Bass "Mono-izer" plugins

[MogwaiBoy]

The advantages NUGEN Monofilter gives you are basically... a really nice correlation-by-frequency meter and the option of linear phase (which is not ideal).

Mongoose still sounds the best to me.

[Digivolt]

Has anyone tried - https://www.raisingjakestudios.com/plugins.html ?

It's not just a bass mono-iser but keeps check on your stereo width for phase issues

[djanthonyw]

Simple enough to do it with any M/S EQ.

[Caine123]

Simple enough to do it with any M/S EQ.

i thought so too, but it seems this doesnt prevent phasing issues which Nugen Monofilter would correct.?

[mystran]

Simple enough to do it with any M/S EQ.

If you want to keep things phase-coherent in the transition region, then you either need linear-phase filters, or you need to use an all-pass cross-over network (eg. Linkwitz-Riley) on BOTH the mid AND side (such that they remain in phase with each other), then adjust the gain of the low-band of the side-channel (eg. to zero, if you want it completely mono).

If you use a regular minimum-phase filter on side-channel only, then the low frequencies of the side-channel will get delayed quite significantly with respect to the mid-channel. This effectively results in "phase panning" for the low-frequencies only. This is not a huge issue for the actual bass you wanted to mono, because the side-channel gain will be low, but the phase-lag usually extends quite significantly (ie. octave or two) above the actual cutoff frequency, making a mess of your low-mids.

Note that none of this is even visible in magnitude plots, such as those posted earlier in this thread. You can make it visible by feeding a sine-wave panned to one side, high-pass filtering the side-channel and feeding the result to an M-S phase-plot. You will see an ellipsoid that gets wider as the cutoff gets close (from either side) to the sine-frequency. If you use linear-phase filters, or an all-pass network, then all you see is a straight-line that turns to face the center as the cutoff moves above the sine-frequency.

It should probably also be noted that the same delay that makes a mess of the stereo-image when minimum-phase filtering side-channels only, is also the reason all-pass cross-overs are not really "transparent" at all in the low-frequency region, as the extra delay in the low-frequencies tends to be quite audible (not really as a delay, but it changes the character of the sound). Unfortunately, linear-phase filters don't work that great in this region either.

[Tilly]

Simple enough to do it with any M/S EQ.

Yes.

[MogwaiBoy]

Linear phase introduces it's own problems (pre-ring)... although come to think of it... if you're essentially highpassing the sides in linear phase, would that mean that pre-ring would be confined just to the sides?

[Caine123]

The advantages NUGEN Monofilter gives you are basically... a really nice correlation-by-frequency meter and the option of linear phase (which is not ideal).

Mongoose still sounds the best to me.

hi Mogwai, how did you recognized that Mongoose sounds best? does it also correct phase issues like monofilter? thanks

[mystran]

Linear phase introduces it's own problems (pre-ring)... although come to think of it... if you're essentially highpassing the sides in linear phase, would that mean that pre-ring would be confined just to the sides?

Yeah and the amplitude of the ringing also depends on how much (side-channel) signal content was around the cutoff, so assuming the region is reasonably close to mono to begin with, that ringing might not be too serious. The required latency can get quite excessive though if you want your frequency response to look like something reasonable, which makes it more or less "mastering only" type of thing.

[plexuss]

Mongoose still sounds the best to me.

I do like Boz's plugins. It's still on sale at PBoutique so I just picked it up. I'll try it out later.

[Caine123]

Mongoose still sounds the best to me.

I do like Boz's plugins. It's still on sale at PBoutique so I just picked it up. I'll try it out later.

let s know cause im on the fence atm Monofilter vs Mongoose ! thx

[plexuss]

Mongoose still sounds the best to me.

I do like Boz's plugins. It's still on sale at PBoutique so I just picked it up. I'll try it out later.

let s know cause im on the fence atm Monofilter vs Mongoose ! thx

Ok I will put them through their paces and run them through plugin doctor and let you know of my findings

[MogwaiBoy]

Plexus to the rescue

Re: Why Mongoose. I put it up against everything I had including MonoFilter, Brainworx, Pro-Q (highpassed sides) and Tokyo Dawn. Blind tested, Mongoose sounded the most natural to me. I disagree that they should all sound almost identical, even if the theory says so - because that's not what I hear.

Maybe it's the double internal precision or something (Boz take great care with maintaining signal quality, see also: Voxengo, PSP), plus the fact that the 12db slope in Mongoose has a slight resonance that bumps the freqs above the cutoff (Plexus will show you the Plugindoctor pix) and has excellent 3db compensation.

[plexuss]

[snip]Mongoose ... has excellent 3db compensation.

IS that why in Plugin Doctor I see a +3dB boost on the bottom end of the crossover, when gain is at 0?

[Caine123]

hi plexuss, how were your experiences so far with these plugins?

is there no Mongoose demo? im looking for it :/