Maschine goes 64-bit only

[foosnark]

I mean, I could say:

It's 2018, why isn't there a 64-bit version of ET-301?
It's 2018, why isn't there another delay plugin that works as well as ET-301?
It's 2018, why isn't there a way to load 32-bit DLLs in 64-bit applications in Windows?
It's 2018, why don't VST host developes figure out a way to support 32-bit plugins?
It's 2018, why doesn't jBridge work consistently?
It's 2018, why aren't we using 128-bit OSs?
It's 2018, why aren't we using quantum computers?

[pc2000]

Yep, Maschine Mk1 is no longer supported on the lastest Mac OS (High Sierra). Mk1 isn't class compliant and NI can't be bothered to update their drivers. I would've hoped they would continue to support MK1 until the release of Version 3 of the software, but this is NI, so

Not surprised- considering Apple is constantly breaking compatibility with seemingly every OS update. Has to be a major pita for developers expected to keep up with Apple's shenanigans!

[Guenon]

It's 2018, why aren't we using 128-bit OSs?

Like I mentioned in another thread on this, at some point this winter: joking or hinting or implying that "64 bit will have to give way to 128 bit at some point anyway, hehe" is another one of those "unless you're Hans Zimmer" types of lines, at heart. Yeah, I get it, it's just in jest, etc etc... But sometimes it's presented as if it had a grain of truth in it, so I repeat:

32 bit memory addressing allows for 4 GB of address space, 64 bit addressing allows for 16 million terabytes. It's 2018 and we are using 64 bit addressing because 4 GB has become limiting in many use cases, and 64 bit addressing both remedies that and is future proof. That is, it's 2018 and 16 million terabytes of RAM is quite a bit into the future . Mentioning 128 bits is similar to the common "Hans Zimmer" quip in that it just presents an extreme example as if it was related to the matter in a particular way, but in reality it's related in a very different manner.

This isn't about needing more than 16 million terabytes of memory, or utilizing a whole new physical paradigm for computing, or having to do the heaviest Hollywood soundtrack productions there absolutely is. It's just that, in a very everyday and routine way, some tasks need more memory than 4 GB. And that's where the majority is headed. This doesn't mean that your productions are somehow worse if you don't happen to need more than that.

[jancivil]

---

[parma]

Yep, Maschine Mk1 is no longer supported on the lastest Mac OS (High Sierra). Mk1 isn't class compliant and NI can't be bothered to update their drivers. I would've hoped they would continue to support MK1 until the release of Version 3 of the software, but this is NI, so

Not surprised- considering Apple is constantly breaking compatibility with seemingly every OS update. Has to be a major pita for developers expected to keep up with Apple's shenanigans!

I agree that Apple is ridiculous with their constant updates and it must be annoying for developers. However, I don't think it would take much for NI to update the drivers if they wanted to. They just don't want to. One of the problems inherent in computer-dependent controllers - you are always at the mercy of the developers.

[foosnark]

So a few details about how this transition is working out:

-- I came up with a list of the plugins I still care about. Longer than I thought, but much shorter than the number of plugins I have installed.

-- 32- and 64-bit versions of Maschine share the same database and settings, which means the 64-bit version was full of stuff it can't load. (I have the habit of saving one preset per plugin, so I can take advantage of the browser's tagging and search and so they're not listed by developer rather than by name.) So it's time to clean up. Maschine doesn't have a way to do that, except individually selecting each item, right-clicking it, choosing "Delete", mousing over to the confirmation dialog and clicking "OK"... a couple of hundred times. Screw that. I found the relevant database files and moved them.

-- I haven't been consistent about installing both versions of everything, because I didn't need to until now. So the next step, just begun before I had to go work: figure out what I've got installed already in my 64-bit folder.

-- Some of the missing items might exist in my 32-bit folder, since some developers throw a thing32.dll and a thing64.dll into the same place. So I'll need to identify those and move them.

-- Some of the missing items have installers I saved locally. I'll run those, and then have to find and download the rest.

-- Where there's no 64-bit version, I need to try jBridge (though as I've said before, it failed in the past).

-- Where that doesn't work, I'll need to find substitutes.

-- Some of the plugins I wrote myself, I never bothered to build for 64-bit. So I need to do that too.

[BBFG#]

Their increased indifference combined with my ISPs' manipulation of usage has me looking to drop as much of the NI line as I can. Where Maschine fails for me is the hardware. Good as it is, it looks to me as of they plan on building a very short obselesence into them.

Wondering which drum program I should start considering to replace it now.

[parma]

Their increased indifference combined with my ISPs' manipulation of usage has me looking to drop as much of the NI line as I can. Where Maschine fails for me is the hardware. Good as it is, it looks to me as of they plan on building a very short obselesence into them.

Wondering which drum program I should start considering to replace it now.

Depends on your definition of "very short". To be fair, Mk1 has been around for nine years. What gets me is that the original hardware is still usable with the current software. They're sort of artificially end-of-lifing Mk1 by not updating their drivers (at least on Mac). I would think that updating the driver to be compliant with High Sierra would be a fairly trivial investment. Oh well.

[EvilDragon]

They didn't update Kore 2 drivers ever since it was discontinued and Kore 2 still works on High Sierra, believe it or not...

[TheKid]

NI will soon drop the support for Maschine 1 hardware, too.

Where did you hear this one from?
rsp

Talked to two NI reps at a big music store. Nice, decent guys but bad news for my old Maschine. They didn't say when exactly though but it will happen.

[foosnark]

After several hours of fighting, here's where I stand:

There were 29 plugins that I still care about which didn't already have 64-bit versions installed. I have resolved 19 of them so far.

- Had to install Melda stuff twice because the installer ate previous versions that were already installed. On the bright side, the new version of MTransformer is better.

- Waves installs both 32- and 64-bit versions in the 32-bit folder. Once I figured that out, I added another folder to Maschine's search paths.

- I still have to redownload 4 different Unfiltered Audio 64-bit installers from Plugin Alliance.

- Toneboosters is frankly a goddamned mess. The installers place multiple versions of things in multiple folders. Licenses don't include upgrades (which given the low prices and the significant new features in some of those upgrades, is understandable, but complicates this process).

I don't have 64-bit installers for the versions of Flx and Equalizer which I have licenses for, and those versions aren't available for download. So in effect, I don't own them anymore.

However, Equalizer 4 could replace them both for 30 Euros. It has dynamic EQ features and in many ways is more sophisticated than Flx -- I'm just not sure I like its interface as much for the dynamic stuff. I'll have to think about this.

- I will have to recompile my Fnord noise generator for 64 bits. I decided not to care about my own other plugins (MTransformer replaces one of them anyway).

- There are no 64-bit versions available for the following:

-- OtiumFX BassLane: I installed GMonoBass instead.
-- dfx MonoMaker: MSED will take its place.
-- ET-301: one of my favorite character delays and the interface is friendly and simple. If jBridge doesn't work I have a list of other BBD-ish delays to try out, most of which cost money, but it's possible none of them will be quite right. (Also, given that I'm going to be getting the Behringer Neutron which has an analog BBD onboard, I'm not inclined to pay for a simulated one unless it's especially great.)
-- Space360: useful for putting sounds behind the listener's head, or modulating speaker/head position to swirl things around. If jBridge doesn't work, I'm not aware of a good substitute that isn't also 32-bit only.
-- ThrillseekerXTC: about 1/3 of the time when I drop it in, it automatically makes everything 15% better, in ways most similar plugins just don't seem to. Hoping again for jBridge.

This has not been the most fun evening, and I'm not done fixing this yet.

[pc2000]

NI will soon drop the support for Maschine 1 hardware, too.

Where did you hear this one from?
rsp

Talked to two NI reps at a big music store. Nice, decent guys but bad news for my old Maschine. They didn't say when exactly though but it will happen.

I suppose there's a few ways to look at the situation. When you consider how long Win-Xp remained in service-and the fact there's a fan-base still using it currently, although it's a legacy OS that some will use until their dying day... shows that some people will simply not move forward unless forced.

I'm certain the MK1 hardware will still work, but NI won't be making any new modifiers for it. The fact they're adding more features to the software that recently included real-time audio stretching and eventually audio tracks (likely when 3.0 eventually drops) it's probably not practical or maybe impossible to continue adding new modifiers for the old HW- when Studio and MK3 have more dedicated buttons for various functions.

If there's a bright side to consider... at least the software can be used without the HW.

[swatwork]

- Toneboosters is frankly a goddamned mess. The installers place multiple versions of things in multiple folders. Licenses don't include upgrades (which given the low prices and the significant new features in some of those upgrades, is understandable, but complicates this process).

I don't have 64-bit installers for the versions of Flx and Equalizer which I have licenses for, and those versions aren't available for download. So in effect, I don't own them anymore.

I've never used the installer but ToneBoosters also comes in a portable version which is just a zip file so you can copy the plugins to wherever you want.

64-bit versions of Flx and Equalizer are included in the portable package (in the VST2 BusTools and TrackEssentials folders).

Older versions can be had from archive.org here:
http://web.archive.org/web/201611211624 ... /download/

[Cinebient]

I wonder where the drama comes from?
No one is forced to update or buy new hard- and software.
Freeze yourself and use just what you have from now on.
For nostalgia you even can buy the old Super-Nintendo, Sega Mega Drive and Atari in a new smaller form with tons of the original games included.
I‘m sure there will be something for 32 bit music producers as well.
People can fight against windmills until they die....it won‘t change anything.
We all should put not too much power in complaining. Something i learned at work that there comes the day you just have to give up or you will stay alone.....

[foosnark]

Older versions can be had from archive.org here:

I appreciate the thought, but the download links just give error 403.