Diva Alternatives

[BONES]

Might be, that most of the clueless idiots get attracted by Serum because it is really easy to master at least with the first steps and there are many tutorials for almost everything. But that doesn't imply the other way around, that all Serum Users are clueless idiots.

The ting is, if Serum appealed to people who knew what they were doing, there wouldn't be all those tutorials because people who know what they are doing would just be getting on with doing things. See how that works?

In terms of GUI, Serum is a real piece of art, because it has the widest spread, which I can think of, between an easy to use GUI, making it almost perceived as an undercomplex synth in the first step and therefore going incredibly deep, if you want.

If that's true, how come there is no way to apply envelope modulation to the filter cutoff from the front panel, where the rest of the filter controls are? That kills the workflow stone dead from the off, which makes all that other krap you mentioned worthless.

So you could spend half a lifetime to explore all the capabilities, if you want.

Or, and this might be something you've never actually thought about, you could go and make some f**king music.

[SamDi]

Might be, that most of the clueless idiots get attracted by Serum because it is really easy to master at least with the first steps and there are many tutorials for almost everything. But that doesn't imply the other way around, that all Serum Users are clueless idiots.

The thing is, if Serum appealed to people who knew what they were doing, there wouldn't be all those tutorials because people who know what they are doing would just be getting on with doing things. See how that works?

The thing is, if Serum appealed to people who knew what they are doing, there would still be the people appealed by Serum that need to learn a synth. The big amount of tutorials is primarily dedicated to the sheer market share. OK, and it is an ideal synth to learn. You can decide yourself, what you want to believe, what is the chicken and what's the egg here.

Furthermore, I wonder myself if your skills are so complete, that you never approach any tutorial video because you never need to learn anything new anymore? I for myself started to get interested in physical modeling and mimicking acoustic instruments since some weeks and what I never cared about for decades. Now I am a "clueless idiot", as most of us on any topic, I guess.

In terms of GUI, Serum is a real piece of art, because it has the widest spread, which I can think of, between an easy to use GUI, making it almost perceived as an undercomplex synth in the first step and therefore going incredibly deep, if you want.

If that's true, how come there is no way to apply envelope modulation to the filter cutoff from the front panel, where the rest of the filter controls are? That kills the workflow stone dead from the off, which makes all that other krap you mentioned worthless.

Did you ever try Serum? Applying an ENV to filter cutoff is just dragging this ENV tab to the cutoff knob, adjusting mod level on this knob and that's it. All done directly from the front panel in 1 second...

So you could spend half a lifetime to explore all the capabilities, if you want.

Or, and this might be something you've never actually thought about, you could go and make some f**king music.

This is a complete different topic from what we discussed, but of course I do think about it. Why? Because this topic is the cousin of "I could hang in an internet forum and discuss some meaningless crap or go and make some f**king music"

[_leras]

PolyMax by UAD is comparable to some degree, at least soundwise, although it's much more basic.

you think so? I think it's a great synht, but the sounds is much cleaner/modern to me. It's a thicker sound, but can't do the soft pads that Diva does as well.

[_leras]

The ting is, if Serum appealed to people who knew what they were doing, there wouldn't be all those tutorials because people who know what they are doing would just be getting on with doing things. See how that works?

Nah...

The more people use something, the more tutorials it gets. It's probably the most popular synth since Massive. I don't own it but it sounds good AND like the sounds many hit tracks use.

Fine for you to not like it though.

[Uncle E]

This is a complete different topic from what we discussed

This thread went off the rails a few pages back.

[Uncle E]

you think so? I think it's a great synht, but the sounds is much cleaner/modern to me. It's a thicker sound, but can't do the soft pads that Diva does as well.

Yes, agreed. Also, PolyMAX is too simple/limited to be compared to DIVA.

[zerocrossing]

Might be, that most of the clueless idiots get attracted by Serum because it is really easy to master at least with the first steps and there are many tutorials for almost everything. But that doesn't imply the other way around, that all Serum Users are clueless idiots.

The thing is, if Serum appealed to people who knew what they were doing, there wouldn't be all those tutorials because people who know what they are doing would just be getting on with doing things. See how that works?

The thing is, if Serum appealed to people who knew what they are doing, there would still be the people appealed by Serum that need to learn a synth. The big amount of tutorials is primarily dedicated to the sheer market share. OK, and it is an ideal synth to learn. You can decide yourself, what you want to believe, what is the chicken and what's the egg here.

Furthermore, I wonder myself if your skills are so complete, that you never approach any tutorial video because you never need to learn anything new anymore? I for myself started to get interested in physical modeling and mimicking acoustic instruments since some weeks and what I never cared about for decades. Now I am a "clueless idiot", as most of us on any topic, I guess.

In terms of GUI, Serum is a real piece of art, because it has the widest spread, which I can think of, between an easy to use GUI, making it almost perceived as an undercomplex synth in the first step and therefore going incredibly deep, if you want.

If that's true, how come there is no way to apply envelope modulation to the filter cutoff from the front panel, where the rest of the filter controls are? That kills the workflow stone dead from the off, which makes all that other krap you mentioned worthless.

Did you ever try Serum? Applying an ENV to filter cutoff is just dragging this ENV tab to the cutoff knob, adjusting mod level on this knob and that's it. All done directly from the front panel in 1 second...

So you could spend half a lifetime to explore all the capabilities, if you want.

Or, and this might be something you've never actually thought about, you could go and make some f**king music.

This is a complete different topic from what we discussed, but of course I do think about it. Why? Because this topic is the cousin of "I could hang in an internet forum and discuss some meaningless crap or go and make some f**king music"

I really don’t understand the “use something simple so you can make music” argument. First off, every plugin has presets, so calling up one and playing some notes is just as easy on the most complicated synthesizer as it is with a piano plugin.

Second, if you really feel like it’s a hassle to do sound design on something as easy as Serum, maybe you should find another instrument. Piano? Harmonica? Bongos? I get that many of us really just want to copy the sounds we heard on recordings we like, but some of us got into it because we enjoy the exploration of sound. Yesterday, I started making a Prophet 12 patch where I was experimenting with not using the filter at all. Only the feedback and feedback tuning were used. Not really that complicated of a patch, but it really led me to something and I ended up jamming with it and “making music.” Could I have made 15 more minutes of music if I had just picked a preset and started? Maybe, but the inspiration of the sound that I’d created was really helpful to get things going.

[vurt]

Exploration of sound

Yup, this is where im at.
music, not so much tbh, insofar as lately, im moving outside audio ranges with oscillators.
going so low, they become broken ticks and pops and clicks, not sure this is possible much on the digital side (ignoring time stretching audio, which doesn't sound the same anyway...) as the oscillator cant be dropped so low, they seem to just stop making any sound grrr...

[HOTF]

Might be, that most of the clueless idiots get attracted by Serum because it is really easy to master at least with the first steps and there are many tutorials for almost everything. But that doesn't imply the other way around, that all Serum Users are clueless idiots.

The ting is, if Serum appealed to people who knew what they were doing, there wouldn't be all those tutorials because people who know what they are doing would just be getting on with doing things. See how that works?

In terms of GUI, Serum is a real piece of art, because it has the widest spread, which I can think of, between an easy to use GUI, making it almost perceived as an undercomplex synth in the first step and therefore going incredibly deep, if you want.

If that's true, how come there is no way to apply envelope modulation to the filter cutoff from the front panel, where the rest of the filter controls are? That kills the workflow stone dead from the off, which makes all that other krap you mentioned worthless.

So you could spend half a lifetime to explore all the capabilities, if you want.

Or, and this might be something you've never actually thought about, you could go and make some f**king music.

This confirms it. You have never used Serum . You can drag any modulator to any paramater in serum without changing panel.

[Daru925]

Making largely unusable patches that i can "eureka!" use much much later in time is one of my favourite things ^^
But i do find helpful to separate making patches and making music.
Of course both processes invariably intertwine, when creating a subbass for instance, or making sure the patch fits well.

[Uncle E]

Making largely unusable patches that i can "eureka!" use much much later in time is one of my favourite things ^^
But i do find helpful to separate making patches and making music.
Of course both processes invariably intertwine, when creating a subbass for instance, or making sure the patch fits well.

Yes, a friend of mine does exactly that and had a lot of success with that workflow. His tracks became well-known for their bizarre, quirky sounds. Personally, I never do it and that's probably why my synth sounds are super straight forward.

To bring it back on topic, this is another strength of DIVA. The Universal Audio and Softube Model synths arguably sound more accurate to classic synths than DIVA but they're incredibly limited in comparison. You're not going to get many experimental sounds out of UA's Minimoog. Even DIVA doesn't go far enough for a lot of people but it does a pretty good job of straddling that fine line between authenticity and flexibility.

[Super Piano Hater 64]

I really don’t understand the “use something simple so you can make music” argument. First off, every plugin has presets, so calling up one and playing some notes is just as easy on the most complicated synthesizer as it is with a piano plugin.

Anyone who starts out on hardware and switches to software is liable to end up with that mindset, especially those who stubbornly push all their old habits into new contexts in a solipsistic crusade to internalize their locus of control... Which I guess is literally everybody, from a certain point of view.

[zerocrossing]

I really don’t understand the “use something simple so you can make music” argument. First off, every plugin has presets, so calling up one and playing some notes is just as easy on the most complicated synthesizer as it is with a piano plugin.

Anyone who starts out on hardware and switches to software is liable to end up with that mindset, especially those who stubbornly push all their old habits into new contexts in a solipsistic crusade to internalize their locus of control... Which I guess is literally everybody, from a certain point of view.

I don't know if it's as heady as all that. I've just always been that person who wants to find the limits of things and break them and then use the way something breaks in a way I find interesting. It wasn't very long after I got an electric guitar that I was duct taping a pink Ibanez delay and Muff Pi to it so that I could stand next to my amp and manipulate the knobs and acoustic feedback. I don't even see myself as ever "switching" from something like that to something else, like a synthesizer. It's all a continuum of things that make sounds, and either I find them interesting and useful or not. As much as I like my hardware synths, I often wonder how people who don't use software instruments can manage to stay away from such a fertile playground.

[pdxindy]

To bring it back on topic, this is another strength of DIVA. The Universal Audio and Softube Model synths arguably sound more accurate to classic synths than DIVA but they're incredibly limited in comparison. You're not going to get many experimental sounds out of UA's Minimoog. Even DIVA doesn't go far enough for a lot of people but it does a pretty good job of straddling that fine line between authenticity and flexibility.

And now, if you use Bitwig, the CLAP version of Diva can have unlimited per voice modulation plus various parameters that cannot be modulated directly in Diva can be in the CLAP version.

[syntonica]

To bring it back on topic, this is another strength of DIVA. The Universal Audio and Softube Model synths arguably sound more accurate to classic synths than DIVA but they're incredibly limited in comparison. You're not going to get many experimental sounds out of UA's Minimoog. Even DIVA doesn't go far enough for a lot of people but it does a pretty good job of straddling that fine line between authenticity and flexibility.

And now, if you use Bitwig, the CLAP version of Diva can have unlimited per voice modulation plus various parameters that cannot be modulated directly in Diva can be in the CLAP version.

Again with the Divwig...