* WARNING * - Do NOT install new iLok software!

[ObsoleteAcc99]

[DELETED]

[kritikon]

*sigh* I give up.

You may as well, mate. You're a lone voice. Pretty well everyone else is either pissed about the crash, or just detest a bad company (PACE) which has always been bad, or both. You may be right and everyone else wrong, but usually in those situations, well...


There is an obvious difference between a plugin company having issues with their own plugins and a company that hoses plugins from a wide variety of companies - potentially every plugin in somebody's computer. The first case, most people can accept that I.T. can be cranky. The 2nd means potentially you can't make any music with anything - the s/w is something none of us really want, doesn't protect the s/w companies (because iLok for ages has been easily cracked), obviously doesn't protect the customer, and basically we can't and shouldn't accept that it can be cranky. It's an extra step inbetween us and our s/w that makes life difficult for nobody except us and it should not be tolerated as screwing up our s/w. It should work from day one or not be released. We tolerate it only because other companies insist we can't buy their plugins without using iLok. There ARE s/w companies that actually manage to release plugins that work on almost every system from day one. Maybe PACE should have held off until they'd actually tested it properly before screwing up so many DAWs. They have no excuse. They did not test it properly. They f**ked up in exactly the same way they al,ways have. They're corporate twats, always have been and I for one will argue this to 768 pages if you insist...

I fail to see how you can think Crysonic are so bad, but a company like PACE with a far longer and deeper history of twattery are benign? They've DONE THIS BEFORE

[dalor]

If it comes to C/R: I RATHER ONLY LOSE 14 days to access my plugins than losing ANY plugins for GOOD!

ILok sucks but C/R is far worse!!

ILok will be fixed, it's just a matter of time!

[Compyfox]

You know what... I planned a longer post, because I'm so funking sick of debating this. But I scratched it.

This is the last time I will comment about all this. After that, I give a funk about what you think about me regarding this issue.



You won't change your mind, other people won't either.

You ignore that PACE pretty much fixed all problems by now. Problems that were due to a Server glitch, not the client software. Beta testing was over 10 month btw. And the servers seemed to work fine. So critism towards that direction is unadjusted. Unforseen problems can happen!


Actually, most of the users that spoke up (which seems to be a general minority - but they are alwas the loudest) since that jokingly tagged "Black Monday" (source: GearSlutz) could use their licenses after one week max already. The rest that are still having issues are rare individuals.

The Surrender License thing is also pretty much handled by now. PT11 came out on Friday, Sunday's not even over for the US yet and 85% of the users were back on track by Saturday evening already. That is also ignored.

And Steven Slate plans to release their VBC plugin collection on Monday. He wouldn't do that if he wouldn't be confident that everything is fixed now. Actually, Beta testers of VBC even mentioned at GearSlutz that they didn't have any iLok glitches.




PACE deserves my upmost respect for all the shit they're currently getting.

Whatever they pulled in the last years - it doesn't matter. Half of the issues were also user faults like too quick updates, shifting stuff in the middle of a project and also PC/MAC issues (some OS reliant, something these people can't do anything about).

Obviously the user base gives a brown type of goo about all this.




And one final time - don't compare my experience with CRYSONIC with what PACE is currently having as issues.

You don't seem to get it:
PACE never took my money and ran, PACE never asked for paid upates that didn't work in the end (no demos available!). PACE also never called me, threatened me on the phone that I was being "destructive in public towards their company" because I posted at KVR after the sh*t they pulled (think about what you folks are doing currently!), and they also didn't insult me in public while saying "it's all cool now - here's some free sh*t for you!".

They damaged their reputation themselves - a lot of people still fall for it as well. I tried to give them the benefit of doubt with their last metering tool - and what did the KVR users do?! "You're having a vendetta, you didn't try a demo (as there was none) - STFU Compyfox!"


So which reality is jaded?!




I certainly have better things to do than to constantly repeat myself.

Here to hoping that the constant spamming in threads with dev's that use PACE stops. But I know better that this won't be the case. After the last two weeks, I actually expect more derailing.



With that said - have a nice remaining weekend/Sunday night.
The debate is over for me.

[trimph1]

[Beatworld]

In contrast there's Bias for example who publicly went out of business a year ago and have still kept their update and response server open to this day.

Not a biggie but, for the sake of completeness...

I purchased Toast Titanium Pro 11 about 4 weeks ago.
Part of the bundle is Bias Sound Soap 2 SE for Toast.

It will not and does not authorise.

Roxio support admit as much when put under pressure.

I've thrashed out the issue with Roxio support.
To be offering Sound Soap is misleading advertising and I've told them that VERY clearly but seem to not give a toss.

I've still got Bias Peak 6.2 and it still works.

[Dominus]

If it comes to C/R: I RATHER ONLY LOSE 14 days to access my plugins than losing ANY plugins for GOOD!

ILok sucks but C/R is far worse!!

ILok will be fixed, it's just a matter of time!

I'd rather lose one company's plugins for good than a whole slew for an unknown period of time. You can always replace one company's plugins. It'd be difficult to be locked out of your DAW and lose access to half of your plugins for no reason. I can only think of one plugin that I have that I really would have a hard time replacing, and it's C/R. If they went away, I can come close to that one with hardware and freeware actually.

[sqigls]

...The debate is over for me.

Thank you. Was gonna say just book a room and and get over it, maybe a job interview. I just had 2 licenses revert to DEMO 2 days ago and PACE is just sending me automated response letters. They refuse to guarantee the safety of my license, and it is a second hand license so I can't get support from the dev (already written to)... Meanwhile I have a new Sonnox license ready to go, but can't sync to collect it as that will wipe 2 license worth 2 or 3 times as much as the Sonnox license, and again PACE wont guarantee the licenses will not permanently revert to DEMO!!!

That is shit dude, how the fudge can you applaude a company that does this? I am a legit software user and THIS IS THE TREATMENT I GET.

[koolkeys]

*sigh* I give up.

You may as well, mate. You're a lone voice. Pretty well everyone else is either pissed about the crash, or just detest a bad company (PACE) which has always been bad, or both. You may be right and everyone else wrong, but usually in those situations, well...

Well, of course you must realize that he's not alone, right? And he has the right to voice his opinion, which I know you know(even if he was alone, though he's not). The vocal minority will ALWAYS make themselves heard on web forums more than anyone else. Every time.

I don't think anyone is saying that this situation doesn't suck. But I think you and others are forgetting that this likely didn't even affect the majority of users, despite the infuriating posts in forums everywhere. No busy studio owner that I know would ever sync licenses or update licenses in the middle of work, but that fact aside, it's always helpful to keep some perspective.

I think PACE will survive, and I think people will continue to use it, both developers and end users. People who buy their software because of the software itself and not copy protection, they'll get past this, regardless of how horrible or pathetic the situation is.

And nobody is going to lose any of their licenses permanently. C'mon, does anyone REALLY believe that PACE is going to leave them high and dry in the end? A company that has been around for nearly 30 years, and that is relied on my dozens of other companies and tens of thousands(maybe hundreds of thousands?) of users in high level professional fields? Can you imagine what would happen if they just decided to say "screw you" and leave you without a license?

I'm not saying you should be happy with the current situation. I'm only saying that a little perspective is needed. I think they messed up royally, and it definitely isn't going to help them make their case to developers and users. But it's temporary, and not something that will likely leave anyone without their paid-for goods in the end.

Brent

[masterhiggins]

That is shit dude, how the fudge can you applaude a company that does this? I am a legit software user and THIS IS THE TREATMENT I GET.

I agree. I don't even use PACE software anymore, but it's still outrageous to hear this happened. I will NEVER, EVER use PACE-protected products anymore. I'm so happy PSP went to downloadable authorizers. If they ever went back to iLok I would drop them in a heartbeat.

-Sam

[Dominus]

And nobody is going to lose any of their licenses permanently. C'mon, does anyone REALLY believe that PACE is going to leave them high and dry in the end? A company that has been around for nearly 30 years, and that is relied on my dozens of other companies and tens of thousands(maybe hundreds of thousands?) of users in high level professional fields? Can you imagine what would happen if they just decided to say "screw you" and leave you without a license?

I'll just repeat myself:

A server crash shouldn't wipe your iLok clean. That should NEVER F___ING HAPPEN.

Can't try a new demo? Okay.
Can't transfer a license? Okay.
Can't install a new plugin/update? Okay.
Can't update the iLok driver? Okay.
Remove all the licenses from the iLok? Not okay.

[koolkeys]

And nobody is going to lose any of their licenses permanently. C'mon, does anyone REALLY believe that PACE is going to leave them high and dry in the end? A company that has been around for nearly 30 years, and that is relied on my dozens of other companies and tens of thousands(maybe hundreds of thousands?) of users in high level professional fields? Can you imagine what would happen if they just decided to say "screw you" and leave you without a license?

I'll just repeat myself:

A server crash shouldn't wipe your iLok clean. That should NEVER F___ING HAPPEN.

Can't try a new demo? Okay.
Can't transfer a license? Okay.
Can't install a new plugin/update? Okay.
Can't update the iLok driver? Okay.
Remove all the licenses from the iLok? Not okay.

You can repeat yourself 100 times if you want, but it doesn't change what I said.

No, it should never happen. I never said it was an acceptable mistake. I just said that there is likely zero chance that PACE leaves people without their licenses in the end.

By the way, do you know anyone who LOST all of their licenses? As in, "Remove all the licenses from the iLok"? Only specific license types were affected, and many people had no issues at all. And the licenses weren't removed, they were changed in status to "temporary" or demo status. And for the vast majority, the problems have been solved.

Again, it is NOT an acceptable mistake. It's one that customers should absolutely be frustrated with and even vocally upset about. It's one that they need to have a fire under them to fix, and customers have every right and reason to light that fire. But it's not a permanent loss, and in most if not all cases, it's not as extreme as what you said.

I don't really have anything else to say, nor do I have any desire to really go back and forth, so do with my post as you wish. Just giving some perspective, though I realize that many people have no interest in seeing another perspective. That's fine with me, no harm done.

Brent

[dalor]

I just said that there is likely zero chance that PACE leaves people without their licenses in the end.

+1! And that's exactly the reason I prefer PACE than a small one-man-company who decides to use C/R. The only reason I accept C/R from NI or Spectrasonics is they have been around for 10+ years.

[Dominus]

I'll just repeat myself:

A server crash shouldn't wipe your iLok clean. That should NEVER F___ING HAPPEN.

Can't try a new demo? Okay.
Can't transfer a license? Okay.
Can't install a new plugin/update? Okay.
Can't update the iLok driver? Okay.
Remove all the licenses from the iLok? Not okay.

You can repeat yourself 100 times if you want, but it doesn't change what I said.

No, it should never happen. I never said it was an acceptable mistake. I just said that there is likely zero chance that PACE leaves people without their licenses in the end.

By the way, do you know anyone who LOST all of their licenses? As in, "Remove all the licenses from the iLok"? Only specific license types were affected, and many people had no issues at all. And the licenses weren't removed, they were changed in status to "temporary" or demo status. And for the vast majority, the problems have been solved.

Again, it is NOT an acceptable mistake. It's one that customers should absolutely be frustrated with and even vocally upset about. It's one that they need to have a fire under them to fix, and customers have every right and reason to light that fire. But it's not a permanent loss, and in most if not all cases, it's not as extreme as what you said.

I don't really have anything else to say, nor do I have any desire to really go back and forth, so do with my post as you wish. Just giving some perspective, though I realize that many people have no interest in seeing another perspective. That's fine with me, no harm done.

Do I know anyone personally? No, thankfully I warned my clients ahead of time before they upgraded. They'll get to wait it out for a little while before upgrading to PT 11, but they will hopefully not have any problems.

Can you find anyone that did lose all their licenses?

You can probably find about 100 or so:

http://www.gearslutz.com/board/music-co ... tware.html

http://duc.avid.com/showthread.php?t=340188

(They didn't "lose their licenses permanently", they just lost the ability to use their ilok'd software for up to two weeks, so if you're arguing semantics here, that's lame.)

To me it shows a fatal flaw in Pace's system. Just because you weren't personally affected doesn't mean that this is just a minor glitch. There were a few studios that were put out of paying gigs for the last two weeks through no fault of their own, and the line of bullshit about not touching anything when you have projects to work on is just that. Bullshit. A client can ask you about a certain plugin, you can go and demo it, and BAM. No Pro Tools after that, and no way to bring it back. I can bet that scenario is more likely than anything.

[dalor]

Dominus, no one is arguing (for the 10.000 time) what PACE did is acceptable. Far from it! But don't use this incident to pro advocate a stupid copy protection like iLok to a much worse, which is C/R! If anything, this should be a lesson to move away from both of it and go back to basics, just like U-HE does.