Future of Windows in pro audio

[Tiles]

Only made it through your bs first paragraph, we were talking daws not os. The rest I'm guessing is the same bla, bla.
Love ya Tiles, peace

Then stick to daws and stop bsing

Actually this is a Windows question thread, so we shouldn't talk about Linux at all.

Love ya too

[keys_au1]

Windows is a nice os and will be around for a long while, macos also! I've used both over the last 40 years. But Linux is not all the doom and gloom you portray. 100% Linux here for the past three years or so, it just runs. Plugins are becoming more available, picked a couple Kazrog plugins this weekend they sound great.

Agree there are nice plugins and other VSTs now native to linux but until a developer creates a "usable" and straightforward hosting app (outside DAWs) then it will remain the domain of "bedroom jockeys" and new wave studios. All outside the main. Linux Audio will remain "niche" at best.

On top of all that, to run your hardware editing and control apps (all exclusively available only on Windows/Mac as no person or company has thought to develop them native to Linux), the OS needs low level USB support. It is simply not possible in Linux using the WINE operation. AS all the other Windows wrapping apps are based on WINE, none of them work. So this is another area Linux needs to get included to also appeal to the mainstream. All jmo of course!

NOTE: this is from a former Linux user.

[FrettedSynth]

@key_au1 cannot argue Linux could use a mainstage/gig performer application, although I use Reaper for this! It's not as straightforward and full featured as I would like. Hardware control is definitely another, at least there is some movement with things like focusrite. For now I buy what works with Linux.

[lunardigs]

Windows and Mac have had a duopoly for waaaaaaaay too long. They've run the show this whole time. There's been no real choice. I want to see it end.
If the future of Windows pro audio is doom, then let's have it!

[Tiles]

I do not really see Windows and macOS as a duopoly. They are platforms, not the creative tools themselves.

What actually matters for making music is the software. You do not write music in Windows, macOS, or Linux. You write it in a DAW and with VST instruments that run on one of those systems.

Windows and macOS attract developers because the market is there and development is relatively predictable and efficient. Linux is much harder to target. Different environments, missing standards, and a smaller user base increase the effort and risk for software developers.

I know i may sound like a broken record but if Linux wants to become a serious option for professional audio, that situation has to change first. I understand the idea and would like to see it succeed, but based on the current situation, I do not really see this becoming reality.

If you want to make music, you usually choose the instrument that other musicians are already using, because it lets you communicate, collaborate, and learn more easily. You do not pick a kitchen spoon and expect orchestras to adapt around it. Tools become standards because they work well for many people, not because they are ideologically appealing.

In the end it is less about operating systems competing with each other and more about where developers can realistically build and maintain great audio tools and where musicians can write their music.

[Tiles]

@key_au1 cannot argue Linux could use a mainstage/gig performer application, although I use Reaper for this! It's not as straightforward and full featured as I would like. Hardware control is definitely another, at least there is some movement with things like focusrite. For now I buy what works with Linux.

But that way your job becomes Linux, and not making music anymore.

[FrettedSynth]

@key_au1 cannot argue Linux could use a mainstage/gig performer application, although I use Reaper for this! It's not as straightforward and full featured as I would like. Hardware control is definitely another, at least there is some movement with things like focusrite. For now I buy what works with Linux.

But that way your job becomes Linux, and not making music anymore.

Nah! Linux just runs, it becomes Reaper the same application I was using on Windows.

[Tiles]

Yeah, I get what you mean. On the Reaper side there is no real limitation. The issue is more with parts of the plugin ecosystem. Some VST instruments that work on Windows simply do not run on Linux. And as you said yourself, the workaround is usually to only buy or use what works on Linux. But that also means that if you suddenly need a specific trumpet from a sample library that only runs on Windows, you just cannot use it. That is what I meant by saying that at some point the focus shifts from just making music to constantly adapting to Linux.

[FrettedSynth]

Yeah, I get what you mean. On the Reaper side there is no real limitation. The issue is more with parts of the plugin ecosystem. Some VST instruments that work on Windows simply do not run on Linux. And as you said yourself, the workaround is usually to only buy or use what works on Linux. But that also means that if you suddenly need a specific trumpet from a sample library that only runs on Windows, you just cannot use it. That is what I meant by saying that at some point the focus shifts from just making music to constantly adapting to Linux.

It's only a problem if you need that "specific" trumpet sample! Personally I would rather have a trumpet player come in and play than use samples. I guess I'm just from a different Era, still prefer a group of guys playing together like in the dark ages, still mic my old 1979 Ludwig kit. So in a sense we are both correct! We just have different needs.

[Tiles]

So for you it's good enough. Fair enough

[lunardigs]

Linux isn't some giant PITA. Where's this attitude is coming from?
--oh, people who don't actually use it, sounds like. Imagine that.

But c'mon, the OS is indeed a part of the creative process/environment. You're just playing a game by pretending it isn't.
And as for me, at a certain point, the Windows way--and it is a whole way of doing things--became such a drag that I had to abandon it.

[bjm4tt]

Linux isn't some giant PITA. Where's this attitude is coming from?
--oh, people who don't actually use it, sounds like. Imagine that.

But c'mon, the OS is indeed a part of the creative process/environment. You're just playing a game by pretending it isn't.
And as for me, at a certain point, the Windows way--and it is a whole way of doing things--became such a drag that I had to abandon it.

I really wanted to try switching, spent the last 2 weeks and today I decided that I value my sanity more. Tried a miriad of distros (all ubuntu flavors) and desktop environment combinations, switched graphics cards three times, scripted my ass of and it was still unreliable, buggy and just a poor user experience on a quit recent 13700K cpu, plenty of RAM, Radeon RX 7600 XT / Nvidia 5060 / 1050 config. Nothing exotic.

What I realized is this old analogy: "You wanted a banana but what you got was a gorilla holding the banana and the entire jungle." — Joe Armstrong

With every single aspect, audio, latency, video, codecs, desktop environments I just wanted to have the basic defaults to work, but had to learn about the whole history of KDE, GNOME, the Nvidia feud, Plasma, Wayland, X11, Flatpak, Yabrige, Wine 9.21, EDID, kernel parameters, xrandr, kscreen doctor, power-profiles-daemon, cpupowergui.

And at the end, something was always broken.

I don't like the direction Microsoft is heading, but for now I'd rather try to live with it, than dealing with a primadonna OS. That't the bitter conclusion for me.

[Grizzellda]

I do understand that this is a Windows thread.

Linux really looks like an ongoing "work in progress" to me, and quite frankly, this thread alone...all the ideas you guys are throwing out, this is part of the evolution of Linux!

In real time, on the fly!

[lunardigs]

With every single aspect, audio, latency, video, codecs, desktop environments I just wanted to have the basic defaults to work, but had to learn about the whole history of KDE, GNOME, the Nvidia feud, Plasma, Wayland, X11, Flatpak, Yabrige, Wine 9.21, EDID, kernel parameters, xrandr, kscreen doctor, power-profiles-daemon, cpupowergui.

And at the end, something was always broken.

I don't like the direction Microsoft is heading, but for now I'd rather try to live with it, than dealing with a primadonna OS. That't the bitter conclusion for me.

I don't want to dismiss what you're saying as crazy, but I have to admit, it sounds insane.
Why were you messing with all those things?
And btw, not a fan of Ubuntu.

[lunardigs]

I do understand that this is a Windows thread.

Linux really looks like an ongoing "work in progress" to me, and quite frankly, this thread alone...all the ideas you guys are throwing out, this is part of the evolution of Linux!

In real time, on the fly!

The future of Windows is AI driven tyranny and doom.
It's unfortunate or something, but that's where reality is at.