The "Zebra2 plays Virus" challenge

[Shy]

I just found out that the brightness of the LEDs can be adjusted in the Virus. I actually took the 61-keys version because the guys at the shop said I couldn't dim the extremely bright LEDs of the Polar.

Off topic but:

Recently I played a gig and there was a nice new Virus Polar TI about 5 feet away from my face onstage near the DJ mixer. The stage lighting was subdued but not dark.

Before I started playing, I had to ask some guys to move it away as I was completely dazzled and couldn't even see my backlit laptop screen properly!

Alright if you need a suntan...


bagginz

I hate it when that happens. At least on the Virus it can be adjusted, but my M-Audio firewire interface has a ridiculously bright blue led that can light a big room. I have no other choice but to cover it with something or point its front in a different direction. But I can also use it for great sci fi movie blue light effect.

[Sascha Franck]

Sorry for the OT stuff, but...

I hate it when that happens. At least on the Virus it can be adjusted, but my M-Audio firewire interface has a ridiculously bright blue led that can light a big room.

I have a FW410 as well, and those LEDs are ridiculous. It's even more ridiculous when the computer is switched off (still sending some power to the interface) because in that case the LED is even flashing. I covered all the LEDs with tape as well. What an exceptionally bad design.

[pschelfh]

http://www.mediafire.com/?cmft1wmawot

That's pretty close to the original. The original has a bit less "excitement" during the phaser stage...

I probably just opened up the filters a bit too much. I was thoroughly sick of the arp by then

fwiw, I don't think he used anything other than, perhaps, an exciter on the piece. It's just too busy for a compressor to do much good - unless he recorded it completely dry and then added delay and verb afterwards (which I doubt). As I said earlier, the virus has very distinctive percussive envelopes (particularly the decay). I have a hazy memory of it having a built-in limiter, but that might be a TI only feature. And speaking of which, while you're analysing your shiny new TI take a good look at the way portamento is implemented. I'm fairly sure that this also plays a role in the original.

The problem is that I can't find the Virus Arp mp3 nowhere in Manuel Schleis' presets. The patch 'Exciter MS' comes close but it misses the energy of the mp3.

Maybe Urs can post an example of the arp with this preset ?

Peter.

I give up, if even the Virus can't sound like a Virus.

[Urs]

Maybe Urs can post an example of the arp with this preset ?

I hope so, yes. I've preliminarily wired the Virus via S/PDIF into the daw for now (havn't installed any software, yet)...

But I'm currently buried deeply into testing yet another new idea for an economic sawtooth osc that can be used for massive SuperSaw arrays...

Will find time later, for sure!

[shogger]

Sorry, Grrrl, a friend and me got caught up in pasta & red wine.

*burp*

What?

That's unacceptable ...













... that you excuse yourself for having a real life besides your job!

Shogger

[pschelfh]

Maybe Urs can post an example of the arp with this preset ?

I hope so, yes. I've preliminarily wired the Virus via S/PDIF into the daw for now (havn't installed any software, yet)...

But I'm currently buried deeply into testing yet another new idea for an economic sawtooth osc that can be used for massive SuperSaw arrays...

Will find time later, for sure!

Nevermind Urs, I'll try to post it tonight. Keep working on Zebra !

Peter.

[Urs]

Hey, what about these:

http://www.u-he.com/music/ZVSV2.mp3

http://www.u-he.com/music/ZVSV3.mp3

And yes, at least one of these is the original Virus patch played on a real Virus. No post processing, no external delay/reverb, not even a limiter (each clipped a bit towards the end or so). I suspect that the infamous mp3 was created with not just the ModWheel/Assignable controls tweaked, but that the Cutoff was furtherly automated. Might give that a try later.

Enjoy,

Urs

P.S.: I'm still not a good patch designer tho, but maybe someone wants to give it a try?

[djsubject]

i like ZVSV3 best

both are good,

i take it one of these are the new Super Duper SAW in Z2?

Subz

[Shy]

v3 is the virus, and sounds much better.

[Urs]

i take it one of these are the new Super Duper SAW in Z2?

Nah, not yet... just needed a little break... took me a couple minutes to copy the sound and then record/bounce/upload. Done that with headphones again, so I had to adjust some stuff afterwards... again...

Funnily I did it one octave lower (I'm a bass fanatic...) first, where both were much closer. The Virus seems to automatically have some KeyFollow on filters. They open up a bit in the higher octaves even when it's set to 0 (yes, for both filters). That was a bit awful to figure out.

I also found another patch which sounds a bit closer to the original mp3, but it doesn't feature the noise part and the phaser is more subtle...

Urs

[pschelfh]

Listening on my laptop now, so I can't really judge.

They're very close, but I like the phaser a bit more on the first one + the second could use some more delay in the mix to match the first clip.

Peter.

[Urs]

v3 is the virus, and sounds much better.

Uhm, actually, V3 is this Zebra2 preset:

http://www.u-he.com/music/InfamousArpZ2.h2p (right-click & save as)



I still prefer V2 though. It's a bit rounder and less harsh to my ears. I think I've overdone the EQ in Z2 and I havn't found the right means to emulate the FilterFM-style buzz during fast sweeps on Virus filters. Instead I've put a bit of envelope on Osc detune.

Also, the Phaser is mono in Z2 because I just used an allpass filter.

I'm sure one can use this patch as a starting point...

Btw:

ModWheel -> Filter Cutoff
X1 -> Noise Volume (goes up a bit with the filter sweep and down later)
Y1 -> Phaser

Enjoy,

Urs

[beej]

Hey, what about these:
http://www.u-he.com/music/ZVSV2.mp3
http://www.u-he.com/music/ZVSV3.mp3

Assuming Urs isn't pulling out leg with clips from his Virus A and Virus TI

While V3 is in many ways "bigger", it sounds more like I would expect from Zebra. V2 has a character that I associate more with the Virus (albeit I have limited practical time on one). It's chunkier in the mids, and the phasey stuff just has a character that I like.

So my guess would be:
V2 = Virus
V3 = Software (probably Zebra)

I will reiterate that it's not that I feel that the Virus is *better* than anything else, it just has a sonic signature that is quite pleasing, coupled with good preset design. Where that sonic signature comes from I don't know - it might be a combination of lots of things - the filter code, the D/A convertors, some DSP on the master outs, whatever. And it's that sonic signature that isn't replicated 1:1 with a software synth yet.

I'm really interested in Urs' findings on this. I would imagine that if you stripped everything of a TI and went down to the core oscillators, it would probably be fairly ordinary. But the filters, when I have played with them, are pretty nice to my ears.

[Shy]

Well done on making Virus sound crappy in comparison, Urs.

[pschelfh]

Hey, what about these:
http://www.u-he.com/music/ZVSV2.mp3
http://www.u-he.com/music/ZVSV3.mp3

Assuming Urs isn't pulling out leg with clips from his Virus A and Virus TI

While V3 is in many ways "bigger", it sounds more like I would expect from Zebra. V2 has a character that I associate more with the Virus (albeit I have limited practical time on one). It's chunkier in the mids, and the phasey stuff just has a character that I like.

So my guess would be:
V2 = Virus
V3 = Software (probably Zebra)

I will reiterate that it's not that I feel that the Virus is *better* that anything else, it just has a sonic signature that is quite pleasing, coupled with good preset design. Where that sonic signature comes from I don't know - it might be a combination of lots of things - the filter code, the D/A convertors, some DSP on the master outs, whatever. And it's that sonic signature that isn't replicated 1:1 with a software synth yet.

I'm really interested in Urs' findings on this. I would imagine that if you stripped everything of a TI and went down to the core oscillators, it would probably be fairly ordinary. But the filters, when I have played with them, are pretty nice to my ears.

I think the Virus phaser is also worth some investigation, it sounds really good to me. I think it also has something to do with the fact that you can select the 'stages', while in Zebra2 it's fixed. Dunno how many stages Zebra2 phaser uses but that preset from the Virus uses 4 stages in the phaser, which makes the effect more pronounced.

Peter.