KVR Audio

the_nihilist · Post by **the_nihilist** » Sun Sep 18, 2005 10:11 pm

Can anyone offer some good advice for writing melodies that have a really unnatural sound to them? Maybe recommend some particularly interesting scales or bits of theory?

No name · Post by **No name** » Sun Sep 18, 2005 10:13 pm

One ping only.

The Chase · Post by **The Chase** » Sun Sep 18, 2005 10:18 pm

the_nihilist wrote:Can anyone offer some good advice for writing melodies that have a really unnatural sound to them? Maybe recommend some particularly interesting scales or bits of theory?

It's typically the lack of scale and theory that does the trick

vurt · Post by **vurt** » Sun Sep 18, 2005 10:22 pm

google microtuning

also look at theory on eastern musics especially research way back to early musical instruments.
often here you can find inspiration for sounds

or at least i do.

also try just pitch shfting some other stuff and see if that gives you any odeas

shamann · Post by **shamann** » Mon Sep 19, 2005 1:38 am

Listen to Captain Beefheart or Pere Ubu or the Residents. That should give you some ideas. Play around with timing, figure out ways to play effectively out of key, etc.

Steven West · Post by **Steven West** » Mon Sep 19, 2005 2:35 am

Severed Heads. Tom Ellard is either a musical genius, or is spending countless hours extracting from a 8 hour session with a retarded monkey?

But seriously, Ellard being in Australia I think has picked up on many Indian and Asian influences, coupled with his unique brand of industrial lo-fi music making, some really catchy and disturbing melodies come out. Either check out Come Visit The Big Bigot, or Cuisine (much less harsher music on it) and I think you'll get inspired to.

www.sevcom.com

emdot_ambient · Post by **emdot_ambient** » Mon Sep 19, 2005 2:36 am

Put your sequencer in record mode, then pound on your MIDI keyboard with your fists, roll your hands up and down the keyboard, too, and generally prance around on it like a monkey . . . then quantize the mess to, say, 1/32T and start appying MIDI filters to remove notes &/or listen to it and find melodies in the mess, then cut & paste them to a new track.

Or . . . you could look into algorithm based VSTi's that let you input some randomness.

Plenty of ways of doing it without getting all egg-headed and actually studying music

experimental.crow · Post by **experimental.crow** » Mon Sep 19, 2005 2:47 am

shamann wrote:Listen to Captain Beefheart or Pere Ubu or the Residents. That should give you some ideas. Play around with timing, figure out ways to play effectively out of key, etc.

listening to the residents , for any reason , or none at all , is a very good idea ...

vurt · Post by **vurt** » Mon Sep 19, 2005 2:54 am

speaking of whom...
thrid reich n roll is re-released soon for those who missed it last time round

doogs · Post by **doogs** » Mon Sep 19, 2005 2:56 am

The exotic sounding intervals are the b2, #4, and the maj7th (when played against a minor third). Scales with these intervals tend to sound strange.

Some of the stranger sounding scales...
For instance, the Locrian Scale ( B,C,D,E,F,G,A,B )
Tthe Lydian Scale ( F,G,A,B,C,D,E,F )
the Phrygian Scale ( E,F,G,A,B,C,D,E )(spanish sounding)
or the Hirojoshi Scale ( E-F#-G-B-C-E )

Also the whole tone ( C,D,E,F#,G#,Bb,C ) and the diminished scales ( C,D,D#,F#,G#,A,B,C )sound pretty out there.

Yagushi · Post by **Yagushi** » Mon Sep 19, 2005 3:00 am

Chase wrote:It's typically the lack of scale and theory that does the trick

Shush! You're giving away my most prized trade secrets for free!

As for the Residents, let's not forget the importance of the brilliantly crappy synth sounds which add to the "unnaturalness" of their greatest cacophonic melodies... Out-of-tune oscillators are a good starting point!

nrenda · Post by **nrenda** » Mon Sep 19, 2005 3:00 am

Do a search on Schonberg and serialism.

herodotus · Post by **herodotus** » Mon Sep 19, 2005 3:04 am

There are three "unnatural" scales that are in fairly common use.

They are:
The whole tone scale:(c, d, e, f#, g#, a# {c})

The 'octatonic' or 'diminished' scale: (c, c#, d#, e, f#, g, a, a#, {c})

And another without a common name: (c, c#, e, f, g#, a, {c})

They are all among Messiaens "Modes of Limited Transposition", but they existed long before that.

They are unnatural in the sense that the are founded directly on the internal symmetry of the "unnatural" system of equal temperament rather than being a diatonic scale theoretically founded on the 'natural' system of just intonation.

Glassback · Post by **Glassback** » Mon Sep 19, 2005 7:10 am

normal wrote:
shamann wrote:Listen to Captain Beefheart or Pere Ubu or the Residents. That should give you some ideas. Play around with timing, figure out ways to play effectively out of key, etc.
listening to the residents , for any reason , or none at all , is a very good idea ...

vurt wrote:speaking of whom...
thrid reich n roll is re-released soon for those who missed it last time round

That'll be ace to finally ditch my knackered-up tape copy!

Hernan · Post by **Hernan** » Mon Sep 19, 2005 7:31 am

something having big-ish leaps in your melogy line (things like 4ths, b5ths, 5ths... 7ths) can weirdify the melody

notes in the melody that don't belong to the underlying chord, if emphasized, can sound strange too. a minor 2nd, 2nd, b5th...

on the guitar, some fingering exercises are weird-sounding

sorry not a super music theory expert here, hope this helps somehow

Writing strange-sounding melodies?