KVR Audio

bjporter · Post by **bjporter** » Fri Jun 03, 2016 7:21 pm

We're always going to get a few mean trolls. You deal with them by ignoring them, and moving on.

Examigan · Post by **Examigan** » Fri Jun 03, 2016 7:30 pm

bjporter wrote:
z.prime wrote:
bjporter wrote:Really don't like that idea to be honest. Transparency should be encouraged. Ignore the trolls, and people who are negative. I feel like that is retreating.
It's not about hiding things, but rather about eliminating any perceived weighting in the votes due to it being a popularity contest. The OSC is sorta special that I think there isn't a lot of that in play... but take other bigger remix competitions and the like, these are very frequently just preexisting popularity contests rather than finding the best submission.
It's not a popularity contest, and never was. I've never heard of anyone voting on popularity.

It's not a popularity contest, but some people have many more followers than others on Soundcloud. If any of those same followers are here on KVR, my guess is that it could help increase the number of votes.

z.prime · Post by **z.prime** » Fri Jun 03, 2016 7:33 pm

bjporter wrote:It's not a popularity contest, and never was. I've never heard of anyone voting on popularity. [People] do well because you make great tracks. Great tracks float to the top, always.

No argument, just saying, I *do* think it would be something interesting to try. Don't get me wrong, I think the feedback is absolutely the best part of this competition, and that couldn't ever go away, just think that anonymous voting would be a very interesting thing to try and see the result of, is all.

bjporter · Post by **bjporter** » Fri Jun 03, 2016 7:34 pm

Examigan wrote: It's not a popularity contest, but some people have many more followers than others on Soundcloud. If any of those same followers are here on KVR, my guess is that it could help increase the number of votes.

That's never been an issue though. I've looked into it. Quite a few people came out of no where (Irion, and Jasinski) with massive tunes and did very well and I don't think anyone knew them.

Now, with contests like beatport, and others, that's a serious problem. The contests where whoever gets the most likes wins...

People consistently vote for good tracks. Everyone would be part of the plot if that wasn't the case. You can see it in the results. Soundcloud is also a very poor place to gain a following. You'd want to use facebook, local community, and twitter, and lots of networking, while using soundcloud as a player and repository for your audio. So it would be petty if people were voting like this

bjporter · Post by **bjporter** » Fri Jun 03, 2016 7:36 pm

z.prime wrote:
bjporter wrote:It's not a popularity contest, and never was. I've never heard of anyone voting on popularity. [People] do well because you make great tracks. Great tracks float to the top, always.
No argument, just saying, I *do* think it would be something interesting to try. Don't get me wrong, I think the feedback is absolutely the best part of this competition, and that couldn't ever go away, just think that anonymous voting would be a very interesting thing to try and see the result of, is all.

Me voting in anonymous system: ok, that was a Jasinski track, lots of crazy beats.

Ok that was Zprime... dubstep flare with deep house / trancy stuff, and big sound.

Ok, that's richard semper...

Photonic, check.

5 seconds in... that's irion

z.prime · Post by **z.prime** » Fri Jun 03, 2016 7:41 pm

bjporter wrote:... Ok that was Zprime... dubstep flare with deep house / trancy stuff, and big sound. ...

I might change it up so much next time (yes, already have with my NoiseFaker track - doing a totally new style!)

But yes, obviously some people have a sound you could pick out a lot of the time. STILL, I would like to see how it works on a small scale (and, more interestingly, how it would work on a large scale). I would like to see so much, that I'd code up a site to do it all just to see if it was a good idea or an awful idea.

z.prime · Post by **z.prime** » Fri Jun 03, 2016 7:43 pm

... I HAVE A DREAM TODAY! I have a dream that one day this nation will rise up and live out the true meaning of its creed: "We hold these tracks to be self-evident..."

z.prime · Post by **z.prime** » Fri Jun 03, 2016 7:45 pm

Ok. 'nuff of that. Back to the memes:

bjporter · Post by **bjporter** » Fri Jun 03, 2016 7:45 pm

z.prime wrote:
bjporter wrote:... Ok that was Zprime... dubstep flare with deep house / trancy stuff, and big sound. ...
I might change it up so much next time (yes, already have with my NoiseFaker track - doing a totally new style!) But yes, obviously some people have a sound you could pick out a lot of the time. STILL, I would like to see how it works on a small scale (and, more interestingly, how it would work on a large scale). I would like to see so much, that I'd code up a site to do it all just to see if it was a good idea or an awful idea.

Well just a few changes would be required for the current system to be anonymous. In fact we could do it next month. I just doubt most people would want that.

bjporter · Post by **bjporter** » Fri Jun 03, 2016 7:48 pm

We've been really awesome community, up until a troll comes in and ruins it. Last time it was Tony Ostinato. He wasn't ignored, and things got heated. We've got to deal with trolls. Don't let them get to your ego. It doesn't happen often though.

jasinski · Post by **jasinski** » Fri Jun 03, 2016 7:52 pm

I think that even with a blind vote the regulars could tell who is who... For the record I don't factor in the "who" when voting. I certainly don't believe anyone is getting down-voted as a personal attack.

A while back, I outlined the way I vote (a 5 point system) and recommend it others for consideration:

How to Win OSC

That said, a blind vote might be fun to see- just as an experiment.

z.prime · Post by **z.prime** » Fri Jun 03, 2016 8:02 pm

And also, if you're feeling adventurous, this post talks about some high quality investments in your gear.

wagtunes · Post by **wagtunes** » Fri Jun 03, 2016 8:03 pm

When I vote, I expect a certain quality from the names I know and oddly, they almost never let me down and get a 4 or 5 from me. And then there are some people, for whatever reason, I just don't get their style. It perplexes me. And subsequently, I always score them lower.

But when there's a name I don't know, I go into it with totally open ears and go with my gut and first impression.

Point is, yes, after I've gotten to know you after a while, especially if you've been doing this a long time, I do have preconceived expectations before I even click play. I don't think it's a stretch to suggest that most human beings have these same expectations from people we know.

That's why, when an established group comes out with a new recording, depending on how great their last one was (Boston is a perfect example) we tend to expect a lot from them. Boston's 2nd album did NOT get the same reception as their first. And rightfully so. It simply wasn't as good.

But if it was a brand new band making that same album, we would have gone nuts over it.

That is human nature and there is no getting around it if you're honest with yourself.

People expect my entries to be weird and pretty bad. And, for the most part, they are. And because of that, if I had Z ghost write my track one month, it might do better, but it wouldn't be nearly as high up in the voting as his own track. Because once people who know me see my name, that bias is going to kick in whether you want to admit it or not.

Of course if Z did do my track one month, nobody would believe I did it myself and would want to know who I hired to do it for me.

That is the reality of familiarity and expectations.

bjporter · Post by **bjporter** » Fri Jun 03, 2016 8:05 pm

z.prime · Post by **z.prime** » Fri Jun 03, 2016 8:19 pm

Very well said, Wag. A bit extreme, perhaps. But well said, nonetheless - almost exactly what my point is, nice job.

We expect certain things from people, to that end we also give them our time when we expect things that are good. The fact is, someone might make great tracks every time. But you'll give that person a lot of time to listen because you expect them to be good. Maybe they're not as good as you're expecting, and get voted down "that's not your best work". EVEN THOUGH, in all reality, this could still be the most amazing track of the competition. From experience, the best tracks really do end up on the top... but these preconceived notions we have affect us subconsciously. But ultimately for OSC, I think genre preference may end up affecting our voting the most notably, which anonymizing things wouldn't affect in the least.

One Synth Challenge #87: Podolski by U-he (Jasinski Wins!)