help yourselflharless wrote:i just want a warm hole to climb into...
How to set up a nice mixdown
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- KVRAF
- 3266 posts since 22 Sep, 2003 from under the sun
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- KVRAF
- 12977 posts since 29 Sep, 2003 from Ottawa, Canada
Ron, I still think the way you mix your vocals is 
, but if it works for you then it works for you, case closed. 
, but if it works for you then it works for you, case closed. 
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- KVRist
- 145 posts since 3 Jun, 2005 from Ontario California
The thing about mixing I have discovered is to mix in mono first. This will make any phase problems audiable. In mono you mix so everything is heard and balanced, then when adjusting your pans, no two tracks are panned alike. In other words each track has its own piece of real estate in the audio spectrum. ( I posted somewhere here before that the audio spectrum is like a photograph ie. you don't want six foot uncle Harry standing in front of his four foot son. If everyone stands side by side, they occupy their own space. A lot of engineers will put the kick drum and the bass guitar dead center, but if you would put them slightly off center ( 11:45 & 12:15 ) They will have their own space. This process also holds true for EQ. No two tracks should be EQ'd the same or you will get a conflict and they will compete instead of compliment.
Of course in this bussiness there are no rules and sometimes you want the effect of the Fl-tom panned hard right, and the L-FRont-tom panned hard left. I learned this process of mixing in mono first, by doing a lot of am radio commercials and everything had to be clear and present. Then I had a client that was advertising on am & fm and we mixed the am first, then right after we did the fm ( stereo ) and with the am mix still up, the fm version was a joy to mix
Of course in this bussiness there are no rules and sometimes you want the effect of the Fl-tom panned hard right, and the L-FRont-tom panned hard left. I learned this process of mixing in mono first, by doing a lot of am radio commercials and everything had to be clear and present. Then I had a client that was advertising on am & fm and we mixed the am first, then right after we did the fm ( stereo ) and with the am mix still up, the fm version was a joy to mix
Chance Pataki
The Musicians Workshop
musicians.workshop@gte.net
http://www.the-musicians-workshop.com
The Musicians Workshop
musicians.workshop@gte.net
http://www.the-musicians-workshop.com
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- KVRAF
- Topic Starter
- 6490 posts since 14 Jun, 2004 from Rochester, NY
how is it crazy to set the vocals to sounding right together then taking all of that and adjusting the vocals main volume??? i dont get it man how can you not mix that way?
RonC
RonC
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- KVRAF
- 10815 posts since 26 Nov, 2004 from UK
rpc9943 wrote:how is it crazy to set the vocals to sounding right together then taking all of that and adjusting the vocals main volume??? i dont get it man how can you not mix that way?
RonC
sounds like a good way to mix to me
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- KVRAF
- 6740 posts since 25 Mar, 2002 from sheffield, england
Sounds ok to me too..rpc9943 wrote:how is it crazy to set the vocals to sounding right together then taking all of that and adjusting the vocals main volume??? i dont get it man how can you not mix that way?
RonC
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- KVRAF
- 25047 posts since 12 Jul, 2003 from West Caprazumia
indeed! - though young people over here usually not only prepare it the traditional German way but also in several international variations.braj wrote: Germans have a good coffee tradition. CafeZeit is like tea time in England, right?
but also our tea-ceremony is far more thoroughly executed than the Britsh one (I tend to exactly measure time and carefully weigh the tea (both depending on the sort of tea)) - tea-time in the UK is quick'n dirty...
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- KVRAF
- 6740 posts since 25 Mar, 2002 from sheffield, england
Well, some of us Brits do care about good tea & coffee! (especially coffee 
)
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- KVRAF
- 25047 posts since 12 Jul, 2003 from West Caprazumia
I guess so - rumours are there are even some Brits somewhere who care about good food!IIRs wrote:Well, some of us Brits do care about good tea & coffee! (especially coffee
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- KVRAF
- 12977 posts since 29 Sep, 2003 from Ottawa, Canada
It doesn't work that way for me. The backing vocals and the lead vocals are like separate entities for me. To me it's no different than mixing bass and guitar together and then adjusting them. I mean, OK, you have your bass and your guitar sounding great relative to each other, but what does that have to do with the mix as a whole? Each of those 2 components has its own place in the mix, and if I'm going to adjust them separately anyhow, why bother adjusting their submix level?rpc9943 wrote:how is it crazy to set the vocals to sounding right together then taking all of that and adjusting the vocals main volume??? i dont get it man how can you not mix that way?
RonC
The only thing those two things have in common in my mind is that they're both vocals, which is a coincidence of nomenclature only. I can't think of many situations in which I'd want to adjust the levels of both in parralel. More often, I'd think to myself, "The lead vocals need more level" and so I'll adjust the level of the lead vocal and leave the backing vocal alone. That's fine-- you can still do that in a submix, but then what's the purpose of the submix for me? To share a reverb? That's fine and dandy, but I can just use Aux sends to share a reverb.
Almost all processing on a backing vocal and a lead vocal are completely different for me. I guess on second thought and because a lot of other people have agreed with your method, I'll have to admit that it must be considered a valid way of working by some. So you're not a nutter after all. However, I wouldn't in a million years do it that way. Lead vocal(s) in one submix, backing vocals in another.
Greg
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- KVRAF
- 25047 posts since 12 Jul, 2003 from West Caprazumia
I think and work the same way as you, Greg! (well except a choir is what I'm atepmting to achieve)
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- KVRAF
- 6740 posts since 25 Mar, 2002 from sheffield, england
Thing is Greg, you can have a group for BV's which still feeds into a further Vox group along with the lead vocals.. if thats what you want.
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- KVRAF
- Topic Starter
- 6490 posts since 14 Jun, 2004 from Rochester, NY
oh of course. i mean sure you would definately want mutli subgroups, i was just saying if there was 1 lead and 1 bgv, and setting a volume level for both as in working down on the final mix.
RonC
RonC
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- KVRAF
- 12977 posts since 29 Sep, 2003 from Ottawa, Canada
Sure, I understand that it's 'possible', I just don't see it as useful for me. There's nothing I would do to a "all vocals" submix, so it's pointless for me to set one up.
I wouldn't set levels for all vocals at once, I wouldn't pan all at once, and I wouldn't use effects on all at once that couldn't be taken care of with sends. The lead and backing vocals have nothing to do with each other, so I'd never group them together.
Just one man's (well, 2 now!) opinion.
Greg
I wouldn't set levels for all vocals at once, I wouldn't pan all at once, and I wouldn't use effects on all at once that couldn't be taken care of with sends. The lead and backing vocals have nothing to do with each other, so I'd never group them together.
Just one man's (well, 2 now!) opinion.
Greg
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- KVRAF
- Topic Starter
- 6490 posts since 14 Jun, 2004 from Rochester, NY
dude. you do all of the pans and everything else before its routed out, dork.
BetaThuggz
RonC
BetaThuggz
RonC