The "Zebra2 plays Virus" challenge

[suthnear]

What I found notable is the VCA Attack time. It's above "Punch" level.

All punch on the virus really does is add a bit of a click to the attack - it's not like the punch you get from a minimoog, say.

Out of curiousity, what values are the filter and vca envelope decays set to? How many unison voices is it using?

[Urs]

I think one comes closer to the original mp3 if one tweaks filter offset from -63 to +63 while doing the filter sweep with the ModWheel. In the Virus of course.

Yet, the "pressure" won't really show up...

[pschelfh]

I think Manuel was also tweaking some knobs on that mp3. Eg. the filter cutoff starts much lower on the mp3 than on that Virus 'Exciter' preset.

Agreed! Wanna give it a try then?

What I found notable is the VCA Attack time. It's above "Punch" level. I'm gonna try a compressor on this...

Urs

OK, downloaded your preset and will try some automation tonight (I'm not that much of a live tweaker though).

I think I found 2 suspects for manual tweaking :

1. Obviously filter cutoff
2. The decay from the filter envelope seems to increase as the filter opens. Could be also that it has less effect on the sound because the filter is almost fully open.

Peter.

[pschelfh]

What I found notable is the VCA Attack time. It's above "Punch" level.

All punch on the virus really does is add a bit of a click to the attack - it's not like the punch you get from a minimoog, say.

Out of curiousity, what values are the filter and vca envelope decays set to? How many unison voices is it using?

Virus filter routing for this preset is :

LPF12 (Cutoff 30%) -> Saturation -> LPF12 (Cutoff 60%). Only the first filter is modulated.
Filter env decay is very short, VCA decay is a bit longer.
From memory I think it's using 3 unison voices.

Peter.

[suthnear]

2. The decay from the filter envelope seems to increase as the filter opens. Could be also that it has less effect on the sound because the filter is almost fully open.

Yeah - filter envelope modulation is additive for positive depths of envelope send. So the more the filter opens, the less effect the filter envelope will have on the sound...

[spaceman]

Virus filter routing for this preset is :

LPF12 (Cutoff 30%) -> Saturation -> LPF12 (Cutoff 60%). Only the first filter is modulated.
Filter env decay is very short, VCA decay is a bit longer.
From memory I think it's using 3 unison voices.

2. The decay from the filter envelope seems to increase as the filter opens. Could be also that it has less effect on the sound because the filter is almost fully open.

Yeah - filter envelope modulation is additive for positive depths of envelope send. So the more the filter opens, the less effect the filter envelope will have on the sound...

cool.. I'm going to put that in my ES2 patch. I think the ES2 is capable of getting really close to the Virus. I just couldn't be bothered tweaking till kingdom come

could someone post more details about the original preset?

[Sascha Franck]

could someone post more details about the original preset?

That'd at least be interesting. So far, I don't even know how many OSCs were used and what their tuning was like (or has this information been posted?). At a rough guess I'd say two "main" OSCs with a certain amount of detune (using whatever saw-waveform there is) and an additional OSC an octave down, more or less slightly mixed in. And oh well, Urs already mentioned the noise.

FFS, what am I doing in this thread?

[Kyran]

Too bad Urs posted the solution so quickly. Maybe he can make our day and play another arp on both the Virus and the Zebra for comparison ?

That's been done before... the problem is, too many people want to hear that certain sound. The only point to make was, even the Virus itself can't produce that sound.

Will see what I can do though... when there's a bit more time.

And you bought a TI to make that point (I suppose everyone needs an excuse to buy a new toy)
Not that I'm complaining, can't wait to see what you come up with after examining it. (I loved those moog little fatty audio demos you did)

[pschelfh]

could someone post more details about the original preset?

That'd at least be interesting. So far, I don't even know how many OSCs were used and what their tuning was like (or has this information been posted?). At a rough guess I'd say two "main" OSCs with a certain amount of detune (using whatever saw-waveform there is) and an additional OSC an octave down, more or less slightly mixed in. And oh well, Urs already mentioned the noise.

FFS, what am I doing in this thread?

4 OSC's : 1 standard pitch + 2 heavily detuned in the same octave as the first OSC + 1 Noise OSC.

Peter.

[Urs]

And you bought a TI to make that point (I suppose everyone needs an excuse to buy a new toy)

True

Seriously, I don't get many requests for analogue filters anymore. The XMF seems to nail this category quite well.

However, there are dozens of requests for stuff like more SuperSaw, some "Virus TI formant type" oscillators etc. So, if the TI can be assumed reference class, it'll also cater as that - a reference. Also, people say that the Virus as a huge "sweet spot". One can't go wrong just by tweaking the knobs. So if I ever wanted to create a simpler va-style synth (apart from the Filterscape concept), it probably has to be a sweet spot monster.

Last but not least, I think one of the major downers of the Virus A for me was that it hadn't had a keyboard. I need to play while tweak, but I never had a comfortable setup to do so. Plus, the TI obviously has a way better user interface. Once you know the shift key and the menus, stepping through stuff isn't that bad anymore...

Later,

Urs

[hifiboom]

there is no special virus signature sound.

what people just seem to love is the hypersaw.
no more or less.

So playing few notes ends up in having a complete mix and so there is just need to paste that musicmaker loop to finish the master.

[pschelfh]

I think one comes closer to the original mp3 if one tweaks filter offset from -63 to +63 while doing the filter sweep with the ModWheel. In the Virus of course.

Yet, the "pressure" won't really show up...

Mmmh, that's actualy mixing between the 2 filters.

Can you do the same in Zebra with a ChannelMixer ?

Peter.

[Sascha Franck]

4 OSC's : 1 standard pitch + 2 heavily detuned in the same octave as the first OSC + 1 Noise OSC.

So, no octaved (down) OSC? Interesting.
Thanks.

[suthnear]

there is no special virus signature sound.
what people just seem to love is the hypersaw.

Totally disagree. Hypersaw is a TI-specific feature and the virus's reputation was in place long before the TI. This arp we've being going on about for pages doesn't even use hypersaw...

[suthnear]

Mmmh, that's actualy mixing between the 2 filters.
Can you do the same in Zebra with a ChannelMixer ?

Yeah. Check out the preset I included with my attempt - it roughly approximates the virus's architecture...