KVR Audio

sascha · Post by **sascha** » Fri Jul 10, 2020 9:25 am

With anchovies? I'm all ears.

But, well, I doubt that the L1 comparison was meant seriously.

Ploki · Post by **Ploki** » Fri Jul 10, 2020 9:54 am

my studer comparison was tho.
When i matched the EQ curve of the studer, they were extremely close, and when i blinded people in the studio preference was not overwhelmingly on one over another, some people referred satin, some studer.

satin really is good, and i haven't tried a tape sim that would be as close to the real thing. they may sound good and pleasant, but they're not authentic.

but i guess people really don't expect authentic from tapes, rather than, "this sounds like my expectation of how a tape should sound despite the fact that it doesn't correlate with reality that much"

also anchovies on a Neapolitan pizza? that's heresy

plexuss · Post by **plexuss** » Fri Jul 10, 2020 2:14 pm

Michey wrote: Thu Jul 09, 2020 8:44 pm I was thinking the other day about the elusive "sound" of tape and I wander how many people have actually heard REAL tape to the extent they offer their personal choices to others ?

Me. I started in music production in the late 70s. So all through the 80s/90s I was on analogue tape. So I know the sound and the impact. ITB is totally different beast.

nilhartman · Post by **nilhartman** » Fri Jul 10, 2020 2:25 pm

@Ploki : would you share that Satin / Studer preset of yours please ? Genuinely interested / curious. Cheers !

ijiwaru · Post by **ijiwaru** » Sat Jul 11, 2020 3:55 am

[Delete]

plexuss · Post by **plexuss** » Sat Jul 11, 2020 5:59 am

ijiwaru wrote: Sat Jul 11, 2020 3:55 am
plexuss wrote: Fri Jul 10, 2020 2:14 pm
Michey wrote: Thu Jul 09, 2020 8:44 pm I was thinking the other day about the elusive "sound" of tape and I wander how many people have actually heard REAL tape to the extent they offer their personal choices to others ?
Me. I started in music production in the late 70s. So all through the 80s/90s I was on analogue tape. So I know the sound and the impact. ITB is totally different beast.
ITB is superior in every way.

Yes. However there are elements of analogue that are also desirable ITB. Hence all the hullabaloo...

El°HYM · Post by **El°HYM** » Sat Jul 11, 2020 8:45 am

plexuss wrote: Sat Jul 11, 2020 5:59 am
ijiwaru wrote: Sat Jul 11, 2020 3:55 am
plexuss wrote: Fri Jul 10, 2020 2:14 pm
Michey wrote: Thu Jul 09, 2020 8:44 pm I was thinking the other day about the elusive "sound" of tape and I wander how many people have actually heard REAL tape to the extent they offer their personal choices to others ?
Me. I started in music production in the late 70s. So all through the 80s/90s I was on analogue tape. So I know the sound and the impact. ITB is totally different beast.
ITB is superior in every way.
Yes. However there are elements of analogue that are also desirable ITB. Hence all the hullabaloo...

Like sending sound thru Air.

We will get there somehow,
just a Matter of Time.

Tea, Earl Grey, hot.

Michey · Post by **Michey** » Sat Jul 11, 2020 10:03 am

there are elements of analogue that are also desirable ITB. Hence all the hullabaloo...

Can you elaborate ?

Can one aurally detect these elements in a way that skews the listening experience ?

Ploki · Post by **Ploki** » Sat Jul 11, 2020 11:37 am

nilhartman wrote: Fri Jul 10, 2020 2:25 pm @Ploki : would you share that Satin / Studer preset of yours please ? Genuinely interested / curious. Cheers !

it's an unreleased track so unfortunately i can't.

i can make something else with it tho - i still have the project somewhere.

abi · Post by **abi** » Sat Jul 11, 2020 12:55 pm

Edit: useless comment, sorry.

jasonbrianmerrill · Post by **jasonbrianmerrill** » Sat Jul 11, 2020 1:02 pm

abi wrote: Sat Jul 11, 2020 12:55 pm

Unreleased tracks prohibit presets used in them? Weird stuff!

abi · Post by **abi** » Sat Jul 11, 2020 1:03 pm

Too late

Ploki · Post by **Ploki** » Sat Jul 11, 2020 9:17 pm

Oh... presets!
it was a tweaked studer preset.
as for studer i don't recall, default mix:analog settings i figure

plexuss · Post by **plexuss** » Mon Jul 13, 2020 2:21 pm

Michey wrote: Sat Jul 11, 2020 10:03 am
there are elements of analogue that are also desirable ITB. Hence all the hullabaloo...
Can you elaborate ?

Can one aurally detect these elements in a way that skews the listening experience ?

Noise and distortion - there are applications of noise and distortion that occur in the analogue domain that some people like when optimally used in music production. ITB opens up all kinds of issues and risks with noise and distortion that do not exist in analogue, for example clipping causing wide band intermodulation distortion which is generally not pleasing. There are certain kinds of analogue noise and distortion that when mixed in a subtle way can affect the over-lying audio in pleasing ways. This is one reason why there are so many plugins model analogue. This is also why tape emulations are used.

Michey · Post by **Michey** » Mon Jul 13, 2020 5:12 pm

plexuss wrote: Mon Jul 13, 2020 2:21 pm
Michey wrote: Sat Jul 11, 2020 10:03 am
there are elements of analogue that are also desirable ITB. Hence all the hullabaloo...
Can you elaborate ?

Can one aurally detect these elements in a way that skews the listening experience ?
Noise and distortion - there are applications of noise and distortion that occur in the analogue domain that some people like when optimally used in music production. ITB opens up all kinds of issues and risks with noise and distortion that do not exist in analogue, for example clipping causing wide band intermodulation distortion which is generally not pleasing.

Isn't that why gain staging exists in the first place ? "stay safe" was a slogan used way before covid-19...

plexuss wrote: Mon Jul 13, 2020 2:21 pmThere are certain kinds of analogue noise and distortion that when mixed in a subtle way can affect the over-lying audio in pleasing ways. This is one reason why there are so many plugins model analogue. This is also why tape emulations are used.

I tried to mix (if the term "mix" is in place here) noise from noise generating plug (very very low levels - [-]72dB to [-]90dB). I found the result(s) VERY pleasing (esp. when inserted before a compressor or all sort of dynamic candies).
BUT, as most modern music makers do, we tend to use TONS of plugins/emulations which bring their own in-house noise into the game (usually each copy on its own generates very subtle noise) which can accumulate eventually into one very unpleasing result (esp. with plugs that tend to gather all sorts of debris from the abyss - very low level info - which can open the low end in a very nice way, on the one hand... or leave an almost criminal havoc).

Thanks !

Tape simulations for that mastering mojo.