cuts. as in, not the whole. (math based randomness)

[vurt]

http://www.viablehybrid.com/vurt/testtu ... 8%2018.mp3

http://www.viablehybrid.com/vurt/testtu ... 8%2018.mp3

couple of excerpts of generative patch from yesterday. occasional parameter tweaks but mostly just the sound of the machine, even the tempo changes are controlled by the lfos and sequencer.
four outputs in to 4 separate replika delays.

the whole session is about 3 hours of recordings

[wagtunes]

My Feedback (http://www.viablehybrid.com/vurt/testtu ... 8%2018.mp3)

Weirdness - 9.5
Noise Generation - 10
Performance - 8.5
Mix - 10

Overall - 9.5

Comments: This is cool. Reminds me of some of the stuff that Jancivil posted. This could so be soundtrack stuff for some mystery movie or some other such weirdness. Love the stereo on this one. I would love to see how you set this all up.

[vurt]

no pictures! im not sharing my secrets!!!
or rather, it's no longer in the same state as it was, lots of "what if i change that to there?" moments since these recordings, it's now such a tangled mess you wouldn't see much anyway

however, it's not as complicated as it sounds. basically, 2 separate oscillator modules controlled by two different sequencers, running off different clocks

both modules have saw and sine waves (the sto also has a sub oscillator, more on him later...)
so 4 voices.
from start to finish each voice follows the same path, just along different modules.

so, oscillato to filter to vca number one, which i use to chop the long tones into more rhythmic patterns.
this is then fed to a vca mixer where longer lfos raise and lower the amplitude over time.
each voice then goes to a separate send/return module i usually use to get fx pedals in to patches.
panned and fxed in samplitude. recorded in guitar rig and posted to you good people's!

the main thing, is using different timings over the different voices for all controls.
i don't really have enough lfos yet to give each an individual lfo, so using a multiple and lfo will control on voice 1 the filter, voice 2 the vca mixer, the clock rate for one sequencer and maybe the pwm of one of the oscillators.

the sub oscillator from the sto was fed in to the fm of the cloud generator oscillator module.

i think that was it!

[wagtunes]

Cool. With a software based modular, I could probably achieve something like this and go beyond it quite easily given I'd have unlimited oscillators and LFOs. Might be an interesting experiment to try sometime. The problem is CPU use. To do what I'd want to do, especially in something like Softube, it would probably fry my computer. Of course I could just set up it, hope for the best without playing it back and then just render it to audio seeing what happens. Of course to do that, you really need to have a feel for what these setups do from visuals alone. Not sure I'm quite there yet, though I do have quite a bit of experience with the Softube West Coast stuff and have come up with some pretty weird compositions.

Anyway, it's something for me to think about and consider for a future project.

[vurt]

yeah, software can take you a lot further in that regard.the ability to just keep adding.

you could try it with softube, start with a single voice, get an idea how that looks without pushing the cpu. then just add variants of that first channel.

definitely worth a go.

[seismic1]

I liked both of 'em, but preferred the first one. It had more of a rhythmic interest for me, which suited my mood tonight. Replika? as in NI?

Good work

[sjm]

I would love to see how you set this all up.

I kind of share these sentiments; or maybe I'm really more interested in your methodology. An abridged video including your thoughts at various stages would be fascinating I'm sure.

I mean, I'm guessing you sort of futz around until you like what you're hearing and then tune that a bit more; then press play and record? Do you actually know what's going to come out at the end? How much work do you do with what you've recorded?

Or put it this way: I know what my creative process is for a standard song with melodies and a relatively standard structure. I'll work out the basic idea of a part, then develop it for different instruments etc. But this is a different kettle of fish. So I'm wondering how much of an intellectual process there is (like me going "the verse sounds a bit empty, let's add some piano") and how much is pure experimentation ("I wonder what happens if I put delay on everything" or "I'll try this take backwards" being among my favourites).

I know these things can sometimes be hard to put into words, because the process just kind of happens by itself. But how much is exploration, and how much is striding purposefully towards a preconceived goal? What are your thought processes?

I sometimes like making this sort of thing myself, and find myself getting lost in the moment a lot of the time, doing crazy shit. Then at some point, when I have something I like, I often find myself trying to bring in some structure to the chaos. At which point it becomes much more of an intellectual exercise. But there are also those one-off jams that just capture a moment, are absolutely directionless, and that I enjoy for their spontaneity.



This stuff doesn't half make your mind wander, eh?

[vurt]

ill answer more fully when i get to the computer rather than phone, however with regards the video idea. this is something ive been considering. not so much me explaining, but just showing what im doing.
the explanation addition might be a good idea for a few videos though.
need to arrange a camera of course, although im looking at upgrading my phone eventually, so that could work for basic video

[vurt]

I would love to see how you set this all up.

I kind of share these sentiments; or maybe I'm really more interested in your methodology. An abridged video including your thoughts at various stages would be fascinating I'm sure.

I mean, I'm guessing you sort of futz around until you like what you're hearing and then tune that a bit more; then press play and record? Do you actually know what's going to come out at the end? How much work do you do with what you've recorded??

there is a certain amount of knowing whats going to happen. the signal chain from oscillator to output is usually quite basic. its only when it comes to the modulation and timing things go a bit off predictable courses, even then only to a degree, ie i know if i increase the speed of this lfo its going to make that filter sweep more quickly...
although, the mess my cables are in sometimes im never sure which lfo im actually tweaking, so there is that element of wtf happened there?

as to how much work goes in to whats been recorded post recording, youre basically hearing it as it was recorded, even the replica fx are printed on the recording, which was done using the loop recorder in guitar rig on a master channel.

but then there are tracks, where i will record overdubs, rerecord, mix through, add midi stuff to, and get deeper in to.
sometimes though its just about having some fun and moving some air

Or put it this way: I know what my creative process is for a standard song with melodies and a relatively standard structure. I'll work out the basic idea of a part, then develop it for different instruments etc. But this is a different kettle of fish. So I'm wondering how much of an intellectual process there is (like me going "the verse sounds a bit empty, let's add some piano") and how much is pure experimentation ("I wonder what happens if I put delay on everything" or "I'll try this take backwards" being among my favourites).

there is some experimentation, but taking the delay example, we kind of have an idea whats going to happen if we add a delay, i think the experimentation comes from, how much feedback? or how long do i want this delay, or the biggy what happens if i tweak all these parameters while im recording
same with the modular, i know what each module does, i know what linking them together will do, i know what increasing any parameter will do, but if i bring in some machine randomness in the timing (its not true randomness really*) then it will yield a few surprises along the way, in the same way a simple delay can

backwards stuff is always cool!!!

*randomness : due to the fact its all just cycles, after some time if left alone it will repeat. but over the short term and with occasional tweaks it will sound random.
obviously subject to analogue drift, but its mostly pretty new builds so that's not an issue.

I know these things can sometimes be hard to put into words, because the process just kind of happens by itself. But how much is exploration, and how much is striding purposefully towards a preconceived goal? What are your thought processes?

does purposeful exploration toward a specific goal make sense?
in that im looking for interesting patches, combinations as i build the system.
the actual end goal being something i can plug in and play guitar along to. either for recording long form improvs or even for performing at the odd party n shit just to stop people asking me to perform at parties

I sometimes like making this sort of thing myself, and find myself getting lost in the moment a lot of the time, doing crazy shit. Then at some point, when I have something I like, I often find myself trying to bring in some structure to the chaos. At which point it becomes much more of an intellectual exercise. But there are also those one-off jams that just capture a moment, are absolutely directionless, and that I enjoy for their spontaneity.

the liking doing this is actually a bit of a problem for me. honestly, im having so much fun just playing around, im not actually "working" on anything concrete.
but then i am learning the instrument, which is i suppose part of the process, once i feel 100% or close to, maybe ill move on to more structured stuff again.

you write lyrics though, which require a particular structure. im lyrically disabled, 8 years olds poetry in mothers day cards has more merit than what i write (although i inspire awesome songs about me and rameau) so even my structured stuff rarely gets to an ababc type arrangement, because its not as important.

This stuff doesn't half make your mind wander, eh

thanks
if i can make even just one person think any thought, then im a mind controller

[vurt]

I liked both of 'em, but preferred the first one. It had more of a rhythmic interest for me, which suited my mood tonight. Replika? as in NI?

Good work

glad you enjoyed, thanks for listening

yep, the ni replika, the free one from a while back (i never upgraded)

[Tj Shredder]

yeah, software can take you a lot further in that regard.the ability to just keep adding.

you could try it with softube, start with a single voice, get an idea how that looks without pushing the cpu. then just add variants of that first channel.

definitely worth a go.

A hybrid could also be interesting. Bitwig is kind of a perfect companion to Modulars. You need something like this:
https://www.bitwig.com/en/18/ES-8.html
And get as many LFOs as the interface has outputs or you can use it completely different...

Nice tracks btw...
The nature of the beast would be a installation without beginning or end. If you replicate it in VCV it could be distributed as patch... Some extra LFOs mimik your live treatement...

[sjm]

if i can make even just one person think any thought, then im a mind controller

Not going to quote the whole thing, but thanks for the detailed reply. It also gave me food for thought. It's always interesting to find out how other people approach the business of making music.

[vurt]

A hybrid could also be interesting. Bitwig is kind of a perfect companion to Modulars. You need something like this:
https://www.bitwig.com/en/18/ES-8.html
And get as many LFOs as the interface has outputs or you can use it completely different...

that does look interesting, ive not got round to trying bitwig, always thought it does more than i need.
but for something like that it could be useful

Nice tracks btw...
The nature of the beast would be a installation without beginning or end. If you replicate it in VCV it could be distributed as patch... Some extra LFOs mimik your live treatement...

what an idiot am i? you know i never even considered that, even as a way of storing patches its cool!
ill have to see how close i can get to my rig with vcv!
thank you so much for such a simple but brilliant idea!!!

and thanks for listening

[vurt]

if i can make even just one person think any thought, then im a mind controller

Not going to quote the whole thing, but thanks for the detailed reply. It also gave me food for thought. It's always interesting to find out how other people approach the business of making music.

glad someone read it after i typed a novel
im always happy to discuss things, its a good way of getting ideas too. as you find new ways of doing things, you might not use them all the time, but you might find the odd weird sound fx you want to use here n there or something

you might enjoy this piece (or not, there are some complaints about the highs already )
this was more aiming at layers that worked together and overdubbing
still not much editing but a different approach to these pieces
viewtopic.php?f=14&t=510152

[Urs]

with regards the video idea. this is something ive been considering.

Yay!