M4 Test

[MuTools]

Yes i try to figure out ..how to automate say a filter cut off from a Mulab instrument and also a VSTi instrument in the composingscreen ( not piano roll )
There is no "target" feature anymore and try to follow johnny pumphandle's tutorial, but that is now outdated with MuLAb 4

I'll make a youtube tutorial about this when all the tech work on M4 is ready.

In short: How to automate a parameter:

-> By recording.

-> Or by hand:

* Create automation part.
* Make sure track is routed to the module of the parameter to be automated.
This can be done by dropping the module on the track panel.
Note that child tracks with no explicit target are routed to the parent track's target, so you can easily setup multiple track lanes for the same module.
* Now drop the parameter itself on the automation part so to set the target parameter. Alternatively, part context menu -> Choose Parameter.

Hope this helps.

[Trancit]

Wrt syncing editors: Note that in M4 you can do 'parrallel editing' by opening multiple editors at the same time.

What would be more important, is to open more than one sequence in the same editor!!!!!

For me, it's a very important feature to be able to see the notes of i.e. an already composed pad sound, while working on the matching lead...

The second sequence must not be editable, but I would like to see the notes (in grey colors) of the second one, while editing the first...


Trancit

[janamdo]

Yes this helps...really easy to drop a module(from a rack with module slots and filled with modules) in the composerscreen on a modulation track panel

So there are 2 levels of automation
- composerscreen -> song automation ( all tracks )with envelopes tracks
- noteroll editor screen -> one track automation -> detailled automation

[janamdo]

Wrt syncing editors: Note that in M4 you can do 'parrallel editing' by opening multiple editors at the same time.

What would be more important, is to open more than one sequence in the same editor!!!!!

For me, it's a very important feature to be able to see the notes of i.e. an already composed pad sound, while working on the matching lead...

The second sequence must not be editable, but I would like to see the notes (in grey colors) of the second one, while editing the first...


Trancit

Is it not possible to use the first existing track with not editable notes and add notes for a second track, but now you must assign a new sound to the editable notes too?

When the two tracks work musical together (contrapunt... the note directions of the two tracks and the use of contrasting note values to get a degree of melodic independence) you can copy the notes for the second track to a own track
No that is limited..better is to do a second track like trancit said and add here in the non editable notes of a first track to get a good contapunctual result?

Listening to the two tracks together must also be possible in de noteroll editor

[Nielzie]

Because in modern music making choosing a sound comes before composing.
But i want to make the panes movable so you can order them as you wish.

That would be lovely

I've also been thinking to make separate panels for the SESSION and MULAB menu. Would that be a good idea?

Yes, but only if the panes are switchable, because that would give even more freedom to customize

[MuTools]

Yes, but only if the panes are switchable, because that would give even more freedom to customize

Yes indeed.
But i think that even more important that being able to customize that aspect is to have a good design out of the box.

So assuming that the panels won't be movable, then what would be best: MULAB & SESSION menu buttons in 1 panel or in separate panels?
cfr this draft mockup: http://www.mutools.com/pics/temp/p20111129.png

And if 2 separate panels is best, then what would be the best factory order? :

MULAB - SESSION - FOCUSSED MODULE - TRANSPORT
SESSION - MULAB - FOCUSSED MODULE - TRANSPORT
MULAB - FOCUSSED MODULE - TRANSPORT - SESSION
SESSION - FOCUSSED MODULE - TRANSPORT - MULAB

Lets try to forget M3, lets think about this as if you're a first time user.

[liquidsound]

Maybe I missed the answer somewhere in other topics but, why is that we have now a beautiful envelope drawing feature by itself and not in the sequence editor under the piano-roll? That makes it quite difficult to synchronize it with the midi event located in a piano-roll while the envelope is on a different part. OK when by direct input via MIDI controller but by hand is not easy to match the note events...
Very beautiful indeed added feature. Can this be port to the piano-roll eventually?

Maybe in a future version..?
I can't say much about this now, i must study it first.

Wrt syncing editors: Note that in M4 you can do 'parrallel editing' by opening multiple editors at the same time.

For a non programmer it seems easy to apply one thing to another. I didn't realize that something so similar ( from one element to another) was complex.
Could a Window Transparency setting be applied within MuLab? (Dirty workaround to my request ). This would solve "Ghosted" notes and the Envelops temporarily until further development.

[> DiGiT <]

hey what about adding windows to the 'hidden window task bar' that are simply obscured by other windows? i mean when i open a small module editor and then go to edit a sequence, the module editor gets stuck behind the sequence editor. technically hidden, and thats frustrating. if there were a button for it then i wouldnt need to dig for the show button or minimize whatever is obscuring it.

[pljones]

MULAB - SESSION - FOCUSSED MODULE - TRANSPORT
SESSION - MULAB - FOCUSSED MODULE - TRANSPORT
MULAB - FOCUSSED MODULE - TRANSPORT - SESSION
SESSION - FOCUSSED MODULE - TRANSPORT - MULAB

Lets try to forget M3, lets think about this as if you're a first time user.

MULAB -> SESSION -> TRANSPORT -> FOCUSSED MODULE
I would say that's the most logical hierarchy and should be the factory default order:

MULAB looks after the whole application.
SESSION looks after the session being edited.
TRANSPORT also works at the session level, really, but is only one aspect of the session.
FOCUSSED MODULE is finer-grained than TRANSPORT.

I'm happy with menus being "stuck" to the main window; tools, however, should be freely positionable across the entire desktop area (not just within the application main window).

[Nielzie]

MULAB -> SESSION -> TRANSPORT -> FOCUSSED MODULE
I would say that's the most logical hierarchy and should be the factory default order:

MULAB looks after the whole application.
SESSION looks after the session being edited.
TRANSPORT also works at the session level, really, but is only one aspect of the session.
FOCUSSED MODULE is finer-grained than TRANSPORT.

I agree

Also, since there is quite some free space between the panels available, you might even consider placing there some small icon "shortcuts" for most used functions (Open, Save, New, etc.)

[MuTools]

hey what about adding windows to the 'hidden window task bar' that are simply obscured by other windows? i mean when i open a small module editor and then go to edit a sequence, the module editor gets stuck behind the sequence editor. technically hidden, and thats frustrating. if there were a button for it then i wouldnt need to dig for the show button or minimize whatever is obscuring it.

Note that you can use Ctrl+Tab to step thru the open (but maybe obscured) windows.

[MuTools]

MULAB -> SESSION -> TRANSPORT -> FOCUSSED MODULE
I would say that's the most logical hierarchy and should be the factory default order:

And what would you prefer: MULAB and SESSION in 1 panel as it is now, or in separate panels cfr http://www.mutools.com/pics/temp/p20111129.png

I've personally given this some further thought too and i would keep it in 1 panel, as it is now. I don't very much like the idea in the above mockup picture.

MULAB looks after the whole application.
SESSION looks after the session being edited.
TRANSPORT also works at the session level, really, but is only one aspect of the session.
FOCUSSED MODULE is finer-grained than TRANSPORT.

Just FYI: Focussed Module is also a session-level thing.

I'm happy with menus being "stuck" to the main window; tools, however, should be freely positionable across the entire desktop area (not just within the application main window).

Which 'tools' you mean?
Do you mean that the transport and focussed module panels should not be inside the session window but be free floating tool windows?

[MuTools]

MULAB -> SESSION -> TRANSPORT -> FOCUSSED MODULE
I would say that's the most logical hierarchy and should be the factory default order:

MULAB looks after the whole application.
SESSION looks after the session being edited.
TRANSPORT also works at the session level, really, but is only one aspect of the session.
FOCUSSED MODULE is finer-grained than TRANSPORT.

I agree

Also, since there is quite some free space between the panels available, you might even consider placing there some small icon "shortcuts" for most used functions (Open, Save, New, etc.)

Yes had similar thoughts, but it's certainly not something M4. It's on the idea list wrt a next Mx. Having such 'dashboard'(s) could be a great thing. Not only for shortcuts, but also for editor docking, parameter docking, etc...
Anyway, that's future design work.

[MuTools]

Wrt syncing editors: Note that in M4 you can do 'parrallel editing' by opening multiple editors at the same time.

For a non programmer it seems easy to apply one thing to another. I didn't realize that something so similar ( from one element to another) was complex.

FYI: The 'envelope parts' and the 'sequence graphs' are completely different sub-systems. Maybe they'll grow more together in the future, to be researched.

I'm convinced the envelope parts are a welcome new feature in M4, even though there may be some overlap with the sequence graphs. But that may even be a plus in some musical situations.

[janamdo]

For soundconstruction and effects it should be handy if there were templates for the modules configuration in the deep editor.
You can store than particular effects routings and sounds and recall them with this jumpmenu
Also information about the sound
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Description
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additional tags

as example i took the vsti modular synth : quiver