KVR Audio

SWAN808 · Post by **SWAN808** » Fri Aug 21, 2015 12:59 pm

I noticed the resurrection of the Diva vs Analogue thread below and thought this might be good timing...

Here are some tests for the KVRians to get their teeth into:

Nice and simple - can you tell which Synth is Diva and which is the OB8?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1QONS0iE5ho

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ca-vd1qwctY

Synth A and B are the same in both videos!

Please join in the fun and take a guess at which you think Diva is - Synth A or B?

I am also launching a preset pack based on the work done over the last year comparing and transfering sounds from my OB8. Included as well is 3 skin variations on the classic OB theme - giving a real OB style experience in the box

. There is a separate thread to discuss the pack here.

http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic ... 7&t=444725

Song Test Wav
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0ByOzK- ... sp=sharing

A/B Test wav
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0ByOzK- ... sp=sharing

Thanks and best wishes

chk071 · Post by **chk071** » Fri Aug 21, 2015 1:05 pm

The Beatles. 'nuff said.

But seriously, i found the discussion interesting too until it mutated into a discussion about music in general. I fiddled a bit with the Diva and Monark demo yesterday, and while i was first a bit surprised about the amount of filter distortion on Monark, i realized that it isn't as heavy as i first thought it was, and i was amazed how nice, detailed, punchy, snappy, and meaty Monark is. To be totally honest, i found that Diva didn't really stand up to it. Compared with Monark, i found it was a bit on the softsynthie side, i also found it to be a bit metallic in tone, dunno why that is. Don't want to bash, it's surely a good synth, but as a Minimoog emulation, i'd really prefer Monark. It's just nice.

otristan · Post by **otristan** » Fri Aug 21, 2015 1:06 pm

Looks like that A have more reverb than B

SWAN808 · Post by **SWAN808** » Fri Aug 21, 2015 1:08 pm

levels and reverb sends carefully matched...audible difference may be down to tonal difference in sound...

recursive one · Post by **recursive one** » Fri Aug 21, 2015 1:23 pm

I won't try to guess which is which, but A in most cases sounds (sligthly) better to me - that's all I can say.

wagtunes · Post by **wagtunes** » Fri Aug 21, 2015 1:23 pm

Video 1, not a clue.

Video 2, I liked the pad on test 8 a little better for B than A. It had a little richer bottom. So I will say that for video 2, B is the OB and A is Diva.

But honestly, there is so little difference it just reaffirms my feelings that there just isn't a whole lotta difference between today's soft synths (the really good ones) and the $3,000 monsters from 30 plus years ago.

But that's just me and that's all I'm saying on the subject in this thread because I've more than had my fill of this discussion from the last knock down drag out.

Please announce the winner in the title of the thread when you've finally decided to reveal which is which. I am curious.

SWAN808 · Post by **SWAN808** » Fri Aug 21, 2015 1:29 pm

I will announce the result for sure!

Anyone interested in detailed analysis can download the wavs and use in an ABX software...I use this one:

http://lacinato.com/cm/software/othersoft/abx

Synthetic Wav · Post by **Synthetic Wav** » Fri Aug 21, 2015 1:30 pm

Synth B sound clearly better in both . A is muddy /dark and i really don't like this , but it's more 3d and phat while b is more punchy in the attack and in front that make me think it's diva.these day i don't like too dark sounding synth, i like more big bandwich for details so i pick B as my fav would not be surprised if it's diva and A hardware and i would love to be right

To me these test are flawded cause these involve someone programing..raw oscillators, filter sweeps , audio rate modulations and measurments say more, but this test show these don't sound the same there is some clear differences .

about diva vs analog , i think there is some difference, specially in 3d/ depth and audiorate modulation, but i do' t have any of the hardware diva emulate so can't compare..and like i stated i m more a fan of some modern analog stuff these day, more versatile with big bandwitch for details.

tal 101 can sound great too, it would be intresting to compare to a 101.

IncarnateX · Post by **IncarnateX** » Fri Aug 21, 2015 1:32 pm

Since I am not one of the analog-is-soooo-superior Guys, I'd gladly take a shot:

A is OB8, B is Diva.

But I frankly think that the sound in form of an end product is the least factor for analog madness. It is probably more about working with a hardware synth you "know" is- and looks like an analog and therefore MUST radiate (imaginary) lightbeams of analog magic.

Do not set expectations too high though; when it comes to actually testing, the analog purists tend to leave the scene like sailors from a spouse invaded whorehouse

Very nice production BTW. Sounds pro all over

otristan · Post by **otristan** » Fri Aug 21, 2015 1:32 pm

I prefer Synth A because it has more high end while Synth B has more bottom.
But it's really a matter of taste. I don't hear one which would be lamer than the other.

my 2 cents

2ZrgE · Post by **2ZrgE** » Fri Aug 21, 2015 1:35 pm

wagtunes wrote: Please announce the winner in the title of the thread when you've finally decided to reveal which is which. I am curious.

In a way completely useless because with a simple A/B test you could be right just be guessing.

You have to do proper ABX testing for that, but what for?

And the 'golden ear' people still will find excuses if they cannot proper distinguish...but those people never do ABX tests (and why not?)

Z1202 · Post by **Z1202** » Fri Aug 21, 2015 1:48 pm

What I'd like to warn people against is drawing a universal conclusion from this test like "Diva is as good as analog" or "Diva is worse than analog" or "Diva is better than analog".

In regards to the sounds present in the AB (I listened to about the first 3), both sound okay to me, except I seem to prefer A. However, as I mentioned in the other thread, I'm looking for a more extreme sounds which can be used to enrich the song texture. The examples were also brought up in the other thread. I believe that it is this area, which is by far still not covered by softsynths (AB counterexamples are welcome

)

Just in case you didn't notice the respective messages in the other thread. One example (audio-rate PWM):
http://vk.com/wall161447783_2956
The other one (sorry, I don't have it separately from the song) is the whistling sound going over the verse starting at 1:35 and the "birds choir" sound (it's actually exactly the same sound) starting at 3:05 (abusing of the filter's artifacts):
http://vk.com/wall161447783_2950
Edit: the examples are from Reaktor and Monark, not from analog gear, they are just to illustrate the types of sound I'm looking for.
Edit2: as for the AB, didn't realize that the first video is also an AB (didn't even open it), my comments refer to the second video.

IncarnateX · Post by **IncarnateX** » Fri Aug 21, 2015 1:49 pm

2ZrgE wrote: In a way completely useless because with a simple A/B test you could be right just be guessing.

Sure with only two choices a hit could be pure chance. However, a miss by an analog preacher man could still be embarrasing

JerGoertz · Post by **JerGoertz** » Fri Aug 21, 2015 1:49 pm

A is the OB8
B is Diva

B sounded a bit more metallic/brittle in the high frequencies.

Overall though, they were very close and hardly worth worrying about in most situations, esp. in the context of a mix.

fluffy_little_something · Fri Aug 21, 2015 2:00 pm

Hard to say, I would say A is the hardware. Sometimes I prefer A, sometimes B, but the patches are not exactly the same, especially in the second video. I think there is more bottom in A, but maybe it is just my imagination...
But it is so close that the difference is not worth thousands of dollars, even if I had to buy a powerful computer and soundcard

Would have been nice to include Arturia's SEM in the Oberheim comparison.

Diva vs Analogue - a real world test