Hello,
Usually, I set up three instances of Shreddage 2:
2 rhythm guitars (hard panned left and right) and 1 lead guitar (center)
This setup works fine with parts where only rhythm guitars play.
However, when the lead guitar sets in it turns muddy or starts sounding thin :/
So, is it better two mute one of the rhythm guitars when the lead kicks in? Do you have any suggestions two separate rhytm and lead guitars without making them sounding muddy or thin?
Thx in advance
Rhythm and lead guitar separation
-
- KVRAF
- 44230 posts since 11 Aug, 2008 from clown world
You could have the lead playing in a different octave to the rhythm.
This is the same method MJ used when he was working on Anthony Marinelli's Thriller.
-
- KVRAF
- 1724 posts since 31 Dec, 2004 from betwixt
Agreed w/ Aloysius - arrangement is the most important
An audible example would help narrow down issues
I'm not familiar with Shreddage nor what you might be using for amplification, and what you're using for bass.
Are the rhythm guitars double-tracked (Two different recorded performances of the same notes)? If not, double-tracking instantly helps solve this muddiness problem.
Also - if high-gain, moderate to high tempo with palm-mutes, might look into the Sneap multiband compression (Basically use a multiband compressor only on the 80hz to 260hz (or so) region of the rhythm guitar).
High pass filter on the lead guitar, as high up as possible without losing the sound you want.
Don't be afraid to brighten up the lead with high shelf or gentle bell, 3-8 khz region. On its own it might sound weird. Simultaneously cutting a bit of that (narrower Q) on the rhythm guitars when the lead plays (use automation) might help also.
Keep the lead in mono, panned center and if there is stereo delay or chorus, try high-pass on those, "muddy sound" can accumulate in feedback in delays and reverbs.
If reverb, high pass it much higher than seems right. 500hz even.
Hope this is helpful!
An audible example would help narrow down issues
I'm not familiar with Shreddage nor what you might be using for amplification, and what you're using for bass.
Are the rhythm guitars double-tracked (Two different recorded performances of the same notes)? If not, double-tracking instantly helps solve this muddiness problem.
Also - if high-gain, moderate to high tempo with palm-mutes, might look into the Sneap multiband compression (Basically use a multiband compressor only on the 80hz to 260hz (or so) region of the rhythm guitar).
High pass filter on the lead guitar, as high up as possible without losing the sound you want.
Don't be afraid to brighten up the lead with high shelf or gentle bell, 3-8 khz region. On its own it might sound weird. Simultaneously cutting a bit of that (narrower Q) on the rhythm guitars when the lead plays (use automation) might help also.
Keep the lead in mono, panned center and if there is stereo delay or chorus, try high-pass on those, "muddy sound" can accumulate in feedback in delays and reverbs.
If reverb, high pass it much higher than seems right. 500hz even.
Hope this is helpful!
-
- KVRer
- Topic Starter
- 4 posts since 15 Jul, 2015
Thanks so far!
Does anybody know how to set shreddage to mono? Is it possible within Kontakt?
That's what I usually do, so this is most probably not the culprit.Aloysius wrote:You could have the lead playing in a different octave to the rhythm.
I put an eq before chorus but haven't thought about putting one after it. Gonna test it.Codestation wrote: Keep the lead in mono, panned center and if there is stereo delay or chorus, try high-pass on those, "muddy sound" can accumulate in feedback in delays and reverbs.
Does anybody know how to set shreddage to mono? Is it possible within Kontakt?
-
- KVRAF
- 5120 posts since 30 Aug, 2012 from Sweden
As a guitarist I picked up how the pro's do in the studio: use another guitar for leads with different pickups or at least use another amp. Since you don't use a real guitar but Shreddage, which I'm not familiar with but it's DI's correct? If so use another amp from ampsims for the leads. When it comes to mixing you should always strive for as much as good seperation in sounds before you even start to touch any EQ. Fix it in the mix doesn't work okey? It's a myth. Yes a little more highpass on leads than on rythm guitars. How much differ from track to track and how much bass there is on the lead amp. Start to highpass until it starts to thin out and back it again till you are satisfied. Cut out annoying frequencies as you did on rythm tracks. And another thing pro's will tell you about leads: treat them like a voice. Oh and another thing. You do lowpass on rythm tracks too?
-
- KVRAF
- 26033 posts since 20 Oct, 2007 from gonesville
Narrow the stereo field for most things in your mix. Have the lead occupy a different space than the rhythm. A synth pad you might want to go full stereo, if not more than 100% of 'the room', but discrete instruments should not (do not) do that. IE: in a room, the amp(s) of these guys won't be eating all of the space, to begin with.
Are they stereo amps to begin with? (I mean per the real life scenario you'll be imitating. Shreddage probably is totally stereo by default.)
(And, make your drums mono or if that's more trouble than you want, narrow them considerable. For instance, cymbals all at full stereo (as most stereo instrument plugins start out as) make mixing just problematic.)
Are they stereo amps to begin with? (I mean per the real life scenario you'll be imitating. Shreddage probably is totally stereo by default.)
(And, make your drums mono or if that's more trouble than you want, narrow them considerable. For instance, cymbals all at full stereo (as most stereo instrument plugins start out as) make mixing just problematic.)