Chord progressions and song structure

[vurt]

yeah, this ain't the army or some shit
I remember on Battlestar Galactica they were calling Starbucks or whatever her name is sir all the time.

working with the homeless, i spent a lot of time with ex cons, they called me "boss" all the time, prison slang for the screws dammit
it was more of a fun thing though, i certainly wasnt anything like a prison officer...
but, it got me in to the habit, of calling everyone "boss" in conversation, to the point i ioften get asked if ive been inside
no i have not! id never survive!

[jancivil]

Well, there's a fair bit of music that goes back and forth with the relatives or even has ambiguities, but please do not sing La for minor Do.
I remember when I first heard of that, hard for me to feature that logic, unless it really is not clear and the minor is vanilla natural. There should be two more syllables for minor, reflecting the sharp-ing.

For that matter, if you perceive a two chord vamp in modal usage slowly enough, you can say here are two modes. Let's take a Mixo vamp, our two chords are D and C. It's Mixo on D but Lydian on C, and it can have a very strong feeling of Lydian (and some people will insist on it).

[TribeOfHǫfuð]

I don't do the do-re-mi either. Never did. That was theory, or like being occupied with the letters in a exciting novel. He, he. There is nothing like passing composer exams ignoring most of what you have learned. KISS: Keep it simple, stupid. Reduction rules in practise. Sometimes ignorance is really bliss, if the ignored is unecessary to pay attention to.

[jancivil]

No, I'm simply saying don't sing the wrong syllable. 1 = Do. End of story. I don't understand the logic of not allowing minor key to have a f**king tonic.

We sang every morning, we sang all kinds of things, we sang from neumes even. When I transferred, sight singing was if anything more important, to Beulah Forbes it was. I wasn't even sick of it, but I did not need to be in that class having completed the regimen TWICE, but they wouldn't hear of letting me alone.

[TribeOfHǫfuð]

Till now, you have my full support, as far as I get you. Also in the alternative DO case, the survival of the fittest rules in practise to me: if it doesn't make sense, it ain't usable. To each, his own. Use it those who can.

[shawshawraw]

Personally, relearning a minor scale as 1 2 b3 4 5 b6 7 from 6 7 1 2 3 4 #5 has been a mind-opener for me (ps. use correct syllable, 3 = Mi and b3 = May). But finally, I agree with you, to each, his/her own. Everybody has to think a little differently to make unique music

[jancivil]

There is no alterative Do. The fact there ought to be (there is, unless there's a basic deficiency of pedagogy) two syllables that cannot be said to have diatonic meaning in the 'relative major' demonstrates the difference beyond a doubt.
Also otherwise, the argument is 3 is 1 for purposes of argument. Which appears problematic.

Major as primary is ahistorical. One may say 'Oh, but Dorian is the second mode of major!' but 'major' is logically the seventh mode of Dorian by the same token unless the former is in fact residing in some form of governance over everything. There is no actual reason this would be the case.

[jancivil]

I just read this "This system of solfege is called movable do with do-based minor. There are also versions of solfege where Do is always C (fixed do), and another movable do that starts minor keys on la (to match relative keys rather than parallel ones)." because I became confused by the very term 'movable'. Apparently sometimes movable is in fact movable.
Sorry, I'm not clever enough to keep up with all that, the Keep It Simple, Stupid answer is it for me

[shawshawraw]

The fixed do is a common thing with piano players as far as I know... teachers as well. Been using this for years until finding it consuming too much brain power for analysis.

[jancivil]

In school I have no recollection at all of sight singing very chromatic music. So we sang 'Si' for ^7 or "12", which is the fixed do syllable for #5. I guess we'da had to go with Ti, a drink with jam and bread.

actually there are reasons I soon gravitated to thinking of my own thing in Indian solfege, Sarigama, where you'd have to say Sa is fixed ('key' isn't a thing).
Syllablization is invaluable to me as someone reliant on relative pitch. If I have a melodic idea away from any instrument (happens to me all the time), I write down syllables, it doesn't matter which of 12 is '1'.
I can tell certain things by sound such as 'I hear its B on the fifth string' but for the most part the absolute pitch is a guess.

[TribeOfHǫfuð]

I just read this "This system of solfege is called movable do with do-based minor.

Did it say what it is supposed to be good for?

[jancivil]

"(to match relative keys rather than parallel ones)"
like it's a good thing

A minor is not C major, et al. Ever, or the term key is nothing at all

[TribeOfHǫfuð]

Chord by scale step is all tonal stuff with lots of modulations and where chord’s functions are ambigious relative to key and transpostion. In modal music, there is a root and an internal relation between the tones that can cary itself. Moves of root makes no sense because then you are not in the same mode if you stick to the tones already given by first root. A dorian mode is a dorian mode and nothing else as long you stick to the root. All harmonies within will seek the root, so no need to speak of other modes as inversions of the scale, moveable Dos or what else. That we eventually called some of these passing harmonies/mediators to the root for dominant and subdominant became important in music with more root movements and modualtions e.g. modern chord progressions.

[TribeOfHǫfuð]

Double bubble

[jancivil]

Fun and/or boring factoid: I have never had the thought 'mediant harmony' or the term 'mediant' in music speak occur to me personally.