midi channel and midi learn

[fas1piano]

thanks for testing this - so far we're an the same page.

now, when i:

- save and close the project
- load it again

the assginments i have made via zebra's midi learn are gone.

this is essential for me, not so much in reaper as it got it's own great midi learn, but in brainspawn forte.

in forte, the same thing happens: midi learn assignments are lost on project save/reload. forte is a live software, the aim is to boot your laptop and start playing. so i need some sort of midi learn that gets saved with projects in forte. i used reaper for testing purposes because more people are likely to have it and to make sure it's not a problem on forte's side.

i could substitute zebra's midi learn with forte's, but forte does not have the "show last touched control" function, so i don't know what control i am assgning and many controls cannot be distinguished by names.

fab

[raikard233]

I jump on the midi learn wagon with this question:

Is possible to use the Zebras midi learn (right click over a parameter) when loaded into ableton live?
I've tried but it don't work.

[Urs]

@raikard: We're talking the latest beta version

@fab: MidiLearn does not save with project, it's a global thing on that computer (working on that though).

By any chance, do you have 2 or more Zebra2.dlls installed?
Do you have two computers, MidiLearning on one and then transferring projects to the other?
Do you have any occurrance of "com.u-he.Zebra2.midimap.txt" on any of your machines?
Are you using Vista in administered user mode?
Can you send me a screenshot of a freshly opened Zebra?

Cheers,

Urs

[raikard233]

@raikard: We're talking the latest beta version

Hmm, i'm using the latest!
Perhaps i've lost something?

[Urs]

Hmm, i'm using the latest!
Perhaps i've lost something?

Then... the same questions I posted above

[raikard233]

No dll's.
Only .component here!
Only one mac.
No midimaps.txt.


Or simply i've lost all my understanding of basic english!!

[Urs]

No dll's.
Only .component here!
Only one mac.
No midimaps.txt.

So, please send me a screenshot of a freshly opened Zebra!

anybody at u-he dot com

Urs

[raikard233]

Sent the email.
I've tried now in logic and there the midi learn works fine...so seems to be an ableton live problem.

[Urs]

Sent the email.
I've tried now in logic and there the midi learn works fine...so seems to be an ableton live problem.

Thanks for the screeny!

Ah... I see... I suppose Live is intercepting MidiCCs then?

Urs

[raikard233]

I don't know urs, i can only say that in live a little square in the right corner is flashing when you move some midi knob...something to ensure that live receives midi signal i suppose.

I will check this also in the live forum.

[raikard233]

Solved.
In live i've ever forgot to enable the midi in of the channel where zebra or microtonic was loaded.
I ever tried with the midi learn of Live.

To only assign the cc you can simply enable the midi in of the channel, but when you play a midi clip you have to set the midi monitor to auto or off to have the midi clip read from live and conseguentelly the channell will not receive the cc signal.
The workaround to have midi clip read from live and the zebra parameter tweakable is to create another midi channel (used only for midi routing, no clips or plugins on it) and set over the input the midi source and the output set to send the signal to the zebra channel.
In this case you can have both the midi clip read and the zebras knobs tweakable.


So, now i've all the parameters mappable in live but the only knobs that can be automated or live tweaking recorded are ever the first 128?

[Urs]

Phewww!

So, now i've all the parameters mappable in live but the only knobs that can be automated or live tweaking recorded are ever the first 128?

Yes... that's one of Live's limitations. They have however announced that some future version will have a workaround for this. Nevertheless, you can access pretty much all of Zebra's knobs via the XY-controls. Which can be automated in Live

Urs

[bmrzycki]

thanks for testing this - so far we're an the same page.
now, when i:
- save and close the project
- load it again
the assginments i have made via zebra's midi learn are gone.

Ah, I understand what you're after now. Currently Zebra has a single text file to store midi maps globally.

So in the example I gave above, CC22 stays mapped to Master across load/saves. If CC22 doesn't control the Zebra knob after you reload Reaper something is fishy.

However, if I remap Master to say Knob 1 it will globally change for all past and future projects. Urs has said he's reworking midi learn/save in the future to be more localized.

A hackish way I've gotten around it is by saving the midimap.txt file off after I get a setup I like. Then I can just copy it over when I want that map again. But of course this is still global. If you have two instances of Zebra open in a project and you want track 1's Master knob controled by CC22 and track 2's Master knob controlled by CC23 it won't work. The last one you set to the knob is the one that controls all instances.

If forte has a way to meta-map a set of CCs to parameters you might be better off with that in the short term. I know Live lets you do that, of course for the first 128 parameters only, so that can be a different problem...

Ain't electronic music grand?

[hesnotthemessiah]

Hi,

Zebra always listens to all channels (omni mode)... you can usually determine the channel in the host.

MidiLearn is one of the major construction areas. There's still just "the one global map of 128 targets". I did this back in the days to encourage using the XY-controls. However, there have been plans to extend MidiLearn for ages, including channel-awareness and patch based settings, yet there hasn't been an occasion to finally touch that code. Keep bugging me to raise priority!

Cheers,

Urs

Loving Zebra Urs!! Thankyou very much for all the effort you have put into making Zebra my favourite synth!!

Just a quick bug for extending MidiLearn on Zebra to include the saving of the midi learn settings when you save your song in your host. This is so important for me, as I expect it is for others.

A perfect implementation of midi learn for me would be:-

1)Select any parameter on the Zebra GUI (for example "Cutoff" on a filter).

2)Assign any midi controller number to it (for example midi controller 92).

3)Select a range for this midi controller (for example 64 to 127 - so now midi controller 92 will sweep the "Cutoff" from half way, which is 64, to full, which is 127).

4)You are not restricted to one midi controller number to just one Zebra parameter. So you could assign midi controller 92 to both a filter "Cutoff" and a Delay "Mix" level - each with their own assignable range - as described in point 3 above.

5)All of these midi settings are saved when you save your song in your host. So, when you load your song back up, all those midi settings that you made for each Zebra in that song are restored.

6)The Zebra GUI will display what midi learn midi controller numbers have been assigned to which parameter, so that you can keep track of all of this!



I would be sooooooooo happy if you could implement this.

[Urs]

Yo,

Actually... the XYs have always been what you're asking for. I do know however that they're a bit complicated to set up.

I've been thinking about this topic for years. I'll eventually find time to implement the optimum satisfying method... just don't ask when...