT subjective. OGG retains more of the original sound source at lower encoding levels than mp3 and the file sizes are smaller.

No; its perfectly formed; you're just looking for any way you can to deny that it is more convenient. It doesnt somehow become more convenient because you think it should be more convenient.

Its only inconvenient for you and a few others because you're being stubborn and relying on your own ego's rather than your ears.

The fact that I have to convert something to make use of it the way I prefer has nothing to do with ego or stubbornness. It is less convenient. End of story. Deal with it.

Thanks for jumping in Sascha, at least there are some people who realise OGG is better than MP3. Its not even debatable, the information is out there for anyone who wants to know the truth.

Still missing the point. There is more than one measure of 'better'. Less convenient is not better.

[advaya]

Hi... I'd like someone to review my short story...

What no takers? Is it because its in french? Bahhh... hasn't anyone heard of BabbleFish??? You are all a lazy bunch of sods!

I mean come on! It is a romance story, and we all know that french is much more romantic than english... Duhhh... all you english speakers must be stupid or something...

[Hunter]

I only listen to directly linked mp3's here, no oggs, soundclicks, rarely go-to-my-website-then-scroll-down-about-half-way-and-click-the-third-one-you-see ones, I just don't have the time. Simple as that.

Its not worth getting upset about, if it's max. no. of listener's comments you are after with your music, then present it in a way that enables the max no. of people to listen to it with the min. amount of effort

Bollocking them for not listening really won't help either...

[dusted william]

Dude,

If you want people to listen to your tracks make an ogg and mp3 for them.

simple as that.

dw

[haydxn]

i prefer to keep all my tracks as wavs, because they're better.

of course i respect you for using ogg, i have all my compressed emergency archives of my projects compressed with ogg (of course i have non-compressed backups too) - mainly because that's what tracktion uses for high compression, but i understand it is good.

but if i want to sell my music in the shops to lots of people, i'm going to get more listens if i put it out on cd. even if i feel that minidiscs are much more versatile and compact (despite having a lower audio bandwidth). it's something that is undeniable, regardless of quality, people are more likely to listen to a cd than an sacd. similarly, whilst it's easy enough to get an ogg codec, it's not exactly unreasonable to put out music in a form that as many people as possible will instantly have access to.

so what if ogg is better? tbh i think i prefer ogg. but like wr says, my md player doesn't convert from ogg (another step for me) and - at the end of the day- regardless of what you prefer for your audio files, it's not you that's going to be downloading and listenning to the file, is it? most people use mp3, it's pretty much guaranteed that anyone on the net is able to listen to it if it's an mp3.

[AudioShots]

Hi... I'd like someone to review my short story...

What no takers? Is it because its in french? Bahhh... hasn't anyone heard of BabbleFish??? You are all a lazy bunch of sods!

I mean come on! It is a romance story, and we all know that french is much more romantic than english... Duhhh... all you english speakers must be stupid or something...

http://audioshots.com/auditorium/

[Amberience]

The fact that I have to convert something to make use of it the way I prefer has nothing to do with ego or stubbornness. It is less convenient. End of story. Deal with it.

Mp3 became integrated as it is because people started to use it. Start to use OGG, and it wont be so much of an inconvinience for you to use it - developers will jump on the bandwagon, and people will start to support OGG.

Its already happening in the mp3 player industry - OGG is getting its dirty little mittens in there.

You need to deal with it. You're the one holding back a perfectly good file format which is superior to mp3 because you've fooled yourself into thinking ease of use is more important than sound quality.

You're all missing the point. The point isn't that I should be conforming to the mp3 usage because I want the maximum number of listeners - Its not about that.

The point is that you should all be helping to develop OGG into an mp3-replacer. Because now the industry has its mitts on mp3, and they're going to exploit it.

They can't do that with OGG just yet, because its an open-source file format. They can use it, but they can't stop you from using it.

What is happening with mp3 just lately huh?? Napster, DRM, Microsoft, and the RIAA. Thats what.

I don't care solely about attracting listeners, if I did I would make trance.

[Amberience]

Oh, and there is an mp3 now, and still you non-oggers haven't listened.

Arguing for the sake of it.

[Sascha Franck]

Of course, if you want a large amount of people to listen to your stuff, you would post an MP3 - preferably with a direct link.

MP3 still has got to be the most common internet music format, it's what everybody will be able to plaback without any further hassle (assuming you're not on Win 95 anymore).

So, for posting songs it might still be the "best".

It's also almost too obvious to even mention it, but everybody with a clue would keep his/her material in lossless quality (= wave or aiff, probably packed and/or losslessly compressed) as well.

However, and I was allready saying so, I'm really wondering about people apparently not understanding the benefits of the OGG format.
Quite a lot of folks on KVR are collaborating - and I've seen it more than once that they're using MP3s - probably to send each other wave files in the end, should the thing be worth it, but that's beyond the point.
Usually you'll be starting with a compressed format for convenience reasons (there's still some people with less than highspeed connections, not enough server space, mailboxes not dealing with larger files, etc etc).
Sidenote: I could even get away just fine keeping things in compressed format. I have yet to hear a collaboration tune where it'd really matter that uncompressed material has been used.... at least high bitrates should keep things more than acceptable

So, how do people collaborate via MP3?
Are they adding coun-ins to each file? No, they aren't (I know that from my own experience). And even if they would, that would still require a more or less time consuming line-up-job.
Also, when using MP3s I use to add a count-in, still some people (won't call any names here) managed to completely mess up my timing.

Or: Are they investing massive amounts of time to line up things freely, assuming the timing could be OK? Perhaps they are... but most often they don't seem to (see above).

So, why don't they just use OGG and forget about any such problems for the rest of times? This is comopletely beyond me. It's literally taking 2-5 minutes to make your music (or net-) machine OGG-compatible, won't cost you a penny and the benefits (at least in case you're into collaborations) are nothing short but immense.

Oh yes, most sequencers don't support OGG natively, so OGG files will require an additional rightclick > convert to... what a time consuming thing!
Guess people prefer to wade through all the line up shit...

Allright, rant over.

[CypherOne]

Oh, and there is an mp3 now, and still you non-oggers haven't listened.

Arguing for the sake of it.

but you said "f**k it. don't listen".

so I didn't...

[Amberience]

Oh, and there is an mp3 now, and still you non-oggers haven't listened.

Arguing for the sake of it.

but you said "f**k it. don't listen".

so I didn't...

Was that directed at you? Oh ok, yes, it was. f**k it then, do listen.

[vurt]

Of course, if you want a large amount of people to listen to your stuff, you would post an MP3 - preferably with a direct link.

.

and as this is the cafe for listening to tracks then thats the only bit that counts


and as cypher pointed out he did say f**k off dont listen
so i think it may well be an attitude that puts some listeners off in the future,i know at least one person who has said he will avoid this guys music from now on.

[Amberience]

His loss.

Y'know what... you may think I have an attitude problem, but at least it is an attitude, most people around here don't even have one - no personality at all.