KVR Audio

dangus · Post by **dangus** » Mon Sep 12, 2005 12:35 pm

I've been using FL for awhile now and was gonna upgrade to protools and reason now my questions is would i still be able to use fruity loops and the VST's in it to make my loops? If not can reason and protools do everything that i used to do w FL? By the way the reason i was going to get protools is because i bought a guitar and a synth and wanted to run them into my computer so someone recomended an Mbox. Any feedback will be apppreciated

C00kie · Post by **C00kie** » Mon Sep 12, 2005 9:15 pm

1) As far as I know ProTools & Reason can read standard midi files, which FL should be able to export. This standard file format misses most of the specific FL features. Mainly piano rolls are converted OK. When moving host it's best is to write all the songs (rendered as WAV and exported as midi) plus the programs on CD (or DVD); put that in the closet, move on and forget.

2) ProTools has a propriety format of plugins, called RTAS. There is a VSTi wrapper, but some of the default FL stuff won't be there.
Reason is a different cup of tea. It only has its own sound modules, and you cannot plug in other plugins. You can use "rewire" however, so Fruity plays along with Reason (or vice versa) as if it is part of it. I find it an awkward setup, since you cannot do everything in one program anymore. Some people find that OK though...

3) People are discussing forever weather Host A can do what Host B can't. All hosts are very different, except for their basic simularity that you can use them for making music. Period.

4) Whatever people say: ProTools is not heaven on earth, and neither is the MBox.

May I suggest you to have a look at Tracktion, maybe even try out the demo. It's quite easy to use, has excellent audio recording features that FL and Reason lack (Reason can't record audio at all!) and it can use all the VST's you've collected so far without a problem. Also it has ReWire capabilities, so you can connect it up with FruityLoops.

analog orange · Post by **analog orange** » Mon Sep 12, 2005 9:32 pm

Protools is rewire compatible so I don't see why there would be any problem at all. You could integrate all your pieces as much or as little as you wanted. You should buy the VST to RTAS adpater though. It's kind of a no-brainer purchase if you use PT (I do).

james0tucson · Post by **james0tucson** » Mon Sep 12, 2005 9:44 pm

Protools is still considered an *upgrade* from FLS?

analog orange · Post by **analog orange** » Tue Sep 13, 2005 2:31 am

If you want to record lots of audio it definitely is. ProTools started out as an audio multitracker. Fruity started out as a sequencer. They're both developing from different directions.

james0tucson · Post by **james0tucson** » Tue Sep 13, 2005 5:14 am

analog orange wrote:If you want to record lots of audio it definitely is. ProTools started out as an audio multitracker. Fruity started out as a sequencer. They're both developing from different directions.

Let's see, I love using Audition, but I'd rather pull out my toenails with a Leatherman and a rusty butterknife than use ProTools. Each his own I guess,
but if you want an audio editor or recorder to integrate with FLS, I can hardly imagine life being better than what Audition gives you.

analog orange · Post by **analog orange** » Tue Sep 13, 2005 5:52 pm

That must be why Audition is the standard...Sorry, couldn't resist. Hey, I bought an Ensoniq Paris sytem back in 98 and I still use it...with PT.

When Audition comes out with an integrated DAW that includes realtime DSP modules with no latency on 64 tracks, plugins loaded, has a pro transport with great faders (pro-control-dcommand), can integrate directly with an avid or any non-linear video deck ever made...should I go on?

Sorry, I'm kind of an arrogant bastard.

Oh yeah, why the butterknife, my leatherman is more than capable of minor surgery on it's own ;^)

analog orange · Post by **analog orange** » Tue Sep 13, 2005 5:54 pm

I should amend my post by saying that I don't think PT is the end all be all. They make a shitty digital clock, their converters are okay and their midi implimentation isn't the best, though it has some unique advantages...and unique limitations. But for me it works. Cut my teeth on Logic back in 96, but I prefer PT by a mile. To each his own.

Jbravo · Post by **Jbravo** » Tue Sep 13, 2005 6:12 pm

I can see why protools is great for people working in a recording studio with live bands and very high performance when it comes to editing live multi-channel recording, but I think that home users with a virtual studio on their computer are mistakenly being seduced by the apparent status that Protools has in industry circles, and feeling obliged to use that instead of the other (supposedly "non-professional") computer hosts is a big mistake. If you like to use FLStudio and Reason then Protools is highly unlikely to serve your needs

analog orange · Post by **analog orange** » Tue Sep 13, 2005 6:42 pm

I mostly agree with you. However, if one ever wants to work in a pro studio environment, they'd better know PT and know it well.

james0tucson · Post by **james0tucson** » Tue Sep 13, 2005 7:58 pm

analog orange wrote:should I go on?

Sorry, I'm kind of an arrogant bastard.

If you've got a half million dollars in a/v studio hardware, you're not exactly in the typical kvr venue.

It surprises me that people in your bracket don't aspire for something better than PT.

analog orange · Post by **analog orange** » Tue Sep 13, 2005 8:50 pm

It's more like $200k in hardware...the rooms cost more...

If it was your choice, and you were doing what I do, sound design and audio post video/film, what would you aspire for? Fairlight?

I mean, freakin' Skywalker Sound uses what I use, so I don't get it.

james0tucson · Post by **james0tucson** » Tue Sep 13, 2005 8:55 pm

analog orange wrote:It's more like $200k in hardware...the rooms cost more...

If it was your choice, and you were doing what I do, sound design and audio post video/film, what would you aspire for? Fairlight?

I mean, freakin' Skywalker Sound uses what I use, so I don't get it.

Fair enough. But the argument is more about specs of really nice hardware, and the unfortunate circumstance that there's a de-facto standard for software in this venue. Maybe it's the best choice, but it seems like people who should be, aren't interested in progress.

It's not fair to ask you, since you're the user. But there should be some real competition in this marketplace.

My only problem is that people out here are so convinced that everything revolves around ProTools, that they refuse to consider any other possibility, even if it means they do nothing at all.

analog orange · Post by **analog orange** » Tue Sep 13, 2005 9:13 pm

I think I understand where you're coming from. Don't get me wrong, Microso----I mean Digidesign is as evil and competition crushing as Microsoft is. They do however, IMO have a very good product.

How whould you change the situation? I'd like to see Apple step up and provide a real solution with control surfaces and firewire based dsp support. I think they could do it, but the market for that type of thing is pretty small.

Here's the reality of it. If you want to work in a pro studio, you'd better know PT. It doesn't matter if Samplitude or even an 8 year old DAW like Ensoniq Paris has a much better sounding mix buss, ProTools is now a generic term.

What do you use? I won't judge you. The tools don't matter, as long as you can get done what you want to get done the as quickly as possible. What are your main criticisms of the PT software? I quite like it. It has more plugs than you can shake a stick at. I can edit lightning fast, even without a control surface and I can stay inside one window for everything. I'm just not seeing a major achilles heel.

james0tucson · Post by **james0tucson** » Tue Sep 13, 2005 9:28 pm

>What do you use?

I'm an amateur, and I record classical piano and flute, using Audition. I do my composition in FLS. Sometimes I think I'm the only classical musician using FLS

There are two pro studios I have involvement with, and one uses an analog console, with their toe in the water on digital stuff.
It's a production shop for a local TV station. The other, a private music production studio, uses:

(Editing)

DAL Card Deluxe 24 bit, Red Roaster 24, Sound Forge, Adobe Audition, Adobe Encore, Waves Native Pack, Adobe Premiere Pro RT, Pioneer DVR-A05 DVD Recorder

(Control Room)

RME Digiface Audio Interface
Nuendo
Samplitude 2496
Sound Forge
Waves Native Pack
Waves Masters Bundle
Sonic Foundry Noise Reduction
Adobe Premiere

Pro Tools and FL compatible?