Tim's Rhino bank 2
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- KVRAF
- 19818 posts since 16 Sep, 2001 from Las Vegas,USA
Damn people give 'Tick a break.He's offering a monster synth for an incredible price so just buy it for cris sake!Even the incredible presets available now(Dan's Tick's and Tim's)haven't pushed Rhino to it's limits yet.Even if you could check them all out in the demo you still wouldn't be hearing Rhino at 100%.The ability to add more waveforms(from Tick himself) and the feature to save/load envelopes,user waves and effects presets it could be a very long time before Rhino reaches it's maximum capability.Ticks a good man with some great products it really chaps me to see him dogged in the forums over a demo.Just buy Rhino and enjoy,if you can't tell what a monster it is from 64 presets then you ain't listening.I heard about 5 patches before I knew I was in love.
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- KVRAF
- 2582 posts since 24 Apr, 2003 from Canada
Personally I don't want to give 'Tick a hard time, I just made a suggestion. If the demo scheme stays the same, thats his decision.
Its great that so many people advocate for the synth, but for myself, I have to hear the sounds rather than have people describe or praise them to determine whether they are appropriate for my music. (the 64 demo presets are good, but inconclusive) Maybe $113 US (about $140 cdn dollars to me) is very little to many of you but to me thats a significant portion of my disposable income.
If 'Tick comes through with lots of preset mp3 demos from the extra banks that would help alot to 'close the sale' so to speak, for me and I'm guessing quite a few others.
And for the demo mp3s - might I suggest just a single note held down as in the previous (unless its a preset made for chords - in which case a simple chord would do)
Its great that so many people advocate for the synth, but for myself, I have to hear the sounds rather than have people describe or praise them to determine whether they are appropriate for my music. (the 64 demo presets are good, but inconclusive) Maybe $113 US (about $140 cdn dollars to me) is very little to many of you but to me thats a significant portion of my disposable income.
If 'Tick comes through with lots of preset mp3 demos from the extra banks that would help alot to 'close the sale' so to speak, for me and I'm guessing quite a few others.
And for the demo mp3s - might I suggest just a single note held down as in the previous (unless its a preset made for chords - in which case a simple chord would do)
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- Banned
- 22457 posts since 5 Sep, 2001
[DELETED]
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- KVRist
- 452 posts since 22 Mar, 2002
I have to say I held off buying Rhino at the beginning because there were not enough presets included and also because it did not get press that other so called revolutionary soft synths have. Then about 2 months ago I took the plunge and purchased it and I have to say it has an amazing sound. However, the big plus points for me at the moment is the continuing number of quality banks being created on a regular basis, a developer who will continue to develop it and the fact that it has not reached its potential.
In the latest Future Music Magazine - it states how could we have missed out on such a gem for so long - indeed.
In the latest Future Music Magazine - it states how could we have missed out on such a gem for so long - indeed.
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- KVRist
- 32 posts since 10 Oct, 2003
I wish there would be access to more programs from the gui instead of loading a new bank all the time.
Tick ?
A random bank create ? (then keep or kick)
Tick ?
Tick ?
A random bank create ? (then keep or kick)
Tick ?
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- KVRAF
- Topic Starter
- 3388 posts since 29 May, 2001 from New York, NY
Fette Töle: Your suggestion is nice, but not applicable because of the inner workings of the copy protection algorithm. We can discuss that offline if you're interested.
Floyd: I agree 113 $US doesn't place the synth in the "very cheap" category. Also, the current change rate for US$ to EUR doesn't help. On the other hand, you'll agree it's cheap compared to vsti's that can produce sounds of similar depth.
Soundspectral: I'll give a try to random bank creation. However my concern is that generated presets could be highly un-optimized (for instance, they would allocate oscillators but not use them in any way in the sound generation). Of course I could try to code a "clever" random preset generator....
Also, more presets available in a given bank would mean more memory used, and thus overall worse performance.
All: there's little that can be done about the CPU spikes when changing programs, unfortunately. Recomputing all these curves and envelopes and additive waves needs some CPU time
Thanks for all the warm comments.
'Tick
Floyd: I agree 113 $US doesn't place the synth in the "very cheap" category. Also, the current change rate for US$ to EUR doesn't help. On the other hand, you'll agree it's cheap compared to vsti's that can produce sounds of similar depth.
Soundspectral: I'll give a try to random bank creation. However my concern is that generated presets could be highly un-optimized (for instance, they would allocate oscillators but not use them in any way in the sound generation). Of course I could try to code a "clever" random preset generator....
Also, more presets available in a given bank would mean more memory used, and thus overall worse performance.
All: there's little that can be done about the CPU spikes when changing programs, unfortunately. Recomputing all these curves and envelopes and additive waves needs some CPU time
Thanks for all the warm comments.
'Tick
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- KVRist
- 234 posts since 29 Mar, 2002 from Germany
The new bank ist the very best of all (sorry Tick!)
Listening to these presets I remember my early days with the first tracks of Tangerine Dream, Ahra Temple, Klaus Schulze.....
I feel 30 years younger now!
Congratulations!!!
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- KVRAF
- 3057 posts since 9 Apr, 2003
I very much enjoyed playing with Tim's Bank 2, a nice blend of pads, one-note evolvers and textured leads -- and as with other Rhino banks, I like the evocative names as well
I wonder if Tim or someone could explain (or post a URL about) what is meant by "algorithmics" -- does it have to do with the filter envelopes, the sequencer, oscillators using different prime numbers, or what? [sorry, I'm a freshman at this]
and I would like to mention that I also had a cool time today browsing through a couple of Daniel's banks again, and even took notes with banks:presets and little jottings for a piece using those
I wonder if Tim or someone could explain (or post a URL about) what is meant by "algorithmics" -- does it have to do with the filter envelopes, the sequencer, oscillators using different prime numbers, or what?
[sorry, I'm a freshman at this]and I would like to mention that I also had a cool time today browsing through a couple of Daniel's banks again, and even took notes with banks:presets and little jottings for a piece using those
Last edited by hao nao on Sat Oct 11, 2003 7:42 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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- KVRAF
- 1949 posts since 21 Mar, 2003 from Labrador
Well said, Tek. A demo is supposed to give you an idea how the product works, not give you the whole product! IF you like what you see in the demo and in the product newsgroups, buy it already ?Teksonik wrote:Damn people give 'Tick a break.He's offering a monster synth for an incredible price so just buy it for cris sake!Even the incredible presets available now(Dan's Tick's and Tim's)haven't pushed Rhino to it's limits yet.Even if you could check them all out in the demo you still wouldn't be hearing Rhino at 100%.The ability to add more waveforms(from Tick himself) and the feature to save/load envelopes,user waves and effects presets it could be a very long time before Rhino reaches it's maximum capability.Ticks a good man with some great products it really chaps me to see him dogged in the forums over a demo.Just buy Rhino and enjoy,if you can't tell what a monster it is from 64 presets then you ain't listening.I heard about 5 patches before I knew I was in love.
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- KVRAF
- 1949 posts since 21 Mar, 2003 from Labrador
$113 USD is nothing in today's market. I just had a plumber in for 2 hours and it cost me $200 Cdn. Sure the drains got unclogged, but it's not nearly as much fun as Rhino. Plus, as an added bonus Tim's banks saved me the cost of taking a meditation class. Just fire up a TimBank and , hit a key and zone out! Thanks again, Tim!Big Tick wrote: Floyd: I agree 113 $US doesn't place the synth in the "very cheap" category. Also, the current change rate for US$ to EUR doesn't help. On the other hand, you'll agree it's cheap compared to vsti's that can produce sounds of similar depth.
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- KVRAF
- 1949 posts since 21 Mar, 2003 from Labrador
An algorythm is basically a formulae in mathematics, programming, or whatever.havran wrote: I wonder if Tim or someone could explain (or post a URL about) what is meant by "algorithmics" -- does it have to do with the filter envelopes, the sequencer, oscillators using different prime numbers, or what?
For instance, you might put the notes in the sequencer based on a formula. If the first note is C3, then use it's 4th, which is F3. Then for every pair of notes that use that formulae, you go, say, up an octave, then down an octave from the original formulae or rules. So you could then have the notes:
C3,F3, D4 G4 ,E2 A2 ,F4 Bb4 etc. Or something similar.
Just make up your own set of rules, set up the synth and see what happens. Have another look at Tim's algorythmics in the sequencer page and see if you can detect the patterns that he used, then apply them to other patches.
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- R.I.P.
- 3833 posts since 8 Sep, 2003 from Santa Clara, CA, USA
havran wrote:I very much enjoyed playing with Tim's Bank 2, a nice blend of pads, one-note evolvers and textured leads -- and as with other Rhino banks, I like the evocative names as well
I wonder if Tim or someone could explain (or post a URL about) what is meant by "algorithmics" -- does it have to do with the filter envelopes, the sequencer, oscillators using different prime numbers, or what?
Hi..yes...you can tell I am a space fan and a Lord of The Rings fan with some of those names. I even had a star atlas open to get some patch names as well
The reason I use the term "algorithmics" is basically the use of the sequencer, with most of the presets are in random mode. If you hold a note down for a while,( on one of the algorithmic presets) it will evolve and play different notes all the time, while still keeping to the structure, so it's not out of tune. The output also reminds me of the algorithmic programs I like to use such as M, Tunesmith, SB5, Music Mouse, ect. It great that I can incorporate it it into a patch. The only thing: is how do you catogorize it? Are they pads?, FX? or is it a new catagory all together.?
TimC
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- KVRAF
- 2582 posts since 24 Apr, 2003 from Canada
so each algorithmic patch randomly plays notes in its own key? ie. if you play an E3 note you will get random wackiness in the key of E?
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- KVRAF
- 1949 posts since 21 Mar, 2003 from Labrador
Not randomly, more like variations on a theme, or improvising. You have to base it on something. The something would be arbitrary rules that you made up, or a melody, or..whatever. Use your imagination.floyd wrote:so each algorithmic patch randomly plays notes in its own key? ie. if you play an E3 note you will get random wackiness in the key of E?
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- KVRAF
- 2582 posts since 24 Apr, 2003 from Canada
Ok, so how do you set these 'rules' for the algorithm? I'd assumed you just specify which notes (such as 4th, 5th, min7th) and then it randomly sequences through them.
Maybe this is too technical, I'm just curious how a synth can accomplish variations on a theme.
Maybe this is too technical, I'm just curious how a synth can accomplish variations on a theme.