The emotions behind chord choices

[tee boy]

Also I think its worth mention that the harmony and the progression are not the only factors. Dynamics, register, juxtaposition (ie, did something contrasting come before or after), rhythm, articulation etc all play HUGE parts.

Check out this small mp3 sample of Liszt's Transcendental Etude No7. I incorporates each of the above to add immense weight to these dissonant chords.

http://download.yousendit.com/16A4B5CE750BE525

This may not be everyones favorite type of music, but Im sure you'll be able note the power that Liszt gives to these chords using devices way outside of the harmony itself. The same chord could be used in a TOTALLY different context.

TB

[nyquil_man]

The greater the dissonance, higher the tension and therefore greater resolution required. Its science really. How you impliment it is the art!

Notice the popularity of the diminished chord in the 19th century. The diminished seven is essentially four potential leading tones; it can lead to any of them logically. A diminished chord built on F, G-sharp, B, and D could resolve to F-sharp Major, A Major, C Major, or E-flat Major or to any of their relative minors.

That's what gives it such power; in itself, it's a weak, ambiguous chord. But it's in a position to go anywhere and do anything. Pile on a series of diminished chords one after another and the ambiguity increases.

[rounser]

Raven's Guide to Music Theory has an appendix full of cadences. He says that it's the sound of one chord leading to another that defines the emotion, which is called a cadence, not really the chord itself.

Does that help send this thread on the right track? That "blind leading the blind" comment is spot on (and I don't count myself an exception).

[nyquil_man]

Also I think its worth mention that the harmony and the progression are not the only factors. Dynamics, register, juxtaposition (ie, did something contrasting come before or after), rhythm, articulation etc all play HUGE parts.

Tone color is very important in creating a mood as well. If you've ever heard a high school marching band playing "Smells Like Teen Spirit," you'll understand.

[tee boy]

Raven's Guide to Music Theory has an appendix full of cadences. He says that it's the sound of one chord leading to another that defines the emotion, which is called a cadence, not the chord itself.

Absolutely. A 'Ger6, ic, V7c, i' cadence has a very different sound to a 'Ger6, i' cadence for example. How the chords relate to one another is whats important. Hence why chromatic medient, tritone etc relation progressions become so popular in the more dissonant music of the C20th.

I mean, 'i, #iii' gives the minor chord a WAY different sound to say 'ii, V'. This has nothing to do with the chords themselves, but rather the difference in sound of the 5th root movement to the chromatic mediant.

TB

[rounser]

Tone color

I think it's proper name is timbre.

[tee boy]

Also I think its worth mention that the harmony and the progression are not the only factors. Dynamics, register, juxtaposition (ie, did something contrasting come before or after), rhythm, articulation etc all play HUGE parts.

Tone color is very important in creating a mood as well. If you've ever heard a high school marching band playing "Smells Like Teen Spirit," you'll understand.

Totally.

But then we get into another area dont we - unique associations that we have with certain chords, progressions and arrangements.

For instance, when I hear a marching band I think of something VERY different to when I heard a trashy garage style rock arrangement. And thats without considering the actual music they're going to play!

Its like when a hip hop artist quotes Bach, but it still sounds like a hip hop record!

TB

[tee boy]

Tone color

I think it's proper name is timbre.

Well I guess in that context its more a matter of texture I think.

[nyquil_man]

Tone color

I think it's proper name is timbre.

Timbre is the proper term, yes. But no one has ever accused me of propriety and I'd rather they didn't start now.

[bobtheburninator]

Many attempts have been made to associate harmonic progressions and melodic figures with certain moods. Some are even considered classics, like this one by Deryck Cook.

I have read many, and they all fall short by a mile.

For instance, the OP's opinion that "We all know the basic stuff like major conveys optimism and minor conveys moodiness"
is, I believe, quite far from being universal.

I just got done with a piece which is clearly and entirely in C major, and almost everyone who heard it called it 'sad' or 'melancholy', with a few 'uplifting' or 'relaxing and hypnotic' comments thrown in just to confuse the matter a bit more.

Personally, I think such things are quite personal and based on musical education and background, and all sorts of other formative experiences such as movies and even advertisements.

well, keep in mind, if you wrote it in c major, it could have ended up in a minor, possibly.

[rounser]

Well I guess in that context its more a matter of texture I think.

I thought that's exactly what timbre encompasses. An electric guitar has a different timbre to a trumpet, just as it does if you take off the distortion and listen to it "acoustically".

Or are we talking about musicianship, and if you put a better musician behind the trumpet you'd end up with appropriate "tone colour"? In any case, hair splitting has ensued, and it's my fault, so I'll abandon this tangent.

[bobtheburninator]

D minor...is the saddest of all keys, I find.

hahaha, 11

[Chuck E. Jesus]

The greater the dissonance, higher the tension and therefore greater resolution required. Its science really. How you impliment it is the art!

Notice the popularity of the diminished chord in the 19th century. The diminished seven is essentially four potential leading tones; it can lead to any of them logically. A diminished chord built on F, G-sharp, B, and D could resolve to F-sharp Major, A Major, C Major, or E-flat Major or to any of their relative minors.

That's what gives it such power; in itself, it's a weak, ambiguous chord. But it's in a position to go anywhere and do anything. Pile on a series of diminished chords one after another and the ambiguity increases.
Notice the popularity of the diminished chord in the 19th century. The diminished seven is essentially four potential leading tones; it can lead to any of them logically. A diminished chord built on F, G-sharp, B, and D could resolve to F-sharp Major, A Major, C Major, or E-flat Major or to any of their relative minors.

That's what gives it such power; in itself, it's a weak, ambiguous chord. But it's in a position to go anywhere and do anything. Pile on a series of diminished chords one after another and the ambiguity increases.

now this is the kind of stuff i could use more of at KVR....

more talk of diminshed chords please...i grew up playing barre chords and as a middle aged person i'm just learning chord progressions and such...it's fun to learn this stuff...

[tee boy]

Well I guess in that context its more a matter of texture I think.

I thought that's exactly what timbre encompasses. An electric guitar has a different timbre to a trumpet, just as it does if you take off the distortion and listen to it "acoustically".

Or are we talking about musicianship, and if you put a better musician behind the trumpet you'd end up with appropriate "tone colour"? In any case, hair splitting has ensued, and it's my fault, so I'll abandon this tangent.

No, no, not trying to be argumentative.

Its just that they are pretty vague terms arent they, and I often find there to be a grey area in the middle! But I think if we're talking about the differences that orchestration bring to a piece, we have moved towards an issue of texture.

I tend to to timbre more in context with the sound of individual instruments, notes and articulations (but like I say, I vague on these terms!).

TB

[mistertoast]

11,

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CdMHpy6bgLM