KVR Audio

marcouk · Post by **marcouk** » Tue Apr 25, 2006 8:04 am

morning all. I have a specific question re compression.

I have made a track and am struggling to eq the bass. Some of the lower notes are far too loud and boom from my speakers, and the middle notes just blend into the mix. Would compression be the answer to this problem? If so, what sort of ratio's should I use? Thanks in advance for your help.

Kriminal · Post by **Kriminal** » Tue Apr 25, 2006 8:06 am

what kind of bass, synth, guitar? Also, is it conflicting with other sounds, suck as a kick etc?

.jon · Post by **.jon** » Tue Apr 25, 2006 8:09 am

Yes, that sounds like a job for a compressor. Impossible to say the values you need to dial in, it depends on your source material and also personal taste. Insert a compressor on the track and listen.

Sound on Sound has good guided on compression in their website archive. I think there might be also "recommended" values for certain instruments in them.

.jon

lfm · Post by **lfm** » Tue Apr 25, 2006 10:52 am

Download Classic Compressor:
www.kjaerhusaudio.com and there are some presets for bass to start with.

For bass I found not the ratio the most important(about 4 or so) but other settings such as threshold, attack, and the softness knee. To hard a knee will make it sound dead in dynamics. I was surprised over result how much louder that bass sounded when knee was softer. And increase attack-time so you can feel dynamics go through a bit, rather than raising the general level, which is tempting.

Few digital compressors has the ability to view the internal level so that you do not overflow anything internally. My general suggestion is that you adjust first threshold, then gain to just make up for that adjustment in threshold. The difference in loudness is best if you get about the same level with compressor and bypassing it(usually just a click in host program). Then you do not risk overflow.

If you get this problem with level often, I suggest you get an external compressor before your soundcard inputs and do it at that stage. I bought a couple of pre-amps Hootersound B-1 which are fairly priced(second hand $100), which sound good, have noisegate and compressor built in as well.

Barbarossa · Post by **Barbarossa** » Tue Apr 25, 2006 12:46 pm

I would say, this should be first adressed with an eq. Obviously your monitoring and room acoustics produce resonances. So i would go for an analyzer to see, if there are indeed certain notes much louder. If not, then you know it is the acoustics.

caruso · Post by **caruso** » Tue Apr 25, 2006 1:14 pm

marcouk wrote:morning all. I have a specific question re compression.

I have made a track and am struggling to eq the bass. Some of the lower notes are far too loud and boom from my speakers, and the middle notes just blend into the mix. Would compression be the answer to this problem? If so, what sort of ratio's should I use? Thanks in advance for your help.

Try using a multiband compressor that way you can squash down the low sub end, bring up the highs if needed but more importantly, you can emphasis the low mid range where most of your sound will be.

Peel · Post by **Peel** » Tue Apr 25, 2006 1:30 pm

I would also go to EQ first.

marcouk · Post by **marcouk** » Tue Apr 25, 2006 1:53 pm

Its the modern fingered preset in Trilogy.

Tried the classic comp, doesnt seem to balance out the boom really.

Killvehicle · Post by **Killvehicle** » Tue Apr 25, 2006 2:21 pm

IF it is a Rock style type bass, Its not uncommon to make that thing sustain for days, Which would be a job for a limiter almost, JUst higher compression ratio, IT really depends, if your bass is doing just that, being a fat constant low-end, you would compress a little harder, IF it is like a slap bass, or a more active type part, you would try to keep the attacks cutting thru, so you dont lose the dynamics, BUt bass and compression almost go hand in hand, But if this is a synth bass, I wouldnt necessarily reach for a compressor at that point, And Eq would be the first choice

COmpressors arent that hard if you tweak them and understand what you are doing. Obvioulsy it would be nice if your compressor has an incoming signal meter, I Dont think CLassic compressor does but it does tell you when the compressor is working, so it is not ideal but gives you a general good starting point. BAssically bring down the threshold until it starts compressing on the harder notes, and then adjust ratio and so on, IF you want a harder compressor adjust threshold until it is almost constantly in compression, and then move on to everything else. If the attacks are not cutting thru, lengthen the attack,or cut back on the threshold and/or the same for release, It may take a few minutes but I rarely if ever try a compressor preset, since that really doesnt make sense at all. ALl audio materieal is quite different and those presets, in Classic compressor and such, most likely will not be a magic wand.

jupiter8 · Post by **jupiter8** » Tue Apr 25, 2006 2:33 pm

What notes and what are the dimensions of your room ?
This sounds like a classic case of standing waves.

You could eq and compress 'til you're blue in the face and all it's going to accomplish is another thread tomorrow "Why does my mix sound like crap on other systems when it sounds perfect in my studio"

If it is standing waves you'r either have to treat the room with basstraps or learn to works around it.

Paulie Phonick · Post by **Paulie Phonick** » Tue Apr 25, 2006 2:44 pm

@marcouk: Try to listen on headphones and see if the boomy notes are still boomy. If not - it's your room acoustics. If they are - try to EQ the low freqs a bit or better treat the track with multiband compression (Voxengo Soniformer could be really helpful).

Killvehicle · Post by **Killvehicle** » Tue Apr 25, 2006 2:45 pm

yeah obvioulsy we are just throwing out shit and seeing if it sticks. It could any number of things, and without any of us hearing it, it will probably leave you in about the same place where you started. UNfortunately you will get about a dozen different things, and most likely 1 is right. Keep trying is the only real advice that can be put to use and be successful. Or you can post it and see what others think, that way we actually have the problem in our hands as well...

eduardo_b · Post by **eduardo_b** » Tue Apr 25, 2006 3:25 pm

The comments on speaker to room standing wave/resonance are correct. You can't mix for frequency balance if the room is reacting to certain bass notes -- probably around 120 Hz somewhere. It could be the room dimensions and/or where you've placed the speakers. If they're in a corner or two, move them away from the walls, and get them off the floor if that's where they are now. You might consider getting a sound level meter and test CD to balance the system for the room itself.

bduffy · Post by **bduffy** » Tue Apr 25, 2006 3:25 pm

Indeed, Killvehicle: you should post a little sample; would be highly helpful. I know the subs can be a little overwhelming on a couple Trilogy patches, but they are immensely well recorded, so it might be your room. Did you try an analyzer?

marcouk · Post by **marcouk** » Tue Apr 25, 2006 6:30 pm

thanks for the ideas. Can anyone reccomend an analyser - and then tell me what I should be looking for in particular?

Specific compression on bass. Question.