Audiothing Releases JUNE (Juno-60 Emulation)

[MTorn]

Considering that the Juno 60 wasn't velocity sensitive there is no "correct" way to implement velocity in any software emulation of it.

If you want the full Juno 60 experience in a plugin don't use velocity at all

Of course, that's why I put "correct" in quotes, it's down to personal opinion.

I think it's about finding the sweet spot between absolutely authenticity and modern convenience. Even the most hardcore emulations, which I believe are Softube's (they even insist on limiting polyphony to the original number), allow for velocity response. So once you've decided to enable velocity you have to decide which implementation is more useful.
It's seldom an all-or-nothing situation with emulations.

[MTorn]

Yes, we already got a few requests for that. It'll be probably add it as a global option to switch between cutoff/envelope. Personally, I still prefer the velocity to be assigned to Cutoff, but I understand it might be useful to assign it to the envelope.

Interesting, so I'm not alone then.
One problem with it being assigned directly to cutoff is that if you have a filter swept by the envelope, velocity also then effectively controls the length of the sweep. At low velocities, the cutoff goes below the audible threshold pretty early, making the note sound prematurely choked. Perhaps some people like that as a performance feature?

I'd be curious to hear why somebody would prefer direct assignment, rather than through the envelope depth. But we're getting into the territory of "feel", which is hard to put into words.

[audiothing]

I'd be curious to hear why somebody would prefer direct assignment, rather than through the envelope depth. But we're getting into the territory of "feel", which is hard to put into words.

A long time ago, I used to gig with a Novation XioSynth, which had a Velocity to Cutoff parameter I found very musical. Since I was often playing with both hands, being able to control the cutoff with velocity was very convenient, but I get your point. I'll add an option to pick the destination.

[Uncle E]

So.......those with the experience: How does it sound compared to a real Juno 60? Compared to TAL's Juno? etc? Where would you rank JUNO against all of the others?

Here's a free sample library you can use to compare:

https://ko-fi.com/s/4aa97f3276

[MTorn]

A long time ago, I used to gig with a Novation XioSynth, which had a Velocity to Cutoff parameter I found very musical. Since I was often playing with both hands, being able to control the cutoff with velocity was very convenient, but I get your point. I'll add an option to pick the destination.

Nice to know that people still know how to play keyboards, old school style.
In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if the vintage emulations in general attract proportionally more keyboard players than the modern complex plugins do.

[Uncle E]

If you went on Reverb/eBay right now and got 10 different Juno 106s all of them at this point would sound slightly different from the others

While the spirit of what you're saying is correct, Juno's are pretty consistent. Wild differences in the emulations means one is more accurate than the others.

[IvyBirds]

Considering that the Juno 60 wasn't velocity sensitive there is no "correct" way to implement velocity in any software emulation of it.

If you want the full Juno 60 experience in a plugin don't use velocity at all

Of course, that's why I put "correct" in quotes, it's down to personal opinion.

I think it's about finding the sweet spot between absolutely authenticity and modern convenience. Even the most hardcore emulations, which I believe are Softube's (they even insist on limiting polyphony to the original number), allow for velocity response. So once you've decided to enable velocity you have to decide which implementation is more useful.
It's seldom an all-or-nothing situation with emulations.

Absolutely so why call the TAL implementation correct and by default the Audiothing way not correct? Isn't it better to have multiple methodologies anyway?

Using two different end targets for velocity on two extremely similar Synths will allow for more expressive performance and different outcomes when played

Any plugin that can be controlled via MIDI CCs can also be set to whatever you want with velocity as you just change that in your controller or host on how it handles CCs and then set the plugin to respond to that CC however you want

[Funkybot's Evil Twin]

I've been really digging JUNE and I've got the others: Roland Cloud (and a System8), Model 84 (or whatever), Arturia, TAL. I didn't do a direct comparison though. Just enjoyed it, bought it, made some patches, etc.

My take on it: the JUNE filter is really nice sounding. Resonance sounds great. The overall synth has a nice heft, brightness, and punch that I don't think I'm always hearing in other emulations (again, without direct comparison so grain of salt). The extra envelope and other additions are very appreciated and well-implemented. The FX are nice. I do wish there was a more Lexi style reverb than a Spring, and the Delay was less noisy (Carlo - maybe a "Low Noise" preference for the delay), but I LOVE the convenience of having built-in FX.

It's probably been 25 years since I last played a Juno-60 so I won't bother to comment on the authenticity of it. But I dig it. I find it a lot more inspirational to play and make patches for than the others.

[IvyBirds]

If you went on Reverb/eBay right now and got 10 different Juno 106s all of them at this point would sound slightly different from the others

While the spirit of what you're saying is correct, Juno's are pretty consistent. Wild differences in the emulations means one is more accurate than the others.

But there isn't wild differences in the core sound of modern Juno Plugins. If you strip out all of the extras and just focus on what was in actual Juno 60 hardware you really won't see any wild differences.

You seem to think the TAL Juno 60 and the Audiothings Juno 60 sound wildly different from each other and that they will both sound wildly different from the Roland version. That's simply not true

The differences lie when you start to add features like extra envelopes, effects, and velocity settings that didn't exist in the original hardware but strip those out to the core sound they are all very similar

[Uncle E]

But there isn't wild differences in the core sound of modern Juno Plugins.

Agreed that June and U-NO-LX sound nearly identical to each other. Neither one sounds like the Juno samples I linked to earlier.

[IvyBirds]

But there isn't wild differences in the core sound of modern Juno Plugins.

Agreed that June and U-NO-LX sound nearly identical to each other. Neither one sounds like the Juno samples I linked to earlier.

Awesome and how were those samples made? What was the signal chain?

[Uncle E]

Awesome and how were those samples made? What was the signal chain?

Dunno. However, going by those, the sound examples on Soundpaint's site, and my own memory of the Juno-6 (yeah, yeah), neither of these has the character I personally am looking for. They're still both great synths and I agree wholeheartedly with your points about the extra features.

[IvyBirds]

Awesome and how were those samples made? What was the signal chain?

Dunno. However, going by those, the sound examples on Soundpaint's site, and my own memory of the Juno-6 (yeah, yeah), neither of these has the character I personally am looking for. They're still both great synths and I agree wholeheartedly with your points about the extra features.

So your example is a 16bit, 44.1 kHz, mono sample library that you have no idea how it was made or what the signal chain is. So you don't know if what you are hearing is the synth or the preamp, mixer, compressor, EQ, tape saturation etc and then after it was recorded you have no idea what the mastering process was for the samples if any

No offense but that is a rather ridiculous comparison

And awesome if they don't have the character you are looking for go ahead and drop a thousands of dollars on some 40 year old Vintage hardware that is on its last legs.

As for myself for $39 the June from Audiothing is awesome and gives me all the Juno experience I could ever want. But if only the real hardware will do it for you why don't you go buy the real hardware. If you do you will find it sounds amazingly close to the $39 plugin with less features

[pekbro]

Doh, I bought this accidentally, on purpose...

*Well, I wasn't actually planning on buying it, today anyway...

[Uncle E]

So your example is a 16bit, 44.1 kHz, mono sample library

That’s some selective reading you’ve done there!