KVR Audio

Igor 4000 · Post by **Igor 4000** » Thu Aug 31, 2006 2:05 pm

GreyLion wrote:Since I don't use Samplitude, I don't have a dog in this hunt, as we say down in Texas. But -- I'd like to compliment Sascha for his professionalism, grace, and thoroughness in responding to some pretty pointed feedback.

A lot of folks here (including me!) could learn a lot from the way he's been been so patient and polite. Don't see that too consistently here.

You took the words right out of my mouth.

oblagon · Post by **oblagon** » Thu Aug 31, 2006 6:56 pm

Samp should get a new clip arranger that is more suitable for midi sequencing. The current one is years behind other sequencers. The whole interface is really a bit archaic.

diverdee · Post by **diverdee** » Thu Aug 31, 2006 7:04 pm

Igor 4000 wrote:
GreyLion wrote:Since I don't use Samplitude, I don't have a dog in this hunt, as we say down in Texas. But -- I'd like to compliment Sascha for his professionalism, grace, and thoroughness in responding to some pretty pointed feedback.

A lot of folks here (including me!) could learn a lot from the way he's been been so patient and polite. Don't see that too consistently here.
You took the words right out of my mouth.

+1 fer sure.

jens · Post by **jens** » Thu Aug 31, 2006 7:36 pm

sascha wrote: [One curious thing as an example for things that fail to work: I bought a Gina24 for at home for AD/DA. I need the ADAT channel for my digital mixer, but there are problems with Sam under ASIO: I've got crackles on the digital outs, but only with Sam and only under ASIO. So I sat with Volker over the problem, he double checked the source code but no error could be found. We assumed it's got something to do with Steinis ASIO SDK. We couldn't precisely tell the faulty place without screwing things totally up. Other devices we hooked up worked perfectly (and seem to do in the wild). Maybe it's my unit (bought it used), but as long as I don't hear from other Echo users (anyone here?) we can only speculate. That's one of these occasions where open systems like these drive you nuts and it's hard to blame anyone without knowing every detail... ]

interesting - eXT users with Echo cards had big problems with crackles (eXT works only with asio-drivers) and the only cure was to use the asio4all drivers instead of the native ones. We did a survery back then and none of us had similar problems with other software or other hardware and eXT. In the end Jorgen managed to fix it and apparently it was just a small thing but it took him quite a while and effort to figure out what it was.

As I have no possibility right now to handle the digital out of my Mia I unfortunately can't test it in SampSE but perhaps these two problems are related after all...

Kraznet · Post by **Kraznet** » Thu Aug 31, 2006 8:12 pm

oblagon wrote:Samp should get a new clip arranger that is more suitable for midi sequencing. The current one is years behind other sequencers. The whole interface is really a bit archaic.

How many years would you say? I'm not getting any younger

Kraznet?

oblagon · Post by **oblagon** » Fri Sep 01, 2006 12:17 am

Kraznet wrote:
oblagon wrote:Samp should get a new clip arranger that is more suitable for midi sequencing. The current one is years behind other sequencers. The whole interface is really a bit archaic.
How many years would you say? I'm not getting any younger

Kraznet?

something from '90. so 6 years at least.

Kraznet · Post by **Kraznet** » Fri Sep 01, 2006 12:31 am

oblagon wrote:
Kraznet wrote:
oblagon wrote:Samp should get a new clip arranger that is more suitable for midi sequencing. The current one is years behind other sequencers. The whole interface is really a bit archaic.
How many years would you say? I'm not getting any younger

Kraznet?
something from '90. so 6 years at least.

I guess midi is pretty archaic anyway .I wonder happened to midi2 ? Midi in Samp has only really become useable since V8 IMHO. I look forward to what improvements there are in V9.Whats you idea of a good clip arranger oblagon ?

Regards
Kraznet

oblagon · Post by **oblagon** » Fri Sep 01, 2006 1:19 am

Kraznet wrote:
oblagon wrote:
Kraznet wrote:
oblagon wrote:Samp should get a new clip arranger that is more suitable for midi sequencing. The current one is years behind other sequencers. The whole interface is really a bit archaic.
How many years would you say? I'm not getting any younger

Kraznet?
something from '90. so 6 years at least.
I guess midi is pretty archaic anyway .I wonder happened to midi2 ? Midi in Samp has only really become useable since V8 IMHO. I look forward to what improvements there are in V9.Whats you idea of a good clip arranger oblagon ?

Energy XT

Samp migh be good without these crouches: lack of clip ghosting (or instancing), no gluing of midi clips, no destructive trimming of clips, buried snapping options, lack of quantizing in the arranger, buried midi editing options in object editor that should / could be integrated in the interface, no visual indicator for muted objects, editing tools that allow to repeatedly glue, split, mute, unmute cplips seem to be missing, no way to set clip selection to loop's range.

Kraznet · Post by **Kraznet** » Fri Sep 01, 2006 2:34 am

lack of clip ghosting (or instancing),

What about right clicking and selecting "Build Loop Object"?

no gluing of midi clips

How about Midi>Glue Midi Object?

no destructive trimming of clips

How about Split Object (key shortcut [T]) then Midi>Trim Midi Object?

buried snapping options

Agreed but I'm used to the shortcut which opens the Project Options for snap settings . I'd like them in the Arrange as well.

buried midi editing options in object editor that should / could be integrated in the interface

I'd like quantizing options in the new Track Editor V9 . For now there's shortcut Crtl+O opens Object Editor.

no visual indicator for muted objects

Midi clips show "MulMur"(whatever that means) when muted but I'd like something more visual as well . Logic's diagonal lines works well.

editing tools that allow to repeatedly glue, split, mute, unmute cplips seem to be missing

I use keyboard shortcuts for all of those and for anything else when ever possible.

no way to set clip selection to loop's range.

Range>Range over all Selected Objects (I use shortcut [P] for that .

All good points though !!

Regards
Kraznet

oblagon · Post by **oblagon** » Fri Sep 01, 2006 3:27 am

Kraznet, i've never tried anything beyond v 8. Most of the stuff you described wasn't there. Good to hear there were some advancements made.

egbert · Post by **egbert** » Fri Sep 01, 2006 3:34 am

Interesting thread guys. I am a former Logic PC guy who uses Cubase SX 3 now. I typically use midi to drive VST samplers and instruments and add audio tracks for guitars, electric bass, horns etc.

Midi editing in the score, list, key editor and drum/hyper editors - is pretty important and for me the ergonomics of Logic are easily superior to Cubase.
There are so many little things - eg Logic's list editor is so much faster to work in.
The Logic transport shows the note value and the numerical velocity value of any incoming note - incredibly useful. There is nothing like the midi monitor from Logic's environment in Cubase where you can see WTF is going on with any midi stream. Why they don't have something you can insert into a midi effect slot that shows what the Midi Monitor shows I will never know.

If Samp 9 or some future update can match the midi editing capabilities of the big guns I would be over there like a shot.
BTW What crossgrade offers are there - to V9 from Logic PC and Cubase?

Kraznet · Post by **Kraznet** » Fri Sep 01, 2006 9:03 am

BTW What crossgrade offers are there - to V9 from Logic PC and Cubase?

Hi egbert

Crossgrade costs $599 but I'm not not sure what the deal is in Oz . I did Sam for Rent and I crossgraded from Logic .

Midi editing in the score, list, key editor and drum/hyper editors - is pretty important and for me the ergonomics of Logic are easily superior to Cubase.

That's why I decided against SX . V9 will have score and the drum editor is similar to the Hyper Editor but nicer in many ways . Also I can do something in the Samp List Editor I could never do in Logic and that is select multiple notes based on bar/beat postion . Ideal for editing HatHat velocities.The transport does show midi activity but not note value which I liked in Logic. I'm waiting to see what V9 brings in terms of midi .

Regards
Kraznet

egbert · Post by **egbert** » Fri Sep 01, 2006 9:42 am

Thanks for the info Kraznet,

I heard that some of the Logic PC coders went to work on Samplitude.

I guess there is plenty of scope for Samp to look at everything that has gone before and try to improve on it. All that midi and scoring code in Logic and Cubase - stuff that goes back to the Atari - is a massive body of work though and that's the big obstacle to new entrants to the midi/audio studio market.

Even single developers can knock up great little audio based hosts with rudimentary midi but doing a comprehensive job on the midi end of things - recreating the feature set of Logic and Cubase - takes a lot of work.

Will there be a downloadable Samp 9 demo anytime soon? (Sascha?) I would like to see what the state of play is now.

jens · Post by **jens** » Fri Sep 01, 2006 9:50 am

Kraznet wrote:
lack of clip ghosting (or instancing),
What about right clicking and selecting "Build Loop Object"?

that's not the same thing

sascha · Post by **sascha** » Fri Sep 01, 2006 10:25 am

egbert wrote: Will there be a downloadable Samp 9 demo anytime soon? (Sascha?) I would like to see what the state of play is now.

Surely, but that can take a while. Some of the team are on vacation currently, then we'll have to decide what goes into the demo and what extra work is to do.

Samplitude 9 announced !!!