[Fixed in 4.4] Weird bug: latest "Spectral Suite" update not included in upgrade plan

[BobDog]

Having spent 2 decades doing social and environmental justice work, I can state with certainty that plenty of those authoritarians attach themselves to social movements, campaigns and causes that ostensibly support the little people.

We got what we wanted, you were wrong, they changed their model. You're still trying to subtly paint people who raised a voice against this move as "the bad people".

Think about that. What does that say?

You are somewhat stuck in an us/them dichotomy...

Right from the first moment I heard about the whole Add-on thing, I stated without any ambiguity that Bitwig was violating the spirit of the agreement that was there with users... an agreement that they fostered. I said IMO, how they went about it was unethical. I repeated that multiple times and never said anything to the contrary.

The thing is, I am capable of clearly and definitively criticizing Bitwig's initial move and also expressing an unwillingness to support how some people went about responding to it or who just wanted to join a hate-fest.

Because of that, you have stuck me, in your mind, in the 'them' category. And then you assume that everything I say has some machiavellian purpose to undermine the 'us'.

So according to you, and since I am one of the people who raised their voice against what Bitwig did, I am subtly trying to paint myself as one of the bad people.

You left out the part where you said more than once that Bitwig would do nothing and that this would all blow over.

I can repeat what I said if you need. You stood against boycotting, complaining, all of it, even if you believed it was wrong what they did. You also absolutely without a doubt stood against any sort of public outcry. You now benefit from what you stood against.

You're just another human here, no hate here, these are words on a screen, but like many many many people these days you're loath to be wrong at all costs, you will protect your ego from this travesty of simply being on the wrong side even once. You come back with excuses and negativity towards the very people that changed the course of a company you love, and to really sink that in, you only concentrated on the part of my post that was about authoritarianism etc. not the parts about supporting this company you supposedly love.

Seriously if you want Bitwig to thrive we should be talking about how to support them, not this nonsense. They IMO do need to make money if we want them to develop the DAW we're so dammed passionate about, and looking at their website all that's left if you own Bitwig and have a current Update Plan is merch.

Well what can I say to this.

First of all I have had run ins in my head with pdxlindy before, they are very pro BW, someone that loves the software and loves using it.

In this case pdxlindy has not stood against reasonable posts about this issue, they have stood against the insane way that some have reacted to this, not the normal complaining but the extremity.

What we now have is the mad pitchfork welding people like you thinking they have some power, they have caused change, slapping themselves on the back, ego protected as they are never wrong. Ring any bells?

[BoogerSnot]

Lost in all the chatter...

These are great devices! Well, except maybe the Harmonics one... That one I couldn't quite make a go of after trying it on multiple tracks...

Even just by themselves I was getting some interesting color. Good stuff.

[machinesworking]

Also generally, we all make mistakes.

The important thing is owning up to mistakes and doing your best to make things better. This is a sadly lacking nowadays.

BW have done this, they made a mistake, they owned up and they have made it better.

But still we have people on this forum sharpening their pitchforks. Not admitting getting the pitchforks out was a mistake in the first place, never mind the next two stages.

Go over my posts and most of us that called for boycotts (what you refer to as "pitchforks" etc.), are passionate about the company, that's why out voice was loud.

Seriously you 100% do not get it. The pitchforks led to the change, period, end of discussion. You're also 100% correct that continuing to rally pitchforks towards Bitwig after the change makes absolutely no sense at all. Towards apologists and authoritarians that now benefit from those threats of boycotts that still attempt to paint the whole thing as if all this was for naught? Yeah, again, being on the wrong side of history in this little war at least doesn't get you killed, but you don't get any medal either.

[simmo75]

I’m happy Bitwig came through & would never have paid for the devices, they’re cool but not that cool, definitely not paid add on cool. Maybe they realized they were tripping with charging extra for these. Only the disciples would’ve paid for them.

[Phil B]

I get that PTSD is a real and serious condition, but everyone please just pack up your things and go home. The war is over and everybody won. Go hug somebody ... when you need a little bit of rage in your life again, facebook will always be there for you!

[Benutzername]

Seriously if you want Bitwig to thrive we should be talking about how to support them, not this nonsense. They IMO do need to make money if we want them to develop the DAW we're so dammed passionate about, and looking at their website all that's left if you own Bitwig and have a current Update Plan is merch.

Bitwig could open the API and offer 3rd party devices in the shop as well as sound packs. I don't think that anybody would argue against that.

Maybe they could also introduce lifetime updates for a certain amount (eg for the cost of 5 update plans or something like that).

There are a lot of options. And they definitely need more merch.

[machinesworking]

In this case pdxlindy has not stood against reasonable posts about this issue, they have stood against the insane way that some have reacted to this, not the normal complaining but the extremity.

Yes, tone policing makes sense...

He flatly stated it was all for naught, that Bitwig would do nothing. They did something, he's still trying to tone police the whole thing.

IMO there is no shame in being wrong, there's only shame in being wrong and boldly defending the reasons you were wrong as being the other sides fault.

[machinesworking]

Seriously if you want Bitwig to thrive we should be talking about how to support them, not this nonsense. They IMO do need to make money if we want them to develop the DAW we're so dammed passionate about, and looking at their website all that's left if you own Bitwig and have a current Update Plan is merch.

Bitwig could open the API and offer 3rd party devices in the shop as well as sound packs. I don't think that anybody would argue against that.

Maybe they could also introduce lifetime updates for a certain amount (eg for the cost of 5 update plans or something like that).

There are a lot of options. And they definitely need more merch.

Agreed, the shirt I wanted is sold out. I'm 100% for them selling sound packs as separate. I never use the things and when they're included in a DAW it's just space on my SSD I can't use. A Grid store makes sense too. You can buy custom Reaktor and Max MSP patches from people, if Bitwig propped it up on their store and took a cut, that's a solid plan.

[BobDog]

Also generally, we all make mistakes.

The important thing is owning up to mistakes and doing your best to make things better. This is a sadly lacking nowadays.

BW have done this, they made a mistake, they owned up and they have made it better.

But still we have people on this forum sharpening their pitchforks. Not admitting getting the pitchforks out was a mistake in the first place, never mind the next two stages.

Go over my posts and most of us that called for boycotts (what you refer to as "pitchforks" etc.), are passionate about the company, that's why out voice was loud.

Seriously you 100% do not get it. The pitchforks led to the change, period, end of discussion. You're also 100% correct that continuing to rally pitchforks towards Bitwig after the change makes absolutely no sense at all. Towards apologists and authoritarians that now benefit from those threats of boycotts that still attempt to paint the whole thing as if all this was for naught? Yeah, again, being on the wrong side of history in this little war at least doesn't get you killed, but you don't get any medal either.

No the pitchforks didn’t, the class actions, the legal claims, the boycotts, they didn’t, not the vocal 10%.

What did was the more general feeling about not trusting what the update plan was worth, not probably worth anything, no point getting, wait and see.

So the majority of the people behind the front row of shouting pitchforks, they make the difference.

The front row struts around afterwards though.

[spiritlev]

What we now have is the mad pitchfork welding people like you...

Honestly... if the people who were not happy with Bitwig's original move to charge extra for add-ons behaved like those who defended it, Bitwig's actions would have been compared to Hitler, Ted Bundy and Satan himself.

There are no hordes of mad-eyed pitchfork wielding fanatics. There never have been.

Bitwig did something wrong.
Lots of users raised legitimate complaints about it.
Bitwig fixed it.
Users are happy now.

That's it.

[Maykie]

Capitalism is healthy when people are able to vote with their wallets for better products, instead of allowing themselves to be treated like a cattle. Sadly, these days you will find microtransations even in expensive cars (bmw heated seat subscription), not to mention smartphones, laptops and entire gaming industry which can be described in one word - cesspit.

I'm proud of this community. Rest of the society could learn from you.

[PatrickW]

What I learned from this story ...

If Bitwig would have reacted after one or two days with something like, "We messed up, please give us some time to clean it up", no harm would have been done.
The solution Bitwig presented in the end (after one week) is perfect !

BUT, in those 7 days without any communication from Bitwig, I (and probably some other people) started to think.
Some companies, religions, politicians don't like us to start to think.
So the thinking in my case was : "Why am I using Bitwig over another DAW" ?
I had a FL Studio license from 13 years ago hanging around and I started to compare it to Bitwig.
I realised that FL Studio changed enormously in those 13 years.
I also found out that, although I was incredibly fascinated by the Bitwig Grid, in fact I used it in none of my songs and that the FL Studio Patcher plugin is extremely powerfull.
And that the piano roll, which is my main instrument, is enormously more powerfull in FL Studio compared to Bitwig.

In a previous post, I claimed to drop Bitwig completely, except for the older running projects.
I indeed switched to FL Studio as my main DAW, but I will keep Bitwig as a second, to honor the really generous solution they provided and to fill in the gaps that FL Studio probably is going to present me.

The big message to all companies is : "Communicate, communicate, communicate, ..."
It does not matter that you make mistakes, we all do every day, it's very human, but please admit it and promise to learn from it and promise to provide a solution AS SOON AS YOU REALIZE YOU MADE THE MISTAKE !
Bitwig provided the more than perfect solution (congratulations !!!) but they missed the communication part completely.
As a result : FL Studio is now my nr 1 DAW, I will only use Bitwig when FL Studio cannot deliver.
In the past, I was supporting Bitwig by buying the upgrade plan about every year to support them, but now, I will only buy an upgrade plan when it is really needed.
I wish all the best to the Bitwig team and I hope they learned something from this !

And except for the few trolls on this forum (some cracking down Bitwig, some defending their fraud), I found it to be a very "civilized" thread.
Yes, people had different opinions about this, but that's great !
It reflects our differenct characters, ways of thinking, ,,.
In the end, this thread delivered more than I would have expected.
So I wish all the best to the Bitwig staff members, but also to all the people in this thread that came forward to put a clear fraud into the daylight.

[wilkins_micawber]

I was on FL Studio for 10+ years and switched to Bitwig studio a year ago. I could never go back. It takes less clicks to do almost everything in Bitwig. So much more window management in FL Studio. You have to manually route every individual instrument to a playlist lane in FL, whereas in Bitwig that's the default. Once you get to end-game FL use, you'll have 20 patcher windows all over the place instead of signal flow management neatly tethered to the instrument channel. Have fun managing that. To create an MSEG or ADSR in FL Studio for instance, you have to open a patcher, create an ADSR, enable signal outs from the ADSR, enable signal ins on a plugin, and then manually wire it into the plugin. You have to be high to use FL over Bitwig, for real.

[_leras]

2. There will always be company shills, they say something like 30% of people are authoritarians. They will supplicate themselves to the boss, they have no ability to have a real opinion of their own, they will defend draconian or bad actions from above always choosing to side with authority over the "little people".

Bitwig are the 'little people', so cruelly attacked for a mere error of judgement. This is my opinion.

People can behave politely. This is my opinion.

Bitwig should have included this package in then upgrade plan. This is my opinion. (which I politely emailed them about last week)

[pdxindy]

Lost in all the chatter...

These are great devices! Well, except maybe the Harmonics one... That one I couldn't quite make a go of after trying it on multiple tracks...

Even just by themselves I was getting some interesting color. Good stuff.

Heh... so far, Harmonics is my favorite