KVR Audio

soulkraka · Post by **soulkraka** » Fri Nov 18, 2005 1:26 pm

Ive noticed a lot of people seem to be overly concerned with copyright law here on KVR, as well as other forums such as EM411. Whats all the hoopla about? These types of threads are, for the most, irrelevant IMHO.

Heres why:

1. If your making music for yourself/friends/to post the occasional MP3 on KVR or The Auditorium/to play when you DJ etc etc then it doesnt matter at all what/who you sample. Nobody is gonna get sued over some MP3 file that 50 people downloaded on KVR.

2. If your signed to a small indie and release house, IDM, drum-n-bass etc tracks that sell 500-1000 copies on vinyl then the same rule of thumb also applies. There are house music tracks coming out EVERYDAY that have movie samples, michael jackson samples etc etc. No one is getting sued.

3. If you are involved in musical projects that are destined to sell loads of copies then you wouldnt be discussing this issue on KVR.
You would either (a) be well versed in copyright law already, (b) be discussing this issue with a lawyer, or (c) have already told your record company what samples you have used and they are working on clearing them or possibly "recreating" them a'la Dr Dre or The Go! Team.

Sooooo...in the spirit of keeping things relevant, can someone please tell what the best vst for trance is please.

nuffink · Post by **nuffink** » Fri Nov 18, 2005 1:30 pm

4. If by some miracle you make some money, the record company that owns the sample takes it from you.
5. If it goes big, see 4, plus record company gets to recycle a dormant act.

deleted · Post by **deleted** » Fri Nov 18, 2005 1:31 pm

DELETED

whyterabbyt · Post by **whyterabbyt** » Fri Nov 18, 2005 1:35 pm

Negativland
The Verve
Vanilla Ice

yada yada yada.

deleted · Post by **deleted** » Fri Nov 18, 2005 1:36 pm

DELETED

djsubject · Post by **djsubject** » Fri Nov 18, 2005 1:39 pm

nuffink wrote:4. If by some miracle you make some money, the record company that owns the sample takes it from you.
5. If it goes big, see 4, plus record company gets to recycle a dormant act.

that sounds like a good traid to me!!!!!

all are happy no? if this would upset you why would you use the fliping sample in the first place

get real peeps, over here in the uk you can sell a few thousend records as a pre release/promo & not pay shit to the orignal owner of the sample (you may need to chainge the name of the promo every 500 records or so though)

if it gose big then realy you would need the orignal owner of the sample, or a big lable to give you a deal

8000 sales in one week might get you in the top 40 of the charts,

so no real need to worry about what you do unless you are big

Subz

whyterabbyt · Post by **whyterabbyt** » Fri Nov 18, 2005 1:40 pm

Not only that. Fatboy Slim used samples from Negativeland in a track that was subsequently used in a Coke advert. He paid Negativland's record company(*) but the part he lifted was an uncleared sample in the first place...

(*) Negativland would never have required this in the first place, but the record company were corrupt as f**k anyway, and didnt pay NL a cent.

whyterabbyt · Post by **whyterabbyt** » Fri Nov 18, 2005 1:42 pm

djsubject wrote: get real peeps, over here in the uk you can sell a few thousend records as a pre release/promo & not pay shit to the orignal owner of the sample (you may need to chainge the name of the promo every 500 records or so though)
if it gose big then realy you would need the orignal owner of the sample, or a big lable to give you a deal
8000 sales in one week might get you in the top 40 of the charts,
so no real need to worry about what you do unless you are big

Can you give a factual basis for these assertions, or is it just what you heard from a friend of a friend?

nuffink · Post by **nuffink** » Fri Nov 18, 2005 1:43 pm

djsubject wrote:
nuffink wrote:4. If by some miracle you make some money, the record company that owns the sample takes it from you.
5. If it goes big, see 4, plus record company gets to recycle a dormant act.
that sounds like a good traid to me!!!!!

all are happy no? if this would upset you why would you use the fliping sample in the first place

You misunderstand. I'm not knocking it. It's often a win-win situation.

Ask Jason Nevins.

soulkraka · Post by **soulkraka** » Fri Nov 18, 2005 1:43 pm

The musicians that have been sued for copywrong infraction have been big name acts...de la soul, NWA, DJ Quik etc etc. Ah well, guess they shoulda came over to KVR and sought our advice on the matter

bottom line: theyre only gonna sue you if there is something to gain. Selling a big 500 copies of your latest dark ambient masterpiece will still keep you well under the majors (and their lawyers) radar.

Wicker Man · Post by **Wicker Man** » Fri Nov 18, 2005 1:44 pm

The only 'rule of thumb' you should use (whether its music, pics or copy) is 'if its worth using then it must be worth something'.

I agree, if you are a hobby musician and wish to sample then go ahead, no harm done...but once you distribute something or publish it on your iddy-biddy website then you have no control of what is going to happen to copyrighted material, whether you are attempting to make money from it or not.

deleted · Post by **deleted** » Fri Nov 18, 2005 1:49 pm

DELETED

whyterabbyt · Post by **whyterabbyt** » Fri Nov 18, 2005 1:51 pm

soulkraka wrote:The musicians that have been sued for copywrong infraction have been big name acts...de la soul, NWA, DJ Quik etc etc. Ah well, guess they shoulda came over to KVR and sought our advice on the matter

Ah of course. Only bands who are 'big names' ever make it to become 'big names'.

bottom line: theyre only gonna sue you if there is something to gain. Selling a big 500 copies of your latest dark ambient masterpiece will still keep you well under the majors (and their lawyers) radar.

You do a few tracks early on with uncleared samples. Five years later you make some money selling something else. Woot.

But oopsie... all of a sudden you're on 'the radar' and all your money heads off to some other record company to pay for samples on your earliest releases.

And you think "Hey. I wish someone had wanrned me about that. Oh no wait, they did, but I didnt care because I wasnt 'on the radar'"

CypherOne · Post by **CypherOne** » Fri Nov 18, 2005 2:00 pm

I say 'f**k it' but then I'm deep like that.

soulkraka · Post by **soulkraka** » Fri Nov 18, 2005 2:06 pm

whyterabbyt wrote:
soulkraka wrote:The musicians that have been sued for copywrong infraction have been big name acts...de la soul, NWA, DJ Quik etc etc. Ah well, guess they shoulda came over to KVR and sought our advice on the matter
Ah of course. Only bands who are 'big names' ever make it to become 'big names'.

bottom line: theyre only gonna sue you if there is something to gain. Selling a big 500 copies of your latest dark ambient masterpiece will still keep you well under the majors (and their lawyers) radar.
You do a few tracks early on with uncleared samples. Five years later you make some money selling something else. Woot.

But oopsie... all of a sudden you're on 'the radar' and all your money heads off to some other record company to pay for samples on your earliest releases.

And you think "Hey. I wish someone had wanrned me about that. Oh no wait, they did, but I didnt care because I wasnt 'on the radar'"

Like who for example? Of course de la soul got sued for samples off their debut album BUT they were signed to a major label therebye having a "fairly decent" chance of getting big.

Another example, DJ Quik. Hes been around for a while but had never really quite broke out in a big way. He sampled some Indian national song, the song was huge, he got sued and lost big time, BUT guess whos songs are everywhere on US radio now...DJ Quik.

So ya, he shoulda cleared it but he probably wasnt able to. Seems like it worked out for him.

I think some of you are missing my point though.

Sample whatever you want!