KVR Audio

4damind · Post by **4damind** » Thu Oct 09, 2014 1:33 pm

bitcrusher wrote:Just a quick note - Serum v1.01 beta4b is up for registered users in the Serum forum, with another dozen fixes (over 40 since v1.0) and some new features/enhancements (16-bit wav export and more).

I'll provide a new demo download in the next day or two as well.

Steve
Serum | Xfer Records

Thank you Steve... let's have a quick jump to your forum

Mace404 · Post by **Mace404** » Thu Oct 09, 2014 3:18 pm

sonicpowa wrote:Heh.. well, I know it was a bad example.
But you keep telling it is "modified". How it is modified if it´s exactly like the original but in a different format. I have a better example: A Beatles song (or whatever song) that is in hi-res Flac. I take it and convert it to wav or mp3, now I can distribute it freely because it´s "modified"?

A whole song? No.

The wavetables are modified in the term of an own recording.You say they are the same as the original but they are not. I did my own take/recording from a source. In copyright terms that even makes me the owner of my recording. (with their own rights different from the original copyrights - once you get in that corner of copyright land it really starts to get complicated)
Same as the bunch of sampled single cycle waveforms. Only I did everything digital.

I understand there is a thin line because the shape of the waveform is so close to the original.
Maybe even own topic worthy.

zvenx · Post by **zvenx** » Thu Oct 09, 2014 3:24 pm

Mace404 wrote:
sonicpowa wrote:Heh.. well, I know it was a bad example.
But you keep telling it is "modified". How it is modified if it´s exactly like the original but in a different format. I have a better example: A Beatles song (or whatever song) that is in hi-res Flac. I take it and convert it to wav or mp3, now I can distribute it freely because it´s "modified"?
A whole song? No.

The wavetables are modified in the term of an own recording.You say they are the same as the original but they are not. I did my own take/recording from a source. In copyright terms that makes me the owner of my recording. (with their own rights different from the original copyrights - once you get in that corner of copyright land it really starts to get complicated)
Same as the bunch of sampled single cycle waveforms. Only I did everything digital.

I understand there is a thin line because the shape of the waveform is so close to the original.
Maybe even own topic worthy.

Why not just ask waves audio, if what you did is allowed?
rsp

sonicpowa · Post by **sonicpowa** » Thu Oct 09, 2014 3:40 pm

Mace404 wrote:In copyright terms that even makes me the owner of my recording.

Okey this is hilarious. So, whatever you do to the original, the copyright is instantly moved to your possession because you did something to the original file. Damn I´ll get rich when I get the rights for the most famous recordings by converting them to another format and selling them.
In your mind you can twist it to perfectly fit your thinking and make it right, I can´t fight for that lol..

Why not go to the source? Just for fun I´ll ask Waves about it.

Mace404 · Post by **Mace404** » Thu Oct 09, 2014 4:14 pm

sonicpowa wrote:Okey this is hilarious. So, whatever you do to the original, the copyright is instantly moved to your possession because you did something to the original file. Damn I´ll get rich when I get the rights for the most famous recordings by converting them to another format and selling them.
In your mind you can twist it to perfectly fit your thinking and make it right, I can´t fight for that lol..

Why not go to the source? Just for fun I´ll ask Waves about it.

And thats why I said those have different rights than the original. One of them is that you cannot sell them.
And again, a whole song is something completely different than a sample of an oscillator.

That Waves doesn't like it is something different that it being illegal.
Like I said, if it's not allowed then I'll take them down. Still I'm not convinced it is. And if it is then they have allot of work taking down all the other single/multi cycle waveforms.

sonicpowa · Post by **sonicpowa** » Thu Oct 09, 2014 4:27 pm

^ clearly you have your own rules for copyright issues, I´ll leave this debate for now because you don´t understand the basics of the issue. Have a nice day.

Mace404 · Post by **Mace404** » Thu Oct 09, 2014 4:33 pm

sonicpowa wrote:^ clearly you have your own rules for copyright issues, I´ll leave this debate for now because you don´t understand the basics of the issue. Have a nice day.

I can agree to disagree. Perception is hard to explain. (You keep talking about complete songs)
But I do want to say is you should read up into the different copyrights and maybe you realize how fooked up they are.
They clearly interest you.

Sampleconstruct · Post by **Sampleconstruct** » Thu Oct 09, 2014 5:35 pm

Could you not fight about copyright issues via PM?

sonicpowa · Post by **sonicpowa** » Thu Oct 09, 2014 6:04 pm

About the wavetable distribution debate:

Waves answered quickly: "distributing these Wavetables online is very illegal."

"If the user had purchased (and not demoed) Codex, and has managed to extract the WaveTables, then good for him.

(although not exactly ideal as Codex oscillator creates many "ghost" tables that allow smooth morphing between tables inside it's engine)"

So there´s actually more to it than just the wavetables; there´s additional tables created for the smooth sound and of course combined with their Virtual Voltage technology is essential part of the analog sound. Good job Waves!

Edit: @Maze404, " You keep talking about complete songs".
Yes I did because the length of the sample doesn´t matter.

fceramic · Post by **fceramic** » Thu Oct 09, 2014 6:35 pm

Wow the Codex wavetables sounds so good. Didnt know Serum could sound this warm and fuzzy.

sonicpowa · Post by **sonicpowa** » Thu Oct 09, 2014 6:38 pm

fceramic wrote:Wow the Codex wavetables sounds so good. Didnt know Serum could sound this warm and fuzzy.

Hehe.. so if you want Serum to sound amazing then use Codex wavetables!

(although not exactly genuine Codex)

lachrimae · Post by **lachrimae** » Thu Oct 09, 2014 6:40 pm

Not surprised with that response from Waves...

Meanwhile check out Steve's latest changelog:
- added: Export 16-bit wav option to the Export menu

Talk about different philosophies... (not to mention serial vs C/R)

sonicpowa · Post by **sonicpowa** » Thu Oct 09, 2014 7:01 pm

lachrimae wrote:16-bit wav

Hey I remember 16-bit from the 90s!

lachrimae · Post by **lachrimae** » Thu Oct 09, 2014 7:12 pm

Figured that was coming...

sonicpowa · Post by **sonicpowa** » Thu Oct 09, 2014 7:28 pm

lachrimae wrote:Figured that was coming...

Good to know it´s not only 16bit as that would´ve been lame in 2014.

I have an update email from Waves; they have downloaded the converted wavetables and they think it´s very bad and unusable. Like I said I think it´s the Synth as a whole and not just the wavetables as is, although it can do some good when imported to other synths, but it´s not the genuine real thing with all the nuances.

Official Serum thread!