KVR Audio

maxxxter · Post by **maxxxter** » Mon Jun 11, 2012 8:38 pm

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MFXxx · Post by **MFXxx** » Mon Jun 11, 2012 8:38 pm

I'm with COmpyfox...this is a summing plugin not an effect. Check your gain staging, recording levels and lefvels you are pushing through NLS. I've got to ask why you would only pass part of the signal through a summing unit, makes no sense in my humble opinion.

Or am I 'wrong'

robogone · Post by **robogone** » Mon Jun 11, 2012 8:44 pm

maxxxter wrote:sorry mate, but here in my country we actually talk like this.
here there's nothing wrong with 'wrong'.
what i DO think is wrong though is projecting your cultural parameters on people from other places; expect friction.

Pot...kettle...

maxxxter · Post by **maxxxter** » Mon Jun 11, 2012 8:55 pm

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lfm · Post by **lfm** » Mon Jun 11, 2012 9:17 pm

shalako wrote:Waves NLS adds too much color and I think it could benefit from a wet/dry control.

As it is I'm not going to buy it because it has so much color I find it unusable.

Color too much when drive is at zero?

These kind of plugins should be really subtle - and if you immediately hear an effect - it's too much added, as I see it.

First it's nothing - add a little more
Then it's nothing - add a little more
And then suddenly it's all over the place.

Are you using it like a chorus-effect or something.

The first plugins I tested that added color was TRacks(I think it's called).
- Yeah, it's warm in here now

And when listening to it for a while it all felt like muddy in my ears. I ditched it. But I was probably only using it wrong.

The same happended when trying exciter stuff in Ozone for the first time. You add until you here it clearly.

I just found that was not the way to do it.

When you immediately hear it - back off by half or something.

My take on it anyway.....

p.s. In Reaper there is wet/dry on all plugins in pluginbay. You don't need it built into any plugs. --------- Go the way you want to go - go Reaper. ------:D
Have become a real fan....no commercial interest in the product.

valhallasound · Post by **valhallasound** » Mon Jun 11, 2012 9:40 pm

If there is any IIR or minimum-phase filtering in the plugin, then a wet/dry control would most likely lead to ugly coloration in the output. Not all effects lend themselves to having wet/dry mixes.

Sean Costello

shalako · Post by **shalako** » Mon Jun 11, 2012 10:08 pm

to say im using it wrong would be an overstatement, however i dont
disagree that i could be using it more effectively.
I specificly said it has to much color. At zero drive with minus trim
settings I find a strong amount of coloration not saturation\distortion.
maybe i have gotten to use to digital from mixing itb for so long.
i have noticed im not the only person to say it could be more subtle.

If i reduce the level of my input at the soundcard preamp, would
the amount of color be reduced? .....my demo has expired so i cant test myself.

posted from phone...

maxxxter · Post by **maxxxter** » Tue Jun 12, 2012 12:22 am

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lfm · Post by **lfm** » Tue Jun 12, 2012 7:11 am

shalako wrote:At zero drive with minus trim
settings I find a strong amount of coloration not saturation\distortion.

Thanks for clarifying - I imagined it would be transparent with those settings more or less.

I heard many praise Sonimus Satson for it's subtle effect. But it does not have a drive control at all as I remember.

I had my mind set on getting NLS but are more resiliant now.

shalako · Post by **shalako** » Tue Jun 12, 2012 8:20 am

lfm wrote:
shalako wrote:At zero drive with minus trim
settings I find a strong amount of coloration not saturation\distortion.
Thanks for clarifying - I imagined it would be transparent with those settings more or less.

I heard many praise Sonimus Satson for it's subtle effect. But it does not have a drive control at all as I remember.

I had my mind set on getting NLS but are more resiliant now.

Sonimus Satson has no color, it has gain but it's quite hard to drive. It does saturate and is vey subtle. To me satson has a cold sound, not warm.

NLS has a lot of character, depends on what you want, I'm starting to like NLS more and more.

@everyone else.

Does anyone know what sknote stripbuss is like in comparison.

Would you recommend VCC console instead as I hear it's more subtle. I would have to get an new ilok for this one.

Compyfox · Post by **Compyfox** » Tue Jun 12, 2012 9:13 pm

I really advise you to read my post on VCC again regarding a proper input level.

Yes, a lower level results in a less saturated sound and you work with the tool like planned and advertised. A maximum RMS level of -18dB (0VU) is the ideal worklevel. So yes - turn down the input signal and mix away.

Each tool you mentioned (VCC, StripBus, SATSON, NLS, maybe even Nebula) has their own character. It lies within the eyes of the beholder which sound you prefer and what "consoles" you want to have.

Furhtermore, StripBus is also a channel strip, SATSON offes tuned butterworth LP/HP filters, NLS and VCC are pretty much "input preamp" plugins, same with avaiable Nebula presets.

You decide what suits your needs. But before you use these tools, learn how to properly use it. If you overdrive it on purpose however, it's no wonder that you think it has too much color.

shalako · Post by **shalako** » Wed Jun 13, 2012 11:30 am

Went ahead and purchased NLS today. Got to admit it sounds a lot better than when I demoed it. Not sure what I did differently but I still have the original track I used, so I'll go back and see what I was doing wrong or if my ears have just adjusted to the add color.

Cheers for the comments as the discussion helped me make the discussion to get it.

@Compy - I read your posts and I have taken input levels in to consideration.

I must say though that there was an assumption that I didn't know what a console emulation is... I know what it is for and before NLS I was using various techniques to emulate the sound of an analogue console, and on top of that I actually have an analog console so I am very much familiar with them... When I asked if reducing my input level would change the color I was actually asking if the NLS emulation was intelligent enough to do this... But anyway thanks again I am happy with my purchase.

jam92189 · Post by **jam92189** » Wed Jun 13, 2012 11:58 am

ha U dont have NSL but i did demo it yea I agree console emulations change the sound. and if you dont like how its doing it usually something is wrong of you just dont like it.

as for satson you can turn on fat and them drive it with the switch on but personally I only use it as a gain staging and filtering plugins. Its kind of cold as someone else said before I agree. I like my stripbus lots of color but used right with good gain staging it can do the job. The waves one was nice how you can drive it like the slate console emulation. But I dont need more than the two I have at the moment. But yea I found it pretty darn good just not for me.

at least not right now gimi a week.

Compyfox · Post by **Compyfox** » Wed Jun 13, 2012 12:54 pm

shalako wrote:When I asked if reducing my input level would change the color I was actually asking if the NLS emulation was intelligent enough to do this...

If you don't change any settings or fader placement (level in at unity, you know the drill), then it should change the actual color.

Just like on analog consoles - overdrive the input stage and you have a more saturated signal to work with EQ, pan and the fader.

Tool like VCC and NLS pretty much work like analog consoles, even the reference level is the same. On top of it, the VU responds to average signal or QPPM, unlike ITB meters (they are mostly digital sample meters). Due to this you need a certain headroom - and that is -18dBFS digital.

Level in your signal so that your average signal strength is at -18dB (RMS) but peak wise not higher than -9dBFS digital, and you have no trouble whatsoever using NLS, VCC, SATSON, CS1V, StripBus and how they're all called.

KVR Audio

Waves NLS needs a wet/dry control?

Does Waves NLS need a Wet/Dry control