That classic synth that is playing like 3:20 in...
*dies* that synth sound to me is one of quintessential classic synth sounds.
What are the building blocks of that sound? I know it must be very basic but I'm having a hard time dialing it in Fabfilter Twin... anybody have any advice?
Synth on Pink Floyd 'Dogs' / Animals
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- KVRer
- 9 posts since 13 Nov, 2011 from Germany
That was produced using a ARP String Synthesizer. It would be hard to emulate that specific sound without one.
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- KVRAF
- 1595 posts since 17 Nov, 2007 from Seattle, WA
I figured he was talking about the Minimoog monophonic lead playing 4th octave notes, rather than the high stuff.
I'm not really a "YOU CAN ONLY DO IT WITH TEH REAL ANALOG HARDWARE!!11" kind of guy... I believe that, most of the time by far, you can find ways to emulate the sound just fine with a softsynth...
On the other hand, as I understand it, there might be some elements that could be tough to nail.
But we can start by looking at what the minimoog's features(wikipedia to the rescue. Image = link).
It had 3 oscillators. So we might have all 3 of those active. To my ear, they're running saws(..?), and I think I hear some slight detune, some slow but pretty heavy beating. So at least 2 are mixed in. Maybe give it a +/-12.5 cent detune for that kind of beating strength/rate.
This synth also had a noise generator, but I'm not hearing that in this patch.
It also had glide prominently featured.. I don't think I hear it this time though.
One of the things that seems to be a big trend in older patches is the use of slower attacks on the filter or amp envelopes. So a bit of that could work out on one or the other. I'm not positive of what I hear regarding envelope attacks this time around, but utilizing it would be my starting point. So attack vs not on those two settings represents 4 combinations to try out.
Further regarding envelopes, the decay will always match the release, as it had one knob to adjust both, I guess?
Minimoog was monophonic. One note at a time.
The filter was 24 db/oct, according to wikipedia. That simplifies figuring out the filter setting, then. I don't hear the buzzy highs, so the top bit must be rolled off to some extent. How much is rolled off, though, depends on the magnitude of the filter envelope(if any). If only I could hear that part more clearly, it'd be a lot easier to determine.
But that right there will get you in the ballpark.
The next consideration is modulation... One of the 3 oscillators is capable of being used as an LFO, likely tied to the mod wheel, to modulate either all-oscillators pitch(I'm guessing) or filter cutoff or amp. I suspect only one at a time, but I don't know which.
There's also a pitchbend, which if utilized deftly could remove the need to tie an LFO to pitch, and free it up for amp or filter cutoff.
As far as I can tell, it doesn't utilize velocity modulations...? Don't know for sure.
And if any key-tracking is built in, then it's hard wired. But I didn't read anything regarding keytracking, so I suppose none. If there was, it'd probably affect the filter cutoff.
Anyways, this comes together to illustrate that modulation was probably not extensive, and expressiveness was achieved manually.
So yeah, probably a simple patch, since the features aren't particularly huge. But then again, how much of the magic comes from the patch, and how much comes from the player? You can be the judge of that...
Hope that helped. I'm as interested in this recreation as you are, so I'd be keen to see if anyone else has thoughts.
I'm not really a "YOU CAN ONLY DO IT WITH TEH REAL ANALOG HARDWARE!!11" kind of guy... I believe that, most of the time by far, you can find ways to emulate the sound just fine with a softsynth...
On the other hand, as I understand it, there might be some elements that could be tough to nail.
But we can start by looking at what the minimoog's features(wikipedia to the rescue. Image = link).
It had 3 oscillators. So we might have all 3 of those active. To my ear, they're running saws(..?), and I think I hear some slight detune, some slow but pretty heavy beating. So at least 2 are mixed in. Maybe give it a +/-12.5 cent detune for that kind of beating strength/rate.
This synth also had a noise generator, but I'm not hearing that in this patch.
It also had glide prominently featured.. I don't think I hear it this time though.
One of the things that seems to be a big trend in older patches is the use of slower attacks on the filter or amp envelopes. So a bit of that could work out on one or the other. I'm not positive of what I hear regarding envelope attacks this time around, but utilizing it would be my starting point. So attack vs not on those two settings represents 4 combinations to try out.
Further regarding envelopes, the decay will always match the release, as it had one knob to adjust both, I guess?
Minimoog was monophonic. One note at a time.
The filter was 24 db/oct, according to wikipedia. That simplifies figuring out the filter setting, then. I don't hear the buzzy highs, so the top bit must be rolled off to some extent. How much is rolled off, though, depends on the magnitude of the filter envelope(if any). If only I could hear that part more clearly, it'd be a lot easier to determine.
But that right there will get you in the ballpark.
The next consideration is modulation... One of the 3 oscillators is capable of being used as an LFO, likely tied to the mod wheel, to modulate either all-oscillators pitch(I'm guessing) or filter cutoff or amp. I suspect only one at a time, but I don't know which.
There's also a pitchbend, which if utilized deftly could remove the need to tie an LFO to pitch, and free it up for amp or filter cutoff.
As far as I can tell, it doesn't utilize velocity modulations...? Don't know for sure.
And if any key-tracking is built in, then it's hard wired. But I didn't read anything regarding keytracking, so I suppose none. If there was, it'd probably affect the filter cutoff.
Anyways, this comes together to illustrate that modulation was probably not extensive, and expressiveness was achieved manually.
So yeah, probably a simple patch, since the features aren't particularly huge. But then again, how much of the magic comes from the patch, and how much comes from the player? You can be the judge of that...
Hope that helped. I'm as interested in this recreation as you are, so I'd be keen to see if anyone else has thoughts.
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- KVRAF
- Topic Starter
- 1580 posts since 22 Apr, 2011 from The House of Zaid
yes yes yes.... I am going to mess about with Fabfilter Twin and see if I can get it close.
And yes I am talking about what I believe is the moog lead on the track, I love that sound! It's so simple yet it haunts me!
And yes I am talking about what I believe is the moog lead on the track, I love that sound! It's so simple yet it haunts me!
Has anybody ever really been far even as decided to use even go want to do look more like?
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- KVRAF
- 37415 posts since 14 Sep, 2002 from In teh net
This thread made me want to play Animals this afternoon