Mackie or Alto Mixer ?

[fatjack]

i'm on for a new mixer, 12 channels preferably, was quite impressed with the alesis with usb and firewire interfaces and fx, found some yamahas interesting too, and soundcrafts <the gigrac series are fantastically good looking>, been at turnkey having a quick go on one of the mackies VLZs and decided to loose all fx and usb and innterfaces and go for a mackie, read the specifications once again etc
the problem now, to decide beetween the 1402 VLZ Pro and the 1202 VLZ3... no problem loosing the faders if the filters of the VLZ3 are really worth it!
on my searches for best Mackies prices, found this Alto L12 mixer, a brand that i've never heard of, but that seems extremelly capable, checking its specifications and the manual that i find in some aspects so complete or more than any of the ones i mentioned already, but than i can't find any reviews
can a mixer with this capabilities be this cheap, because its a less known brand, could it be of the not so good components?
will be very welcome any coments on this Altos, or the mackies VLZ Pro or VLZ3
thanks

[BertKoor]

to decide beetween the 1402 VLZ Pro and the 1202 VLZ3... no problem loosing the faders if the filters of the VLZ3 are really worth it!

1202 VLZ3: 3-Band Active EQ (80Hz, 2.5kHz, 12kHz)
1402 VLZ-Pro: 3-band Active EQ (80Hz, 2.5kHz, 12kHz)

So it looks as the same EQ, and not a really interesting one... Imho the EQ only becomes "really worth it" if it has two sweepable mids (never seen that on a compact mixer.) These both have one fixed mid. I can live with one sweepable mid (I use a Mackie 1604 VLZ-Pro at home) but only fixed mid... no thanks.

on my searches for best Mackies prices, found this Alto L12 mixer, a brand that i've never heard of, but that seems extremelly capable, checking its specifications and the manual that i find in some aspects so complete or more than any of the ones i mentioned already, but than i can't find any reviews
can a mixer with this capabilities be this cheap, because its a less known brand, could it be of the not so good components?

Never heard of it either. On the surface it actually looks like a Behringer Eurodesk / Xenyx rip-off, which in turn is a Mackie rip-off

Costs are usually cut by doing the assembly in China, and do away with quality checks.

Having browsed through the (German) manual, what worries me the most is the frequency response characteristics of this device: a whopping +3dB. That's far from transparent / uncoloured!

But do you actually want digital effects in a mixer? Are you going to use it live or in a home studio?

[fatjack]

first thanks for your time BertKoor

to decide beetween the 1402 VLZ Pro and the 1202 VLZ3... no problem loosing the faders if the filters of the VLZ3 are really worth it!

1202 VLZ3: 3-Band Active EQ (80Hz, 2.5kHz, 12kHz)
1402 VLZ-Pro: 3-band Active EQ (80Hz, 2.5kHz, 12kHz)

So it looks as the same EQ, and not a really interesting one...

yes they look pretty much the same, but on the VLZ3 page there's a link to "Why VLZ3 Is Better Than VLZPro"
http://www.mackie.com/products/vlz3seri ... VLZpro.pdf

Imho the EQ only becomes "really worth it" if it has two sweepable mids (never seen that on a compact mixer.) These both have one fixed mid. I can live with one sweepable mid (I use a Mackie 1604 VLZ-Pro at home) but only fixed mid... no thanks.

fair and agreed, but than, even if i consider spending the amount 1604 VLZ-Pro costs, like you say i'm not going to find a mixing desk with 2 sweepable mids, and if i find one will be a behringer or a rip off, with one only

on my searches for best Mackies prices, found this Alto L12 mixer, a brand that i've never heard of, but that seems extremelly capable, checking its specifications and the manual that i find in some aspects so complete or more than any of the ones i mentioned already, but than i can't find any reviews
can a mixer with this capabilities be this cheap, because its a less known brand, could it be of the not so good components?

Never heard of it either. On the surface it actually looks like a Behringer Eurodesk / Xenyx rip-off, which in turn is a Mackie rip-off

yes, you're saying it all, better keep the mackies

But do you actually want digital effects in a mixer? Are you going to use it live or in a home studio?

home studio only, and i don't need the fxs as already have a very capable unit, but would be practical... if you consider having TC Electronics fxs as found on this soundcraft if i'm not mistaken, but i'd have to pay to get that ;/

thanks again it was quite helpfull

[BertKoor]

1202 VLZ3: 3-Band Active EQ (80Hz, 2.5kHz, 12kHz)
1402 VLZ-Pro: 3-band Active EQ (80Hz, 2.5kHz, 12kHz)

So it looks as the same EQ, and not a really interesting one...

yes they look pretty much the same, but on the VLZ3 page there's a link to "Why VLZ3 Is Better Than VLZPro"
http://www.mackie.com/products/vlz3seri ... VLZpro.pdf

Yes, those graphs look intimidating. But it remains a non-sweepable mid band.

But do you actually want digital effects in a mixer? Are you going to use it live or in a home studio?

home studio only, and i don't need the fxs as already have a very capable unit, but would be practical... if you consider having TC Electronics fxs as found on this soundcraft if i'm not mistaken, but i'd have to pay to get that ;/

For use in a home studio both effects and EQ are not that important anymore, since you can do all that with VSTs. But you want your mixer to sound transparent and neutral. And that's where I have my reservations against the Alto. Apart from that, it looks quite interesting. With sub/group buses and all.

Alto also has the S-series which looks like it's the L-series without effects.

[dickiefunk]

I can't comment on the Mackies because I haven't used one but I have a Soundcraft M8 and have found the sound to be superb. This desk sounds quiet and neutral to my ears and is cheaper than the Mackies. I love my Soundcraft and if I were to upgrade I'd look at the Midas Venice etc.

[fatjack]

you made me consider for 5 minutes the 1604 VLZ PRO, for the sweepable mid, but i don't think it worths the difference on the price for the kind of work i'm on to

I have a Soundcraft M8 and have found the sound to be superb.

had a quick go on the M8 faders and i have to say that didn't like the kind of "loose" faders

... if I were to upgrade I'd look at the Midas Venice etc.

good reply.. Midas Venice 160, 2000 pounds!
i've had a couple of "gos" on this 160, and have to say they're.. massive, and pretty cool!

easy, i'm going for the 1402 VLZ Pro

cheers guys