Hans Zimmer online class.

[Perimeter Sound]

http://variety.com/2016/digital/news/ha ... 201922004/

^ I thought some Kvr folks might be interested in this. Apparently the mouse-head dj guy is doing one as well.

[Monade_Sounds]

This is a really interesting project that I hope will pick up and have success. The price is right too and it makes sens to have these "high end" online classes now that the technology makes music/film creation more accessible.

[funky lime]

I wonder how many mic positions will be sampled for that HZ class ...

[jancivil]

"...and all you need is a computer to make music."

Then you don't need this class, or any other training or experiences.


In the trailer, he's saying '4 french horns on the right, 4 french horns on the left and they're up in a gallery, way up above the orchestra' - but the thrust is anyone can do this... on an iPad. Ok then.
There's your Hans Zimmer "bold idea", which takes a lot of muscle to execute.

Zimmer has his moments but the kind of most surprising thing to me here is how perfectly conventional he can sound - just like a real composer - with 'no formal training', just a guy from a rock band. (there's no facetious font for that, sorry)
That said I admire what he did for The Joker music with that cellist and some processing and (I had no idea who the composer was when I watched the movie) the music at the climax, near the end of Man of Steel amounts to I think fantastic writing. I wouldn't hold out terrific hopes for your 90 bucks worth here, this is a hustle.

[koolkeys]

"...and all you need is a computer to make music."

Then you don't need this class, or any other training or experiences.

Maybe taking things a little too literally here? The entire basis of the teaser video is to say that it isn't the latest and greatest technology and live orchestras that make a great score. It is the user telling a story. Obviously, there is more to it than that.

In the trailer, he's saying '4 french horns on the right, 4 french horns on the left and they're up in a gallery, way up above the orchestra' - but the thrust is anyone can do this... on an iPad. Ok then.
There's your Hans Zimmer "bold idea", which takes a lot of muscle to execute.

Again, too literally. He even played the horn part on the computer using samples right after that. And sure, you can do that on an iPad. But again, the point being made is that people think you have to have a huge setup and live orchestra to make a great score. He is only saying that you don't. You just need some creativity in telling a story. Basically, not to limit yourself.

Zimmer has his moments but the kind of most surprising thing to me here is how perfectly conventional he can sound - just like a real composer - with 'no formal training', just a guy from a rock band. (there's no facetious font for that, sorry)
That said I admire what he did for The Joker music with that cellist and some processing and (I had no idea who the composer was when I watched the movie) the music at the climax, near the end of Man of Steel amounts to I think fantastic writing. I wouldn't hold out terrific hopes for your 90 bucks worth here, this is a hustle.

Kind of unfair, don't you think? I'm sure he isn't going to tell you everything he knows about composing and you will still need to practice. But I would almost guarantee you will get $90 in value out of it.

I have no idea how the course will be. I haven't taken any of the others from that site either. But I think it has potential to really inspire somebody and show them how you can do a lot with a modest setup as long as your mindset is right. It may not be for everyone, but it certainly doesn't appear to be a hustle, IMO.

Brent

[topaz]

It would be great if you could contribute some of your immense musical knowledge, experience and talent with the world.

YouTube videos would be super cool, studio insights, some cool theory lessons, maybe some fly in the wall videos of some of your many sessions for film, TV, etc.

Close up keyboard tips, runs, fingering etc.

Free would be wicked, but of course I'm sure donations would be an option once people see how amazing they are.

Thanks in advance

"...and all you need is a computer to make music."

Then you don't need this class, or any other training or experiences.


In the trailer, he's saying '4 french horns on the right, 4 french horns on the left and they're up in a gallery, way up above the orchestra' - but the thrust is anyone can do this... on an iPad. Ok then.
There's your Hans Zimmer "bold idea", which takes a lot of muscle to execute.

Zimmer has his moments but the kind of most surprising thing to me here is how perfectly conventional he can sound - just like a real composer - with 'no formal training', just a guy from a rock band. (there's no facetious font for that, sorry)
That said I admire what he did for The Joker music with that cellist and some processing and (I had no idea who the composer was when I watched the movie) the music at the climax, near the end of Man of Steel amounts to I think fantastic writing. I wouldn't hold out terrific hopes for your 90 bucks worth here, this is a hustle.

[jancivil]

It would be great if you could contribute some of your immense musical knowledge, experience and talent with the world.

So I shan't dare type any critique of the approach here? Why is that, is Hans Zimmer that sacred to you? You've set the bar terrifically high for one's worthiness before they can critique... what to me is just another musician. You may be wholly unaware of this, but a lot of composers think very poorly of Hans Zimmer. Go to VSL Forums and post a Hans Zimmer fanboi topic and watch what happens.

My signature here is a link to my music, like it matters here in the least. I could tell you numerous stories of my life in music and my own propers, but guess what? I don't feel the slightest need to justify myself to you. Who are you to talk to me that way, for that matter. There's no real need to get personal, I gave Zimmer his props according to my view anyway.

[jancivil]

"...and all you need is a computer to make music."

Then you don't need this class, or any other training or experiences.

Maybe taking things a little too literally here? The entire basis of the teaser video is to say that it isn't the latest and greatest technology and live orchestras that make a great score. It is the user telling a story. Obviously, there is more to it than that.

What I am saying there, via examples of what he literally said, is that what I hear is rhetoric.
Then, he does a very conventional gesture in minor, hits the tonic down in the bass register fortissimo and says: "It's just satisfying", with great lust for his own brand basically.

In the trailer, he's saying '4 french horns on the right, 4 french horns on the left and they're up in a gallery, way up above the orchestra' - but the thrust is anyone can do this... on an iPad. Ok then.
There's your Hans Zimmer "bold idea", which takes a lot of muscle to execute.

Again, too literally. He even played the horn part on the computer using samples right after that. And sure, you can do that on an iPad.

No, actually you can't. To get that much sound going you need (and that's the thing) a great deal more muscle.

But again, the point being made is that people think you have to have a huge setup and live orchestra to make a great score. He is only saying that you don't. You just need some creativity in telling a story. Basically, not to limit yourself.

And here is the cognitive dissonance, which you appear to share with Herr Zimmer.
IE: He's in this lavish room (his own) with the absolute best gear money can buy and this is the schtick. No, that don't work. It pains me to have to explain that. Also, do you feel that creativity can be taught? There's the con.

Zimmer has his moments but the kind of most surprising thing to me here is how perfectly conventional he can sound - just like a real composer - with 'no formal training', just a guy from a rock band. (there's no facetious font for that, sorry)
That said I admire what he did for The Joker music with that cellist and some processing and (I had no idea who the composer was when I watched the movie) the music at the climax, near the end of Man of Steel amounts to I think fantastic writing. I wouldn't hold out terrific hopes for your 90 bucks worth here, this is a hustle.

Kind of unfair, don't you think? I'm sure he isn't going to tell you everything he knows about composing and you will still need to practice. But I would almost guarantee you will get $90 in value out of it.

I have no idea how the course will be. I haven't taken any of the others from that site either. But I think it has potential to really inspire somebody and show them how you can do a lot with a modest setup as long as your mindset is right. It may not be for everyone, but it certainly doesn't appear to be a hustle, IMO.

You "have no idea", but you would "almost guarantee $90 in value". Alrighty then.
No, I don't think that's 'unfair'. I watched the trailer and that's what I think. A trailers intent is to put the very best foot possible forward and this was kind of hilarious.

Now there will be people for whom 90 bucks is nothing, but that's not me.
There are people who will dismiss Zimmer for the lack of conservatory training and for being in rock bands etc. I'm not one of them, in case y'all missed 'facetious' there.

[koolkeys]

What I am saying there, via examples of what he literally said, is that what I hear is rhetoric.
Then, he does a very conventional gesture in minor, hits the tonic down in the bass register fortissimo and says: "It's just satisfying", with great lust for his own brand basically.

Well, hard to say what the full clip goes over in context. This was a teaser video with very short clips. So we really can't say how deep he goes, can we?

Nothing wrong with lusting after your own brand if it is a good one.

In the trailer, he's saying '4 french horns on the right, 4 french horns on the left and they're up in a gallery, way up above the orchestra' - but the thrust is anyone can do this... on an iPad. Ok then.
There's your Hans Zimmer "bold idea", which takes a lot of muscle to execute.

Again, too literally. He even played the horn part on the computer using samples right after that. And sure, you can do that on an iPad.

No, actually you can't. To get that much sound going you need (and that's the thing) a great deal more muscle.

Well, yes, if you want to play higher end instruments. But what I'm saying is that the idea behind it is to get people out of thinking they need the best equipment to make great compositions. I don't think he is saying that you can create AAA film score quality work on an iPad. The purpose of his comments seem to suggest convincing people to get rid of excuses and focus on being creative and telling a story.

And here is the cognitive dissonance, which you appear to share with Herr Zimmer.
IE: He's in this lavish room (his own) with the absolute best gear money can buy and this is the schtick. No, that don't work. It pains me to have to explain that. Also, do you feel that creativity can be taught? There's the con.

Yes, creativity can be taught. I wasn't born knowing music theory or how chords fit together. I learned it, and it opened up a world of ideas. You can teach people techniques they can put together and be creative with. Teach somebody how to properly structure and craft an arrangement based on the things film producers are looking for, and they can surely build on that and be creative. Both talent and creativity can be taught, and learned.

It doesn't matter if he is in his nice studio. That is irrelevant.

You "have no idea", but you would "almost guarantee $90 in value". Alrighty then.
No, I don't think that's 'unfair'. I watched the trailer and that's what I think. A trailers intent is to put the very best foot possible forward and this was kind of hilarious.

You're probably not the target audience though. No, I don't know exactly how the course will be. But I know based on research that it will be several hours long (around 5 hours of video), plus it comes with 47 pages of supplemental material and some exercises for the student to participate in. And I know I have heard pretty good things about the other courses offered on the site (though I haven't heard reviews from all of them, only a few). So my hunch, based on common sense, is that you will almost certainly get $90 in value. But again, you may not be their audience for this course (neither would I). But I would bet that the evidence that you will get value far outweighs the evidence that you won't.

My main point though is that it's probably a bit unfair to think they are just trying to get one over on people. Sure, for $90 you aren't going to drain the brain of Hanz Zimmer and come away creating scores that have AAA producers knocking on your door. But I don't think they are claiming that. If the course can inspire somebody to think differently, and to stop trying to produce music and start trying to tell a story, I think they have succeeded. I think that is the real goal of the course.

YMMV. I could be wrong. IMHO. All that as disclaimer.

Brent

[koolkeys]

It would be great if you could contribute some of your immense musical knowledge, experience and talent with the world.

So I shan't dare type any critique of the approach here? Why is that, is Hans Zimmer that sacred to you? You've set the bar terrifically high for one's worthiness before they can critique... what to me is just another musician. You may be wholly unaware of this, but a lot of composers think very poorly of Hans Zimmer. Go to VSL Forums and post a Hans Zimmer fanboi topic and watch what happens.

Though to be fair, there are places where he has a great deal of respect. And there are places full of professional composers who think very poorly of the VSL libraries (I own many and like them, but there are many people who do not).

I think that what any particular forum thinks of him is pretty irrelevant considering his body of work and success in the industry are almost unmatched (whether he deserves it or not). I'm guessing he doesn't care one bit, lol. Many people like to dog on those with more success than they have.

With that being said, I don't think there is anything wrong with critiquing Zimmer. He isn't perfect and his work doesn't appeal to everyone. Nothing wrong with debating that. Whether your work "matches up" or not is completely irrelevant and shouldn't be a pre-cursor to whether you can critique a person or not.

Brent

[elxsound]

Hmm... Yeah it was a teaser video, meant to gain interest in purchasing, so an editor (who is most likely not a composer) was probably looking for "buzz" words to make the teaser exciting. Considering it's probably 4-5 hours of content, don't expect any part of it to be in context.

Hard to fault HZ for the buzz words in a teaser.

I think many will find the course worth $90. I doubt the class is meant to turn people into him, and as he's stated on Reddit, as well as on the VSL forums (paraphrasing) people should find their own sound.

[kevvvvv]

HZ is touring Europe next Summer.

I hope to book tomorrow to see him in Nimes Arena on Jun 24th.

The criticisms that have be levelled at Hans could easily be levelled in a similar sort of way at John Lennon.

Both did common gestures and both had unusual twists.

Both captured popular imagination for years & years.

And both made millions from the buying public.

I'll probably pop for the $90 as it's reasonable, and I quite like the "suggestive" way he speaks and makes his points.

I'm sure I'll learn something.

This is his latest, theme from The Crown.

Nice build for a 1m 24s window, and the opening "early moog" chords were inspired

[jancivil]

It would be great if you could contribute some of your immense musical knowledge, experience and talent with the world.

So I shan't dare type any critique of the approach here? Why is that, is Hans Zimmer that sacred to you? You've set the bar terrifically high for one's worthiness before they can critique... what to me is just another musician. You may be wholly unaware of this, but a lot of composers think very poorly of Hans Zimmer. Go to VSL Forums and post a Hans Zimmer fanboi topic and watch what happens.

Though to be fair, there are places where he has a great deal of respect. And there are places full of professional composers who think very poorly of the VSL libraries (I own many and like them, but there are many people who do not).

I think that what any particular forum thinks of him is pretty irrelevant considering his body of work and success in the industry are almost unmatched (whether he deserves it or not). I'm guessing he doesn't care one bit, lol. Many people like to dog on those with more success than they have.

With that being said, I don't think there is anything wrong with critiquing Zimmer. He isn't perfect and his work doesn't appeal to everyone. Nothing wrong with debating that. Whether your work "matches up" or not is completely irrelevant and shouldn't be a pre-cursor to whether you can critique a person or not.

Brent

I absolutely did not say that some opinion is crucial or even particularly meaningful. There is context in everything I did there, which seems to be missing in the replies to.
Just sayin'; "topaz" challenged me personally due to my having something to say about the approach I saw. Not everyone worships Hans Zimmer.

I never heard of him before someone asked over to Music Theory board about the low brass in some music to the film Inception. Turns out he beefs up the bottom there with some synth. And why not?

Beyond that, I know I heard Zimmer's music in that Batman picture and Man of Steel. I saw the latter twice, I knew he'd scored it the second time. I noticed only the bit near the end my first viewing I suppose because he does such a conventional job. I paid a little bit more attention to the score the second time. It's exactly what would be expected of the music for that film IME.

I don't have any problem with 'the quality of Hans Zimmer music', just that the promo for this course signaled to me a waste of 90 bucks.
& Note Well, I don't 'fault HZ for the...' editor's choices in the trailer. I do find him kind of comical and I bet I would have that reaction to him in more than that bit. I also have a jaded view of promoting "you can just be creative!" as a selling point. I can advise you of that for $9 or less, you know.

Never mind me, carry on.

[jancivil]

And here is the cognitive dissonance, which you appear to share with Herr Zimmer.
IE: He's in this lavish room (his own) with the absolute best gear money can buy and this is the schtick. No, that don't work. It pains me to have to explain that. Also, do you feel that creativity can be taught? There's the con.

Yes, creativity can be taught. I wasn't born knowing music theory or how chords fit together. I learned it, and it opened up a world of ideas. You can teach people techniques they can put together and be creative with. Teach somebody how to properly structure and craft an arrangement based on the things film producers are looking for, and they can surely build on that and be creative. Both talent and creativity can be taught, and learned.

It doesn't matter if he is in his nice studio. That is irrelevant.

'information' ≠ 'creativity'. nor does knowledge even amount to creativity. You can teach all of the above all day long and forever and the creativity comes from within or it doesn't. So, if the course is all of that (such as you would get at say Berklee over several yrs), 90 bucks is a hell of a bargain, isn't it. The trailer and promo materials did something else, tho' and we'll take the course's value rather on faith (or not).

Hey, maybe it's just me that found talking about making music on an iPad in that setting funny. To me, the contradiction is obvious.

[kevvvvv]

To be fair, a lot of movie soundtrack is kind of filler for the action, and not that inspiring on its own.

eg the big colosseum battle scene in Gladiator sounds enthralling in the movie with Russell Crowe waving his sword and whatnot, and facing down Emperor Joaquin Phoenix

- but less so as a soundtrack in it's own right.

But somehow the 3 or 4 crucial bars still stick in my head.