Jamstix in Cantabile

[TiUser]

Hi folks.

Anybody using Jamstix in Cantabile?

I've tried the demo and find it an interesting concept.

But I've noticed repeatedly occurring heavy timing load spikes - is this just with the demo or has anyone experienced similar behavior with the full version?

[TiUser]

...no one using Jamstix in Cantabile?

[tman2k (Meathook Audio)]

...no one using Jamstix in Cantabile?

Hi there...I do have the full version of Jamstix, but do not use it in Cantabile. However, in the next few days, I will try and get a chance to load it up and see how things work on my end!

Terry.

[TiUser]

...looking forward to your reply...

[Debby747]

Hello TiUser,


I love Jamstix

And I do not encounter any unusual or re-occurring heavy loads/spikes.

In case nobody can assist you here - the developer is very active on his
forum at rayzoon.com

Jamstix 3 will be released soon and I am really looking forward to it!
I hope, you'll get this problem sorted out -
if you like Jamstix there's no way you should miss it.


Best regards,
D.

[TiUser]

Thanks for your comments...

I've had a look on "band in a box" too... pity this is no vsti. I also don't like the intransparent cost factor, here and there another expansion pack... looks like a barrel without bottom...

I'm looking for some simple to handle backing to jam with - I'd like at least drums and bass accompaniment...

[lallis]

..."band in a box"...no vsti...intransparent cost factor, here and there another expansion pack...barrel without bottom...

TI, Band in a Box can be run cheaply and simply with just the lowest level of "pak". Unless you find yourself wanting new styles, there would never be any need to upgrade anything. Its basic styles are tiny and MIDI based, to actuate your MIDI modules. Styles and written-out tunes are commonly downloadable.

Their seemingly-endless and expensive expansions are now huge audio-based styles constantly being developed. They are derived from sliced loops. They sound realistic, but are limited and finally repetitive. Fortunately, they are not necessary, since the old MIDI styles suffice for jamming needs.

Band in a Box is strongly biased toward modern jazz. Rock players take less enjoyment from it, but they apparently still find some use.

It is not an interactive jammer program, but more of a songwriter's program. You must prepare your arrangement in advance, and then play to it. When you gain proficiency, it is possible to jump non-linearly from place to place in an arrangement during performance, using the "Conductor" feature.


A similar program is "Jammer" from a firm called Soundtrek. It is not jazz-centered. Its GUI is more intelligent, attractive, and competently programmed than BiaB. I find the user style programming more difficult. It is a professional-level program, with enormous control over your arranging.


There is also something called "One Man Band", which uses the widely available interactive Yamaha keyboard styles, except in a software module. Another apparently-similar thing is called "Busker". I have never tried either of these, but I expect them to be lame, reading between the lines in their descriptions.

[TiUser]

Thanks Larry for your long reply.

At first, trouble with style based arranger software I faced is similar to midi files playback... sound quality depends a lot on a match between the midi data and tone generators used. Styles sound horrible if you can't match that proper...

I have an arranger program called "Live-Styler"... beyond the fact that I believe it is not professionally programmed - compared to Cantabile - and there is no real support I faced exactly this problem... Basically the SW is build around and outdated Creative soundcard HW with soundfonts... other more acceptable sounding solutions need again special HW - for a software I don't rely and trust...

The best styles I've heard are Yamaha Tyros styles - but these need Yamaha Megavoices. I havent't found any SW replacement for that... and the need for a Yamaha HW arranger just to replay styles from a PC SW arranger seems to be a bit schitzophrenic...

You are right, band in a box is a software to create arrangements. I agree that the user interface is not great. Sound wise I again see the problem that just using midi will again produce medicore sonic results...

All the world is telling how superior PC solutions can sound but noone really points out the massive effort to get there. Heading this reoad can easily end up with a lot of frustration...

Lately with my new PC I was able to run some GB sample based piano stuff I couldn't use before... It's really a difference to workstations and I even feel now my speakers are not good enough to reproduce all that's in that... and I start to notice more and more the medicore piano sounds in workstations, the lack of string resonance, subtle noises and multi layers... and I do not have "Ivory" which is qutede hewe as one of the best grands...

Well, what I am after is somehow a solution where I can use styles out of the box but can grow into for modifications. What I see is either style players with preproduced styles or professional tools where you have to do everything from scratch... but there seems nothing to bridge, like use a style but modify or extend some tracks in it you want different - with tools to create variations automatically or with composition aids helping a non professional.

One man band has a chaotic user interface IMHO. I don't know what it can do but even if it would be great I'd expect it to be hard to operate... and BTW, live styler is under the hood the same, just the main screen is nice... the rest is really below shareware level... it also lacks logic.

Jammer looks interesting
Busker looks interesting too
- I will investigate both.

At a first glance my impression is all this software lacks integration... but let me see before I draw conclusions too quickly...


Thanks for all hints!

[lallis]

Your problem will always be to find a decent General MIDI soundset. None of the auto-accompaniment programs can sound bearable without that, and it's difficult to find. It's inexplicable that this can be so, since every musician has some need to play a GM file at times and have it sound realistic.

I use a large self-compiled soundfont loaded into a Creative Audigy card, which sounds very fine, but it required great work and expense to make it.

GM users seem to love a tiny GM hardware module "Ketron SD2" from Italy, that sells here for US$380. For most, this seems the great solution. It is very versatile, portable, and playable. The demos for it will surprise you.

(Band in a Box ships with a GM VSTi, the Roland Virtual Sound Canvas3. It is almost tolerable in sound quality, for crudest work. But it's not really any good. Some good MIDI modules allegedly have usable GM sets built in.)

[TiUser]

...true, you nailed it with the sound set problem!

I know the Ketron SD-2 module but it corrupts where I want to go... a fully pc integrated solution... with this thing I would have again special HW, even worse, not integrated in a digital audio work flow...

It still looks simpler to get a complete HW arranger with megavoices for best accompaniment - yet still no digital integration for that out of the box too...

I've checked out one man band and busker - both from the same developer. I like the basic idea but the programs are technically unprofessional. I tried using VstSynthFont with SGM-180. It works but I regularly got stuck notes in the solo section. My suspicion is there is no multi threading at all in these programs - even resizing the main window stopped style playback completely! It's a pity because it looks like both contain a lot of intellectual work and pure musical value.

Even Cantabile is just touching what I dream of in terms of sound selection - just pick up any sounds I want instantly, regardless which plugin it creates... but there is still too much to plan, consider and configure - things are not instant when you don't take care for that.

[lallis]

I know the Ketron SD-2 module but it corrupts where I want to go... a fully pc integrated solution... with this thing I would have again special HW, even worse, not integrated in a digital audio work flow...

You would have special hardware, but only a tiny size like a stack of 40 cigarettes; you'd need one MIDI cable, and paired audio cables, both of which could be short. So it is not a violent physical corruption.

Agreed, such an instrument is not a softsynth, and it sits outside your computer case. But addressing a MIDI port is performed exactly like sending the same digital instructions to a software synth loaded in memory. Perhaps your spirit would be violated only a little.

The Yamaha SYXG50 softsynth sounded quite good and functioned like a resident GM module. This softsynth is still findable and downloadable.

_________________
Larry

Cantabile Solo
---

[robogone]

Sorry, I only use it in Live, but just wanted to add that it's a great app and great value for money. I've never experienced any spikes like that.

How much RAM do you have? Might be that it's a general shortage of resources that's causing it.

[mbncp]

I also do have these spikes in every host I tried (cubase, reaper, bidule,..).
Ralph made once a special version to see if it was related to jamstix and indeed it was, but we never found what the problem was, as js was taking about 10 msec about once a minute, which would off course create crakles.

It seems that closing the gui makes them go away.

[TiUser]

...only suspicion I have is it might be audio buffer size related.

[TiUser]

How much RAM do you have?

4GB - Vista64

Might be that it's a general shortage of resources that's causing it.

I doubt this a bit - my Q8200@2.3GHz Core2 Quad is hardly hitting any limits with music apps while timing load itself seems to be somehow a factor...