Ableton piano roll limits

[PieBerger]

Can somebody explain what's the problem with Live's piano roll/MIDI editor?

No remappable shortcuts. Biggest wtf for me by far, and that's not just the MIDI editor of course, it's the whole program. Who the hell thought it was a good idea to hardcode ctrl+1 and ctrl+2 to change grid size, while simply pressing 1 and 2 does nothing? Surely it's much less aggravating and much more ergonomical to just press keys without holding a modifier key, right? And you can't remap that

But on the plus side, the fixed keyboard mappings are context sensitive unlike say Cubase. I'd rather have fixed bindings that are multi-function than have to remember more shortcuts because custom bindings are typically 1 to 1. Live has all sorts of considerations like this, it's why I choose to use it over the many others I have tried, in some cases multiple times over.

In the case of the piano roll, Live is quite limited in terms of mouse and keyboard style editing but Push and MIDI devices more than make up for it; this is why Live excels compared to other DAWs, except for maybe Bitwig which is very similar. AFAIK in FL you can't set up a random LFO to switch between 1/16 and 1/8 steps in the arpeggiator, while modulating the play direction by another LFO and note length via the modwheel or aftertouch in realtime. This is how you should be using Livenot trying to shoehorn in the workflow from another DAW.

[pdxindy]

AFAIK in FL you can't set up a random LFO to switch between 1/16 and 1/8 steps in the arpeggiator, while modulating the play direction by another LFO and note length via the modwheel or aftertouch in realtime. This is how you should be using Livenot trying to shoehorn in the workflow from another DAW.

Random pattern/melody generation is not a substitute for effective tools for specific patterns and melodies.

[PieBerger]

AFAIK in FL you can't set up a random LFO to switch between 1/16 and 1/8 steps in the arpeggiator, while modulating the play direction by another LFO and note length via the modwheel or aftertouch in realtime. This is how you should be using Livenot trying to shoehorn in the workflow from another DAW.

Random pattern/melody generation is not a substitute for effective tools for specific patterns and melodies.

Can you give some examples.

[Dirtgrain]

I've been using Live for two years--only used Cakewalk and Reaper before that. I feel like the midi editing isn't so bad. The only thing I don't like is using the zoom feature where you click on the bar above, hold and drag--especially if I want to zoom to the left-most measure. I think there is a shortcut for it, but man am I too lazy to find out

[LBN]

Defending a piano roll with limited features: "It still gets to where it's going."

[Dirtgrain]

Defending a piano roll with limited features: "It still gets to where it's going."

Complaining in exaggerated extremes for who knows what reason (strange attempt at self validation?):

[EnGee]

The only thing I don't like is using the zoom feature where you click on the bar above, hold and drag--especially if I want to zoom to the left-most measure. I think there is a shortcut for it, but man am I too lazy to find out

https://www.ableton.com/en/manual/live- ... shortcuts/


@topic: Personally, I don't have a problem with the Piano Roll. I find it a pleasant and comfortable to work with. The shortcuts are sometimes strange, like ctrl+u for quantize while in Cubase and S1 it is "q". Anyway, it depends on the workflow. I'm "old fashioned" maybe. I like to play what I want to record, then just make minor editing if I have mistakes. I don't use chord helpers. Sometimes I highlight the scale I want to work with, but in general I like to choose the scale before hand and write the notes on papers and also some chords. However, I don't follow 100% because sometimes I feel a need to press a key that is not in the scale.
I rarely play the drums I want to record (I use the keys with looping pattern). I usually load a midi pattern then editing it to my liking.

I tried to use helpers, but I hated them. They make the music uninspired and mechanical. I also dislike melody and chords generators. What's the point?! Instead, I read some chapters in a book about music theory to expand my understanding for music

[MuzikFreq]

I actually prefer Live's piano roll more than FL studio. double click and hold drag to length is amazing and some of the other shortcuts are to me a bit more streamlined.

And now with a key fold feature.... HO BOY this makes other tools I sometimes use to get ideas like Cuthulhu kinda pointless as I should be able to just fuss about in scales I don't normally work in.

[jonljacobi]

I've grown to love Live's piano roll. Being able to enter a note and adjust both its velocity and length at the same time. Turn off the grid and you can push and pull the rhythm at will. But I suppose that means that you must have some idea of the exact note position, pitch, length, and velocity you want. But there are now scale constraint and there's always been a paint tool. If you just want to throw stuff at the canvas and see what happens, you might find Live somewhat limiting.

In that case, however, I'd suggest expanding your own capabilities and knowledge. There's no true satisfaction to be had if you know in your heart that the music didn't really come from your own self, emotions, and experience. If that doesn't mean anything to you, then I think you might just be the vehicle with the tiny wheels.

[pixel85]

Another missing feature:
Grid is not adopting to selected Groove. It's still standard 1/16 or whatever no matter what. One thing that it's not showed visually, another that there's no Snap to Groove's Grid. Drawing accurate complex automation is PITA when working with Grooves in Live.
Another +1 for Cubase for making life way easier.

If this feature exists I would like to know but so far google didn't give me any answer.

[boark]

My biggest beef with Live's piano roll is that when creating notes using the draw tool, clicking and holding/dragging creates new notes instead of resizing the currently created note. Live does support it when using the pointer tool, but that requires double-clicking to place each note. I saw one training video where the host said he doesn't use the draw tool for this reason, and instead only uses the pointer tool despite the need to double-click to enter each note.

It would be better if the draw tool behavior changed so that the note length is adjusted when holding the mouse button and dragging the cursor, instead of creating multiple new notes of the same length. It would be better yet if the note length defaulted to the length of the last entered note. And, when hovering the cursor over a note and clicking, make that a selection instead of delete to move the note. Double click could delete instead. These workflow changes would make the piano roll much quicker to use for me.